Lynch Mob Rising 1.1 - The Vancouver Sun gives voice to Adam Pankratz's Question - "Maybe B.C.'s drug addicts should have to face shame and stigma"

[Landrew]

*Trigger Warning - Smug alert* - the last two paragraphs were esp bad so I posted them after cutting most of the 'article'


Anyone who has driven or walked down East Hastings can tell you that the lax approach to drugs has only created more suffering

Author of the article:
Adam Pankratz, Nimby Grifter [Plagiarized Aaron Gunn for this shit]
Published Feb 06, 2023 • Last updated Feb 07, 2023 • 4 minute read


VANCOUVER — B.C. has decriminalized drug possession of 2.5 grams of cocaine, MDMA, meth and opioids, including heroin.

Those in favour hail it as a victory against stigma, while opponents worry it will have unintended consequences.

We will leave the public policy debate to others, but will ask another very pertinent question: what’s wrong with stigma?

[...]

It seems reasonable to ask if a little bit of good ol’ shame and stigma here wouldn’t help matters. Shame of stealing. Shame of vandalism. Shame of drug use. We don’t value these attributes as a society, so why no stigma? Were my daughter to behave in any of the above described ways, shame would be first on the list, followed immediately by stigma and repentance.


In writing that, I can hear the twitter elect sharpening their blades ready to pounce with murderous relish upon me and my ilk to hurl such opinions in the trash. They would, as it were, seek to shame me to more considerate, empathetic and politically acceptable opinions and behaviours. Shame, it would seem, is actually fine; it’s only the political direction of its application that makes it offensive.

Adam Pankratz: Maybe B.C.'s drug addicts should have to face shame and stigma

Anyone who has driven or walked down East Hastings can tell you that the lax approach to drugs has only created more suffering

vancouversun.com

This is part of a pattern, in particular this is kind of plagiarizing "vancouver is dying", which I will post as Lynch Mob Rising 1.0

I already had a thread last fall but deleted it after I got weed paranaoid from ratting out the cops lol

I find the cops more tolerable than the NIMBYS on this personally, at least they are actually at risk of harm and have to face inconvenience from this. Fuck these kitsalano kry babies with their tiny little minds lying about their own city to cower in terror over false stats.

LIke this Adam Pack Ratz guy talking over me to his political enemy on twitter. Im not as dumb as you make them sound Adam, lol

 

[Burnt Offerings]

What a ridiculous interpretation yeah I’m sure the stigma will really persuade those who nod off in the street or OD in a public toilet, we all know how such people have so much pride and self esteem

 

[Landrew]

In Vancouver even the toilets shame you with hostile architecture from france.

fucking strobe light flashing, imagine trying to IM Naloxelone under a strobe light, then this silly sireen comes on.

Here is one in San Fran

Im guessing shaming also contributes huge to folk throwing needles everywhere, lots of them are actually capped - shows folks care but dont want to get caught dead with them in their pockets ect.

 

[ColoradoOpiateGirl]

Any of y'all parents AND addicts? I've been using drugs and been an alcoholic for over 21 years. I have, fortunately, been able to keep jobs, never gotten a D.U.I or hurt/injured anyone or been homeless. I've stolen from my loved ones, ruined opportunities, O.Ded and ruined relationships and friendships. My parents met in a mental institution while in treatment for schizophrenia. So, I get it.

Fuck yeah, some shame is GOOD. No one wants to try to enjoy a public park with users fucking passed out, people are getting STABBED and shit for refusing panhandlers. Come on now.

People are displaying reprehensible behavior and need to be held accountable for it, period. Harm reduction also means not hurting innocent people who choose not to use.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

Any of y'all parents AND addicts? I've been using drugs and been an alcoholic for over 21 years. I have, fortunately, been able to keep jobs, never gotten a D.U.I or hurt/injured anyone or been homeless. I've stolen from my loved ones, ruined opportunities, O.Ded and ruined relationships and friendships. My parents met in a mental institution while in treatment for schizophrenia. So, I get it.

Fuck yeah, some shame is GOOD. No one wants to try to enjoy a public park with users fucking passed out, people are getting STABBED and shit for refusing panhandlers. Come on now.

People are displaying reprehensible behavior and need to be held accountable for it, period. Harm reduction also means not hurting innocent people who choose not to use.

How do you shame someone who is destitute and visibly intoxicated in a public park?

 

[ColoradoOpiateGirl]

How do you shame someone who is destitute and visibly intoxicated in a public park?

If they can't take of themselves you do the HUMANE thing and physically get them into treatment, run them for warrants. You don't know who these people are, what they're running from. It's out of control, it's unacceptable and NO ONE should be homeless. They are not utilizing the resources available to them. They don't want to deal with their mental illnesses (trauma), sobriety, etc. They want to live that way, on YOUR dime. FUCK that.

 

[ColoradoOpiateGirl]

How do you shame someone who is destitute and visibly intoxicated in a public park?

You like having these young able bodied meth heads approaching you and your young children in parks? It's happened to me several times. It's NOT okay.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

If they can't take of themselves you do the HUMANE thing and physically get them into treatment, run them for warrants. You don't know who these people are, what they're running from. It's out of control, it's unacceptable and NO ONE should be homeless. They are not utilizing the resources available to them. They don't want to deal with their mental illnesses (trauma), sobriety, etc. They want to live that way, on YOUR dime. FUCK that.

Helping someone isn’t the same as shaming someone, though. Making sure that someone who’s in trouble has access to medical treatment isn’t the same as advocating for them being “shamed”

Furthermore, some of the stuff you’re talking about has nothing to do with applying shame or stigma to other people (like people being stabbed or accosted etc) Those are just matters of public safety

 

[Keif' Richards]

The first thing you need to realize is that life is unpredictable. When you see someone homeless, addicted, in an abusive relationship and instead of understanding them, choose to amputate them from humanity by using these labels... you're being arrogant.

There is not one person living in a city park, addicted to Methamphetamine that ever, in a million years believed that they were the type of person to end up in that situation. It's pure folly to look at these people and their lives and assume not only that you're unaffected, but that you never could be.

I know you're coming from a position of annoyance. I'm not going to say that Meth addiction doesn't have a negative impact on your life and mine. But, when we stop trying to understand these people, we lose our own humanity.

I manage a homeless shelter. A part of my job description is keeping Meth addicts away from the clients, stopping them from stealing random shit and of course, dealing with their violence toward one another. Man, sometimes I get so pissed off. I just want these assholes to disappear... to die even. Those are the moments in life when you have a choice. You can choose to put yourself in their shoes or you can demonize them and resent them. It doesn't make you feel any better to hate them, so why not love them?

 

[RUC4]

" never gotten a D.U.I or hurt/injured anyone or been homeless. " -

Saying things like this is dangerous. Wave hi to a DUI soon.

 

[Th3DŕuģsLiķ3M3]

*Trigger Warning - Smug alert* - the last two paragraphs were esp bad so I posted them after cutting most of the 'article'


Anyone who has driven or walked down East Hastings can tell you that the lax approach to drugs has only created more suffering

Author of the article:
Adam Pankratz, Nimby Grifter [Plagiarized Aaron Gunn for this shit]
Published Feb 06, 2023 • Last updated Feb 07, 2023 • 4 minute read


VANCOUVER — B.C. has decriminalized drug possession of 2.5 grams of cocaine, MDMA, meth and opioids, including heroin.

Those in favour hail it as a victory against stigma, while opponents worry it will have unintended consequences.

We will leave the public policy debate to others, but will ask another very pertinent question: what’s wrong with stigma?

[...]

It seems reasonable to ask if a little bit of good ol’ shame and stigma here wouldn’t help matters. Shame of stealing. Shame of vandalism. Shame of drug use. We don’t value these attributes as a society, so why no stigma? Were my daughter to behave in any of the above described ways, shame would be first on the list, followed immediately by stigma and repentance.


In writing that, I can hear the twitter elect sharpening their blades ready to pounce with murderous relish upon me and my ilk to hurl such opinions in the trash. They would, as it were, seek to shame me to more considerate, empathetic and politically acceptable opinions and behaviours. Shame, it would seem, is actually fine; it’s only the political direction of its application that makes it offensive.

Adam Pankratz: Maybe B.C.'s drug addicts should have to face shame and stigma

Anyone who has driven or walked down East Hastings can tell you that the lax approach to drugs has only created more suffering

vancouversun.com

This is part of a pattern, in particular this is kind of plagiarizing "vancouver is dying", which I will post as Lynch Mob Rising 1.0

I already had a thread last fall but deleted it after I got weed paranaoid from ratting out the cops lol

I find the cops more tolerable than the NIMBYS on this personally, at least they are actually at risk of harm and have to face inconvenience from this. Fuck these kitsalano kry babies with their tiny little minds lying about their own city to cower in terror over false stats.

LIke this Adam Pack Ratz guy talking over me to his political enemy on twitter. Im not as dumb as you make them sound Adam, lol

We already experience shame and sigma, regardless whether we should or not. Make an addict feel bad for being an addict their chances of asking for help, getting into recovery drops significantly. Wait until a family member of his loses their M30 roxy scripts and is forced to fill those opioid receptors by any means possible. A different song will be sung then....

 

[Th3DŕuģsLiķ3M3]

The first thing you need to realize is that life is unpredictable. When you see someone homeless, addicted, in an abusive relationship and instead of understanding them, choose to amputate them from humanity by using these labels... you're being arrogant.

There is not one person living in a city park, addicted to Methamphetamine that ever, in a million years believed that they were the type of person to end up in that situation. It's pure folly to look at these people and their lives and assume not only that you're unaffected, but that you never could be.

I know you're coming from a position of annoyance. I'm not going to say that Meth addiction doesn't have a negative impact on your life and mine. But, when we stop trying to understand these people, we lose our own humanity.

I manage a homeless shelter. A part of my job description is keeping Meth addicts away from the clients, stopping them from stealing random shit and of course, dealing with their violence toward one another. Man, sometimes I get so pissed off. I just want these assholes to disappear... to die even. Those are the moments in life when you have a choice. You can choose to put yourself in their shoes or you can demonize them and resent them. It doesn't make you feel any better to hate them, so why not love them?

Very well put, and if you've ever taken the time to talk to a homeless person, you'd find out many of them at one time or another had more materialistic things than you, or most people. Life's circumstances can change so dramatically so quickly it's unnerving. Especially when you have a pandemic, drug epidemic, stupidly unstable economy, and a 25 year long war ending. What a fucking recipe for not having a place to call home.

 

[Landrew]

The Vacancy Rate in Vancouver has been around 1% for about a decade now I think, and price wise its close to NYC for rentals.

That makes the criminalization of camping here all the more frustrating.

I tend to camp over shelters cuz most shelters dont let my sweet Ridley Oval track bike inside..

So then I feel the glare of these nibmys thinking my bike is stolen, when In fact I had 3 bikes stolen from me in 2022,

2 Felt tk2s and a Pake Rum Runner, all bought legit used for total ~ 2500

I get full disabilty and get by ok, just no housing.

 

[Landrew]

" never gotten a D.U.I or hurt/injured anyone or been homeless. " -

Saying things like this is dangerous. Wave hi to a DUI soon.

saying things like this is the new normal lol. I think it is a form of apartheid.

"I am not an animal!"

 

[Landrew]

They are not utilizing the resources available to them. They don't want to deal with their mental illnesses (trauma), sobriety, etc. They want to live that way, on YOUR dime. FUCK that.

VAncouver BC is in Canada btw, your dime has nothing to do with my sweet Ridley or stolen Felts.

Thanks for giving life to my thread by going all empirical, but its ok, Im all about the ending of apartheid and fresh starts.

 

[Keif' Richards]

saying things like this is the new normal lol. I think it is a form of apartheid.

"I am not an animal!"

Thats what I'm getting at.

There was a story in my locale a few years back. A guy was intoxicated and decided he would commit suicide by driving into oncoming traffic on the highway. .

He survived and a family of 4-5 were killed in the accident.

I remember my blood boiling. What an inconsiderate asshole; a monster; someone who should just be tortured to death.

The thing is, I've driven drunk. I've driven a car so high I was passing out at the wheel and swerving back onto the road. I knew I was fucked up, but I just kept driving. I had to be at work after all, so there really was no choice.

I could've easily killed several people. This is just one instance of many.

So whenever I'm not feeling grateful, I turn to this. I'm a lucky bastard to be alive, yes, but I'm even more lucky that my extreme selfishness never led to serious consequences.

The thing is that nearly every person has driven a car after drinking and it's not as if people can judge these things for themselves. To look at a person like this man and think you could never be there, you're wrong.

You always have to put yourself into the other person's shoes. When we stop doing that we lose everything that makes us human.

 

[Landrew]

yeah Im not an animal, Im a monster! I only drove drunk once but I did it to throw a molitov cocktail

thing did not work, not even close, but I didnt kill anyone with and didnt get caught.

It was attempted vandalism not trying to light people on fire lol, not that monstreous I hope

 

[Viraldrome]

We already experience shame and sigma, regardless whether we should or not. Make an addict feel bad for being an addict their chances of asking for help, getting into recovery drops significantly. Wait until a family member of his loses their M30 roxy scripts and is forced to fill those opioid receptors by any means possible. A different song will be sung then....

It's not for you/them, those are lost causes. Stigma is for the next generation. Stigma is a good thing.

NYC had a massive crack problem, as you may remember, and the city had many programs to help crack addicts. They found that over time they served less and less young people, so much so programs were closing down. They decided to ask the young people, what exactly deterred them from crack use. And you know what they said?

"I don't want to be called a crackhead"

Those people who came to their neighborhoods looking for crack were the lowest of the low, calling someone a crackhead was a s bad as insulting your mother. Never mind DARE, or commercials or anything else, the best way to prevent crack use was to have a horrible stigma attached. It works.

OP you live in Van, you see any fucking turbans on DTES? Any Chinese? Why are these two groups, who make up a huge percent of lower mainland population under represented when you see addicts? You think it might have something to do with them not wanting to embarrass their families with the stigma of being an addict?

I encounter people smoking fentanyl on Calgary public transit every day. There is no stigma whatsoever in the addict population of western Canada. You see them doing it malls, in city hall,. they have no shame whatsoever. Bringing it back is a great idea

This person should be shamed smoking drugs and blowing the smoke on kids on the train

 

[SpiralusSancti]

Well maybe it’s also somewhat of a language difference but I don’t think “hard drugs” use isn’t stigmatized at all just about anywhere or is it that different in America?

Here in EU you can see people doing drugs in public but kind of in appropriate places and in appropriate time. Sure some of us with scrambled brainz have tendency to sometimes do inappropriate things but likelihood of getting busted, beat up or worse rises significantly if you’re out of your place and your time-frame. I’ll give example from one Chekoslovakian town. During the day in parks you’ll see and smell weed occasionally and that’s about it. Kind of idyllic looking place, relaxed place, everything but pubs closes before night. And while the night is young things get a bit toned up, more weed, more drunks, slight possibility for trouble, hookers pop up etc. By the time “normal” people are at sleep it seems like not only smoking but selling weed too is legal, prostitutes start approaching people, stumbling around is almost seen more often than walking straight and you don’t get surprised even when you see someone smoking something from a meth pipe. And yeah people know they live in a tow with a lot of drugs and a lot of prostitution but there are lines that 99.999999% people wont cross. Like when some girl approached me and asked for a cigarette and me stupid idiot ask her can she get me some meth and she looks at me like wtf and says that she can get me fun, girls, smoke but no way that shit. And most are like that. Ffs even a pimp I met who tried to set me up some girl even I specified I’m ok with paying for drugs but not sex had some quite high standards compared to what I read here and it turned out I can’t get no heroin until weekend.. Damn I’ll just post it since I wrote it.

Too long;didn’t understand a word – It isn’t a question of shaming off people from drugs it’s a thing of not glorifying that kind of lifestyle. Shame is a personal thing, construct, like morality, trends are another thing...

 

[Landrew]

Well maybe it’s also somewhat of a language difference but I don’t think “hard drugs” use isn’t stigmatized at all just about anywhere or is it that different in America?

[...]

Too long;didn’t understand a word – It isn’t a question of shaming off people from drugs it’s a thing of not glorifying that kind of lifestyle. Shame is a personal thing, construct, like morality, trends are another thing...

Here in Vancouver it is stigmatized if you are poor / esp homeless - People assume you would be a functioning member of society if you just avoid meth / fent whatever - then tend to gaslight you as punishment. Or in the case of our Calgary friend throw a wall of nonsense that is supposed to insult you, lol.

Someone with a good career who develops an addiction will face stigma, but way way less. - unless they lose it all before they get going again.

Nobody is glorifying hard drugs [outside hip hop that isnt really taken seriously,] this stigma backlash is against harm reduction measures and decriminalization