Life after benzos; does it get better?

[Captain.Heroin]

I went to rehab and they had no idea how to handle benzo addiction well IMO. They took my meds away and gave me psych meds and lybrium (not sure on the spelling). The first week was hell. I could not tell the difference from reality and the nightmares I was having. I thought everyone was out to kill me. I didn't trust anyone at rehab and ended up having a major panic attack and going to the hospital twice. To this day I have no idea what really happened that week. I had to have my family help me piece together what happened.

So it's been rough. I had two relapses this summer. Each was just one day of blacking out on benzos. Otherwise I haven't been using daily since February. I feel pretty good. I am able to go to work without the crutch of benzos. It's really nice actually. I've realized the benzos actually increased my stress levels. My anxiety is much better and I'm benzo free. So things are going pretty good. It's just this memory shit really fucks with me.

Give it a year huh? Yea that's what I keep hearing and my shrink tells me. But us addicts aren't patient people lol. I truly hope in the next year or two my memory improves. I don't want to be like this for the rest of my life.

Have you read the Ashton Manual?

You might need a proper supervised taper to "get back to normal". Abrupt cessation of long-term benzo use is not recommended.

You don't have to re-taper, just stay clean and see if the symptoms go away. I'm sorry the place you went to took your meds away inappropriately; I would consider action against them if it's a legal possibility.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I was on benzos for ten years. I took my last benzo 14 Feb 2010. The withdrawal was hell. 6 months after my last benzo it was still getting worse, and I was ready to commit suicide. I could barely function. Having a simple conversation was difficult. I kept repeating myself because I had no memory what-so-ever. I had several grand map seizures during withdrawal, so that could be part of the memory issues, though prior to quitting benzos my memory was not good. However, I stuck it out. Things eventually got better. Life isn't great right now, but it's a whole hell of a lot better than it was, and I can see happiness in my future. I just have to be proactive (hobbies, friends, diet, exercise, etc). Over time, my memory has improved but it is still terrible. I've noticed within the last year that it seems to be improving at a quicker rate, so I am hopeful for the future. my advice to you is to stick it out - it will get better. Until it does, take notes (no being funny, I do it so I don't forget important information - I record everything in my phone so I can quickly refer back).

This is a typical story of someone who doesn't taper on benzos; it gets worse after months, but after years things start to get better.

This is why tapering is so important with benzodiazepines and barbiturates. The GABA-α receptor is very sensitive and is very malleable from long-term benzo use.

 

[Moreaux]

This is a typical story of someone who doesn't taper on benzos; it gets worse after months, but after years things start to get better.

This is why tapering is so important with benzodiazepines and barbiturates. The GABA-α receptor is very sensitive and is very malleable from long-term benzo use.

Definitely. The rehab facility I went to doesn't use a taper for benzos, only anti-seizure meds. They also didn't warn me about what to expect so I had a lot to learn on my own. It was hell but it does get better. Several of my "benzo buddies" from rehab committed suicide within months after getting out of rehab. I didn't start feeling somewhat normal until almost two years after my last benzo, and here at five years later, I still notice I continue to improve.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Facilities that provide treatment that results in a suicide shortly after release should be sued much more often than they actually are.

I think it has mostly to do with the cost of a lawsuit and the fact most people seeking treatment don't have much disposable income (especially after paying for the treatment!). Plus there is some stigma attached to a lawsuit focusing on the death of a loved one who not only was an addict but ended her own life.

But it's fucked, these places need to be held accountable for the consequences of the incredibly sub-par so-called "treatment" they provide, and I'm not even considering the cost here.

It's malpractice, plain and simple. If a psychiatrist's patient committed suicide shortly after treatment ended, they would be open to a malpractice lawsuit that would be pretty much expected. Just pisses me off, so I should just focus on enjoying mindfully eating my dinner.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Definitely. The rehab facility I went to doesn't use a taper for benzos, only anti-seizure meds. They also didn't warn me about what to expect so I had a lot to learn on my own. It was hell but it does get better. Several of my "benzo buddies" from rehab committed suicide within months after getting out of rehab. I didn't start feeling somewhat normal until almost two years after my last benzo, and here at five years later, I still notice I continue to improve.

I'm so sorry to hear they committed suicide, that's so very sad to hear.

 

[manboychef]

I know seriously.....My heart goes out to their families. It is amazing that benzos are the most heavily prescribed anti anxiety medication, and there isn't a lot of research that is used on the back end to ensure people can part ways with it effectiviely.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I know seriously.....My heart goes out to their families. It is amazing that benzos are the most heavily prescribed anti anxiety medication, and there isn't a lot of research that is used on the back end to ensure people can part ways with it effectiviely.

To be honest I think that they have about the same abuse potential as opiates do, it's just that so many more people end up trying these drugs, as well they're so much more socially acceptable as they are mostly prescribed tablets (whereas opiates can be prescribed tablets, or heroin/etc) that it would answer why there's more benzo problems.

Also people think "it's a pill and a doctor gave it to me, so it must be safe." which is dangerous thinking.

I've had no issues using then cessating benzo or alcohol use, but I understand that for other people, it will be exceedingly difficult.

I think the problem is also that benzos are OK for a week or two, or a month, but every doctor I've encountered doesn't mind writing for multiple months on the first prescription. I can handle that, but I can see how easily people who would develop a problem with them could.

 

[manboychef]

all my bottles are 3months

 

[What was it?]

This is a typical story of someone who doesn't taper on benzos; it gets worse after months, but after years things start to get better.

This is why tapering is so important with benzodiazepines and barbiturates. The GABA-α receptor is very sensitive and is very malleable from long-term benzo use.

This has been my experience too. Unfortunately leading to relapse on benzos. I am clean off opiates now again finally. I take Lyrica for my GAD and benzos here and there but will try and cut them out totally come early 2016. Benzos are a long, long road to recovery. Worse than any other drug. I also have a few pentobarbital tablets to knock myself out for sleep when needed. Little known fact these days as nobody uses barbs anymore: They are NOT anxiolitics. They can sedate you but without ridding anxiety. Really weird. This said they are pretty good for insomnia and unless abused you can take them daily for months at small doses without developing dependence (againa a difference compared to benzos). So yes. they are more dangerous in overdose, but therapeutically way better than benzos for insomnia...and SAFER IF not abused.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Damn chef, wish my doc would do three months at a time. Or do you mean he give you a script with two more refills?

I've also found pregabalin to help big time with GAD, not to mention my pain issues AND I don't really crave nicotine or smoking while I'm on Lyrica. Anyone else experience that?

Kinda makes sense cause gabapentin also reduced my drug cravings with opioids and others drugs, same with baclofen, as well as phenibut if only it didn't give me hangovers from hell. Gaba-b agonists rock!

Wait, are pregabalin and gabapentin gabapentin a or b agonists, I forget?

I bet three to six months of taking pregabalin, gabapentin or baclofen, especially baclofen, would help a lot in the case of severe benzo withdrawal. I wonder if anyone has tried this or has any second hand experience of using such drugs to manage the long term side effects of benzo withdrawal. I wouldn't want to take any of those meds for a year or more given their own potential for dependence, even if it's not nearly as bad as kicking a potent benzo like alprazolam or clonazepam.

 

[manboychef]

actually they are refillable very ten days. Its weird. In order to get my insurance to cover it, I get thirty every ten days with three refills. Then I have to make an appointment. It is mind boggling the stash I have because at first I wasn't taking most of them.

The temazepam I get 30 every 30 days. with 3 refills.

down to 7mg a day. It is rough going but I am strong. I know that I can break them all down into .5mg and just take one when I feel bad and then I can just take another .5 off each week. When I get down to 2mg I am going to take it down .25mg every two weeks.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I really empathize with your chef. You're really doing great with this, it really impresses me you (well, anyone in your situation really) is able to work on and accomplish what you've set yourself out to do. That is so weird to me about your refills.

I'd be fucked with that, lol, I'd be a zombie with the munchies for like a week and all the pills would be gone that's a big part of what I'm happy I don't take temazepam anymore.

I mean, I rarely misuse it because it really helped reduce my anxiety/agitation at night and help me sleep, but it was super enjoyable to use it recreationally. But I never want to be in a situation where I have to wean myself off benzos or any gabaergic drug. It's hard enough for me with the opioids, I don't need another habit, you know?

 

[What was it?]

Damn chef, wish my doc would do three months at a time. Or do you mean he give you a script with two more refills?

I've also found pregabalin to help big time with GAD, not to mention my pain issues AND I don't really crave nicotine or smoking while I'm on Lyrica. Anyone else experience that?

Kinda makes sense cause gabapentin also reduced my drug cravings with opioids and others drugs, same with baclofen, as well as phenibut if only it didn't give me hangovers from hell. Gaba-b agonists rock!

Wait, are pregabalin and gabapentin gabapentin a or b agonists, I forget?

I bet three to six months of taking pregabalin, gabapentin or baclofen, especially baclofen, would help a lot in the case of severe benzo withdrawal. I wonder if anyone has tried this or has any second hand experience of using such drugs to manage the long term side effects of benzo withdrawal. I wouldn't want to take any of those meds for a year or more given their own potential for dependence, even if it's not nearly as bad as kicking a potent benzo like alprazolam or clonazepam.

According to Pfizer Gabpentin and Pregabalin are neither GABA-A nor GABA-B Agonists. They work in a weird other way but calm the brain so that would help with benzo withdrawal. Large doses also help with opiate withdrawal.

 

[manboychef]

I really empathize with your chef. You're really doing great with this, it really impresses me you (well, anyone in your situation really) is able to work on and accomplish what you've set yourself out to do. That is so weird to me about your refills.

I'd be fucked with that, lol, I'd be a zombie with the munchies for like a week and all the pills would be gone that's a big part of what I'm happy I don't take temazepam anymore.

I mean, I rarely misuse it because it really helped reduce my anxiety/agitation at night and help me sleep, but it was super enjoyable to use it recreationally. But I never want to be in a situation where I have to wean myself off benzos or any gabaergic drug. It's hard enough for me with the opioids, I don't need another habit, you know?

yeah this is murder on the whole brain thing. I know right when the temazepam has left my system cos I my brain stops working right. Yes it is very recreational....but I had a choice to make. Two or three days of insane action...or being sleep all month.

 

[Jabberwocky]

He'll yea, and as far as I'm concerned if I was in your shoes that choice would be a no Brainerd - I'd continue taking temazepam! I'm my case however I was getting a little concerned about it mostly because I was beginning to see myself, especially at this them on year, start fantasizing about using then recreationally more often than was a good idea.

I will actually probably go back to it because it's the best thing, really the only thing, that has worked well for my insomnia (well either that or diazepam, but temazepam works a bit better everything considered). But thats gonna be a bit down the road, like when I start experiencing significant withdrawal symptoms from tapering off methadone. I'd rather wait and keep temazepam as an effective potent sleep aid than get more tolerant to it than I already was. But this is all my situation, my luxury; )

And that's interesting pregabalin and gabapentin aren't gaba a or b agonists. I'll have to look more into their pharmacology because it sounds interesting.

I most definitely did know they can make a big different with opioid withdrawal, as well as nicotine withdrawal and cravings. Not everyone need high doses for that though, well at least those not already tolerant to similar drugs or has taken any gabapentin before for any significant amount of time. Pregabalin works pretty well at moderate doses for most straight opioid dependent people I've known who have had it in their arsenal.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

And that's interesting pregabalin and gabapentin aren't gaba a or b agonists. I'll have to look more into their pharmacology because it sounds interesting.

Gabapentin was initially synthesized to mimic the chemical structure of the neurotransmitter gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), but is believed to act on different brain receptors.

Some of its activity may involve interaction with voltage-gated calcium channels. Gabapentin binds to the α2δ subunit (1 and 2) and has been found to reduce calcium currents after chronic but not acute application via an effect on trafficking[48] of voltage-dependent calcium channels in the central nervous system.[49] Another possible mechanism of action is that gabapentin halts the formation of new synapses.[50]

and...

The mechanism of the anticonvulsant action of gabapentin has not been fully described. Though similar in structure to the endogenous neurotransmitter GABA, gabapentin has not been shown to bind to GABA receptors at concentrations at or below 1 mM.[51] Gabapentin modulates the action of glutamate decarboxylase (GAD) and branched chain aminotransferase (BCAT), two enzymes involved in GABA biosynthesis. In human and rat studies, gabapentin was found to increase GABA biosynthesis, and to increase non-synaptic GABA neurotransmission in vitro.[52]

Gabapentin (0.01-100 µM) has not been shown to interact with the sodium or L-type calcium ion channels targeted by the conventional anticonvulsant drugs phenytoin, carbamazepine and sodium valproate. Other neurophysiological findings indicate that gabapentin does not interact with glutamate, glycine, or NMDA receptors, further distinguishing its anticonvulsant mechanism from that of common antiepileptic medications.[51]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabapentin

 

[Jabberwocky]

Yea I got the GABA part of GABApentin and preGABAlin. Somehow I'm sure someone has written those drug names that way on BL :D

Thank you for the quote though. I wonder if its effects related to the "interaction with voltage-gated calcium channels" as I feel pretty confident other substances I have responded really well to, that have been a significant positive influence on my recovery/life have related effects (although unfortunately these same substances are very poorly understood at the moment - DXM/ketamine related to their effects on opioid withdrawal, tolerance and cravings, as well as iboga and constituent elements).

 

[manboychef]

^^^Yeah I do think one trip a year is actually a good thing in recovery. I don't personally look at it as a drug of abuse. I would want it in a clinical setting though with a therapist that is trained in this field directing me through the trip.

 

[Jabberwocky]

In that kind of setting is so instrumental! I have a friend of mine who is a psychothereapist, and pretty good at his job, and he's into using the SAM protocol with Iboga and totally sees and has even experienced th potential himself. So anyways he basically will trip sit for me but wearing his psychologists hat for it.

It's important how much you dose because it its too high I've been unable to really communicate or get anything out of his formal theraputic presence, but when dosed properly so I can it's been pretty useful.

Getting trained in the SAM protocols and the administration and use of Iboga. Very useful and applicable to every other ethnogen I've used therapeutically (muschrooms, 2c-i, 2c-b; especially useful for me and my issues arr MDMA, DXM, ketamine, PCP, LSD, ibogaine, and Iboga full alkaloid extract; please note these are in no particular order).

 

[blueshoe]

Thank you! I've been taking it less and less, so I think I'll be ok using it only in desperate times when I have to sleep for work or something (I operate machinery so it's dangerous to not sleep). I meant either or both addiction / dependency I guess.