(i've seen threads on it before) but Can we talk about psychedelics and age

[BenzosBudOrBooty]

How does age affect psychedelic use? If you start later are you better able to handle it? Like say you start at 50 instead of 40 (hypothetically). Or is it just waiting until your brain is fully developed at around 25-28???? I feel your ego gets stronger as you get older, and psychosis and depersonalization is caused somewhat by the ego-loss, so if you have a stronger ego, you're less likely to become psychotic or depersonalized. That said, ego-softening is what we aim for.

I feel there were great writers in 60's who were already 30-35 when LSD was introduced. Albert Hoffman a great example, started psychedelic use at a later age. Alduous Huxley, Timothy Leary, weren't too young I believe.

The greatest rock and roll singers weren't 16 when they started their psychedelic use...Jim Morrison/Jimi Hendrix must have been 18+ when he first used LSD given that it wasn't really available until they were that age.

Aside from few exceptions, you see many 16 year olds who use psychedelics these days becoming burnouts. I see kids progressing from LSD to cocaine/opiates. They get bored with acid.

I haven't done drugs in a year after a bad mushrooms trip at 23 and feel if I took them now I'd handle it astronomically better. Sobriety has taught me many things and during a crucial brain development year. I'd be smarter about it now. I first used psychs at 19 and handled them decently well until I had a really bad unfortunate trip.

What are your thoughts about psychedelics and age. Just throwing some ideas out there. ???!!!:D

 

[Kl519]

I've used psychs since I was 18. Lsd was my first hardcore substance.

I'm 30 now. Ego-wise, I'd like to think I'm more humble and mature as I grew older. Psychs definitely gave me different perspectives about life (aka everything) that I probably wouldn't have gotten otherwise. Especially about myself and my own shortcomings. It made me realize what a fool I use to be, and why I took certain things in my life for granted. This helped me get through any sort of depression because I realized every day I wake up, this new day is an opportunity to get better and be better. Most things are never lost when you still have a future in which almost anything is possible.

That's all I have to say.

 

[ecstacylover]

Aside from few exceptions, you see many 16 year olds who use psychedelics these days becoming burnouts. I see kids progressing from LSD to cocaine/opiates. They get bored with acid.

Your blanket statement aside, age is just a number. Maturity is not quantifiable, neither is the ability to handle psychedelics. So how well you handle tripping later in life is not indicative of someone else at that point.

I feel your ego gets stronger as you get older, and psychosis and depersonalization is caused somewhat by the ego-loss, so if you have a stronger ego, you're less likely to become psychotic or depersonalized. That said, ego-softening is what we aim for.

The ego fights the trip because it does not want to let go of worldly things. So stronger the ego, the more trouble letting go - which is necessary on high doses of strong psychedelics. Fighting it will cause psychosis and depersonalization, and the ego fights it so I would argue you are wrong. That said, ego is necessary to live day-to-day life so we must find a balance, or ego-softening as you referred to.

 

[BenzosBudOrBooty]

Your blanket statement aside, age is just a number. Maturity is not quantifiable, neither is the ability to handle psychedelics. So how well you handle tripping later in life is not indicative of someone else at that point.

Yeah I apologize, that was somewhat of a blanket statement. Many "addicts" will experiment with psychedelics at a young age. Then move to harder drugs, just because it's the trend. Then there's psychonauts who start at age 16 or age 14....who stick to being psychonauts. Although I think that's rarer than those who start at age 18+.

I just know too many heroin addicts who were like "Shrooms and acid and weed is gay!"...in those words. "I did those when I was 16 and it sucked everytime!" Then they happen to be a heroin user.

And I don't think age is just a number, your brain develops until your 25-28, and your life experiences develop as you get older and older.

I must say I disagree with your post.

Although I do think there is leeway for exceptions and no exact quantifiable age for when you should do these drugs but rather on the individual. Thanks for your response though.

 

[Kl519]

Hmm, if you create a system or a set of instances that people generally consider what is mature or not, in a way it is quantifiable. That's also kind of how this world defines maturity, but yes it is subjective for sure.

Does this person cry when he doesn't get his X? X=candy, ps4, laptop, etc.

Does this person skip studying for his midterms to go out and watch a movie?

Does this person take the high road and take responsibility, even though it can be argued that it isn't really his fault?

Hundreds and even thousands of these examples measure a person's maturity level. Basically, what does a person choose to do in certain situations that specifically defines their character?

Imo that's the basis for measuring a person's maturity level. But one needs to know the other well enough to encounter many of these instances to really be able to tell how mature he or she is.

 

[ecstacylover]

I just know too many heroin addicts who were like "Shrooms and acid and weed is gay!"...in those words. "I did those when I was 16 and it sucked everytime!" Then they happen to be a heroin user.

to be fair we probably live in different parts of the country/world with different social norms, but I don't see what your point is with this. Yes , I agree opiate lovers tend to dislike psychedelics. Idk maybe it's has to do with the lower iq and wanting to get without giving mentality of its user group, since we're making generalizations ...

And I agree one shouldn't abuse drugs while their brain is still developing. Especially drugs such as mdma, dxm, alcohol, cannabis, opiates, nicotine which can stunt brain development or cause dependence - which 5-ht agonists do neither of. So if you're warning people about starting psychs too early, perhaps you should campaign against the far more popular and dangerous drugs first.

And Kl519, I mean quantifiable in a sense that could be used to give his statement statistical significance, in that sense it is certainly not quantifiable.

 

[Kl519]

Hmm, fair enough. It seems that we have different points on the subject, because that's certainly true from that point of view.

Carry on thread.

 

[SixBuckets]

I don't think it makes a difference in terms of whether you'll have a good time or freak out - I think that comes down more to mindset and experience.

The big risk of 16 year olds doing psychedelics (or other drugs) is that many severe mental illnesses have an average age of onset between 18 - 25. Basically, if you're already high risk (or to be more dramatic, if you're already on the path towards developing a mental illness in your early twenties), teen drug use can act as a trigger that 'brings on' that mental illness. Waiting until your brain is fully developed at least gives you a better guess at whether you're at risk of mental illness or not. Although you can never be sure.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

I know a lot of people that took psychedelics as teenagers & none of them burned out, developed mental illness, got addicted to hard drugs or anything like that, they're all fairly successful now. My best trips were when I was under 18. There is no evidence that psychedelics can cause mental illness, there is evidence that psychedelics might protect against mental illness.

Using data from more than 190,000 respondents of the National Survey on Drug Use and Health from 2008-2012, the researchers found that those who reported ever having used a classic psychedelic drug in their lifetime had a decreased likelihood of psychological distress in the past month, and decreased suicidal thinking, planning and attempts in the past year.

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-01-classic-psychedelic-regard-psychological-distress.html

 

[Mudshark]

I have been using psychedelics since 1972 - and am 58 now ....
I believe they have been beneficial for me , but tend to [ high ] dose only every 2 - 3 months or so in a peaceful environment ....
I have found them to be wonderful aids to meditation , and the quiet contemplation of life , and also fun to do ...

I have never regretted taking them , nor noticed any psychological problems from psychedelic use .

 

[helpfulvibes]

I started tripping at 16 and got really into it. Turned hippy and did a full fucking 180 from my conservative bs personality of old. Personally I recommend people start when they are "ready" which is to say if one is afraid of it, they shouldn't go there yet, have to let the ego burn hot for your young soul. I think 20 is probably prime, but yeah its different for everyone. Its been three years for me since dosing first and I know i'm still super young, but to answer your question, i think it can be both good and bad, has for me. That first time was like being handed the fucking peach of gold, i thought i'd gotten IT and started waging war on all sorts of useless bullshit that had been holding me down, which made me a better, smarter, happier and friendlier person. Maturity happened because of acid.

On the flip side I started tripping all the time made me delusional and hedonistic to a dangerous degree for a while, but there was a girl involved so i was blinded by powerful pussy and powerful drugs, dangerous combo, keep the pussy out of the drugs and vice versa for the most part hah unless you want a fast track to insanity. I haven't been completely sober for more than a few weeks for the past two years. Don't let me be misunderstood though, I'm healthy and happy and smart, I just like drugs, a lot, psychs especially and it happened because I had money, the friends, the lax parents and a passion for music which sort of egged on my use further, a la live fast die young mentality. Looking at it now I've made some bad decisions but I don't regret them and thank fucking heaven that I've had the kind of security of life in order to do things like I've done having a blast while getting an education as well.

In all honesty I echo whats been said before, you've got to be ready to be changed and float with that fact, but if you don't have a great home life or the money to buy drugs and the friends that endorse it, then likely you won't be fucking up in the future with powerful substances. But if its the perfect storm you might find yourself always on drugs (not psychs, fuck that). I will always be a psychonaut though I think where my envelope pushing and irish genes will lead me is probably not a great place to be, might need to nip it in the bud. Was this due to the fact that I started tripping early? No, I just had a perfect storm of nihilist hedonism and grandiose thinking to push way out there. But in short it, depends on the person and their situation and genes, I think 18 should be the earliest really though, 20 probably being prime. But you know what, It's never too late to trip! Wholly believe that one.

I've never gotten bored of acid for the record.

 

[AA357]

How does age affect psychedelic use? If you start later are you better able to handle it? Like say you start at 50 instead of 40 (hypothetically). Or is it just waiting until your brain is fully developed at around 25-28????

I think you might be onto something here.
Adolescence can be an uncertain, confusing and stressful time in life. The mind and brain are still developing so it's entirely possible that teenagers have a higher risk of developing psychological/developmental problems from using psychedelics.
Here's an example: In healthy adults, cannabis is quite a benign drug. Any brain damage/cognitive impairment resulting from heavy use as an adult is generally temporary and reversible.
In adolescents however, cannabis can have devastating and permanent effects. I know cannabis is different from LSD and mushrooms but it just goes to show how much more fragile you are at that age.

I would say the key to being able to handle psychedelics is self-acceptance. When you're happy with who you are as a person and don't have any demons then the chances of having a bad trip are significantly lower.

 

[One Thousand Words]

Giving psychedelics to a 16 year old is like giving them a super model to fuck. 16 year olds were a dud fuck even when I was 16. Sure they know the mechanics of how to do it, but no matter how inflated their ego is, nothing replaces experience.

Tripping when you are a teenager may have the benefit of opening the mind to a whole new mindset and may seem at first a blessing, but reality is the insights you may receive once you have lived a little for me brings a whole new level of enjoyment. I'm not saying teenagers won't enjoy psychedelics, or even damage their brain irreversibly, however there is a big difference to tripping with a purpose compared to tripping for shits and giggles. At the same time I'm not expecting anyone under the age of 20 to accept and understand this, just as every young person thinks they know better since the dawn of time. In twenty years time most of you will look at this post and nod though.

I believe that the human brain only has a finite amount of drug experiences at its disposal. For some people this might be 20, for others it might be hundreds. Some drugs drain this reserve faster than other drugs. Call it losing the magic if you must, but I find that those of my friends who dived in too quickly when they were a teenager, gave up early in their twenties. (Some burnt out completely and never came back to reality too ) Personally I'd prefer to dabble a little throughout my life, choosing to use my finite pool of drug lust across many ages.

Tripping at twenty is about freedom of no responsibilities, tripping at thirty allows me to reflect and appreciate my kids, tripping at forty on the back of my yacht surrounded by wonderful friends gives me another prospective all together. Who knows what joy tripping at 60 surrounded by grandchildren will deliver me? To achieve this I have to be patient, I have to not be greedy and gulp from the chalice. Unfortunately it is difficult to tell a teenager to only sip.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

I don't know what you're on about, psychedelic shits & giggles are really fun. LSD at 16 was an amazing experience, mushrooms at 14 were good too, was just pure giggly fun. Actually I didn't learn to appreciate the psychedelic comeup shit until later, was in my 20s before that started being so enjoyable, was all about giggles as a teen. I know a few people that went mad in their 20s, none of them ever took psychedelics, psychedelics causing psychosis is a drug war myth, busted by doing the slightest bit of research... http://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-psychedelics-and-psychosis-1.16968

 

[Auranova]

^ ^ I really like Onethousandwords post although I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with tripping for shits and giggles. But as an older user I would say I get much more out of tripping than when I was younger. Maturity has provided me with the ability to put responsible boundaries on my use, minimize the likelihood of a bad trip and leverage my life experience in ways I could not have when I was younger.

 

[One Thousand Words]

I don't know what you're on about, psychedelic shits & giggles are really fun. LSD at 16 was an amazing experience, mushrooms at 14 were good too, was just pure giggly fun. Actually I didn't learn to appreciate the psychedelic comeup shit until later, was in my 20s before that started being so enjoyable, was all about giggles as a teen. I know a few people that went mad in their 20s, none of them ever took psychedelics, psychedelics causing psychosis is a drug war myth, busted by doing the slightest bit of research... http://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-psychedelics-and-psychosis-1.16968

I doubt you have known even a fraction of the people I have who trip. That's not meant to be dick sizing, just honesty. Unfortunately some people do lose their shit irreversibly after abusing psychedelics. You might argue they were predisposed to mental issues but from my experience it definitely did them more harm than if they did not discover these drugs from such a young age.

I'm not against tripping for shits and giggles, in fact I get annoyed with people who suck the fun out of drug use with spiritual mumbo jumbo. There is a place for connecting your soul with psychedelics, but first and foremost drugs for me should be fun. When your life becomes one endless stream of posts in the Dark side them I believe it is time to walk away from using mind altering substances. The sad thing is more of my friends who started young face more struggles today than those of us who showed restraint.

At 16 there are so many more important things to concentrate on that using drugs. Getting blasted from time to time is no big deal, but don't kid yourself that you grow into a better adult if you decide to head down this road. Often education gets side tracked, relationships with parents get strained, even social growth is stunted by committing to this sort of life style. Of course this is a generalisation, and I'm sure there are one or two teenage psychonauts who succeeded in life that buck the trend. However I can only speak from those I have known in my life.

 

[just say know]

i first used LSA while 16; it's harder to put into words and harder to integrate at that age: simply its easier to process when your brain is more developed In My Opinion.

but on the plus side; it really helped theraputically/medicinally with Avoidant Personality Disorder and PTSD (which is cured as a result of LSA use; or at least i attribute LSA to seriously helping with my PTSD experience. i developed PTSD as a result of a long-term period of Psychological and Emotional abuse and hygeinical neglect as well as the witnessing and stopping of my mother attempting suicide).

i think i would report a decreased thoughts of suicide in myself/being able to experience an extremely posative influence on my life that re-shaped the way my traumatized brain viewed life. it helped me emotionally, psychologically, and mentally come to terms with Four years of "invisible abuse" that caused suicidal thoughts, low self of steam, anxiety, social anxiety, skittishness, and fear of people. the empathogenic qualites especially helped aid in fear of people and social anxiety while entactogenesis aided in evaluating the past, skittishness, low self of steam, and healing from mental, emotional, and psychological injury.

all in all i wouldn't take it back; i'm glad i used LSA at the age of 16 but only because it was theraputic. i think that it would have been EVEN MORE beneficial had i been able to have a program to help integrate it and to help further the healing; as well as a more healthy social environment.

 

[Samulson]

In my 20's I used psychedelics for fun, for the wonder of it, and for partying.
In my 50's I use psychedelics for fun, for the wonder of it, and for shamanistic journeys.