"If Jews were the first people how did we come from Africa?"

[Gormur]

Note the quotations in the title. I grew up indoctrinated in Christianity and never learned about an origin theory in Africa or about Evolution. I've recently read about this idea that humans originate in Africa but don't understand what it means. Hopefully somebody can fill me in on where this concept comes from and if there's a scientific basis for it

I don't mind accepting that Jews were the first people to inhabit the earth as I don't know any different based on archaeology, but maybe DNA says something I'm not aware of.. or something along those lines

I don't really have a slant on this in either direction. I just think it's interesting and want to know where these ideas come from. For all I care humans were formed out of dust (as the Bible describes) and that makes sense to me more than saying we came out of Africa or from an animal but maybe that's based on what I've heard and I may not have the full story

Cheers

 

[MydriHaze]

I rather think that human beings like any other species comes from diasporas

 

[Cheshire_Kat]

The Jews were not the first humans.

Even if you take the Bible as telling the true story you will read that the Nation of Israel and the Jews did not exist until Abraham. The story of the Jews started with Abraham, not Adam and Eve.

 

[JessFR]

The Jews were not the first humans.

Even if you take the Bible as telling the true story you will read that the Nation of Israel and the Jews did not exist until Abraham. The story of the Jews started with Abraham, not Adam and Eve.

Bingo. Until God confounds the languages we were all one people, if you believe the Bible.

 

[MydriHaze]

This remind me of a "documentary" in cartoon format that i saw for like 5min top, this was just too crazy, they were talking that the jews were an alien race and that the pyramids were their spaceship parked underground, waiting to air up...

 

[JessFR]

Soo, where does that leave the egyptions?

I suppose Moses staff is also alien tech then..

 

[dalpat077]

The Jews were not the first humans.

Even if you take the Bible as telling the true story you will read that the Nation of Israel and the Jews did not exist until Abraham. The story of the Jews started with Abraham, not Adam and Eve.

This is the correct answer in my humble opinion (but nevertheless based on more than just a cursory interest and more than just a little research, with my own applied logic, on the topic).

People seem to discount the fact that organized religion isn't that old at all in the bigger scheme of things. Matter of fact: some Creationists believe the earth itself is only a few thousand years old (conveniently). Science tells us otherwise and by an absolutely huge margin to boot.

And so far as I know or have come to understand: even the books of the Bible were not first hand accounts i.e. they came hundreds of years after the events described and depicted.

I'm not up to arguing with anybody about this shit i.e. believe what you want.

But I'll say this: assuming I'm even partly correct in my assumptions and interpretation then it does beg the question as to why all of this shit that's going on and has been going on for centuries.

Anyway. I realize this is Wikipedia (on the link below). But I'm told that because of the way it's moderated it's pretty reliable (Wikipedia I mean). I only mention this because I'd never been arsed to fact check Wikipedia until I found one or two articles recently and that made me question the same (although to their credit: both articles drew attention to the fact that the said content was lacking in citations and possible accuracy and was in need of possible correction).


There's some further interesting links at the bottom of the page (preceding the citations and references).

List of first human settlements - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And this is just "man" that we're talking about i.e. there's fossil evidence dating back thousands of millions of years back insofar as animals and "life" is concerned.

Scotland’s fossils – Scotland – the home of geology

www.scottishgeology.com

How far back do you wish to go:

Billion-year-old fossil found in Scotland unlocks secrets of Earth's earliest life forms

Researchers say the earliest forms of life on Earth may have developed in freshwater, rather than the ocean.

news.sky.com

I mention the two latter just off of the top of my head i.e. that billion year old fossil was found just recently hence Scotland being mentioned at this time.

So in short: the Jewish people were not the first people. As much as they'd like to believe, and have others believe, that they were and are the chosen race.

And for the record: this not coming from an anti-Semite per se. But this shit in Palestine is testing my patience and resolve. And in more ways than one.

 

[TripSitterNZ]

I believe we fell out of heaven and appeared in the middle east.

 

[MydriHaze]

Soo, where does that leave the egyptions?

I suppose Moses staff is also alien tech then..

In the frontline of the palestinian diaspora for now...

Moses was probably just a freemason with maybe a master or a vénérable connection who knew an alien émissaire but trust me, the ones in the spotlight can't manipulate in the shadows...

 

[JessFR]

I believe that it's more likely that rational thought and deductive reasoning about the observations of the world around us built in countless manhours is a lot more likely to be correct than that it's all a bunch of satanic deceptions.

Hell even if you take the Bible as generally true. God's a total asshole.

Abraham and Issac, job, lot and the angels, Noah and the flood, the tree of knowledge.

Hell probably cain too, sure seems like he might have also been set up to fail. God likes to fuck with people for his petty amusement and there's nothing more old testament biblical than that.

 

[dalpat077]

I believe we fell out of heaven and appeared in the middle east.

Well fuck me. If that be the case: somebody or someone fucked up bad. I can think of 101 other places that'd have been a more suitable and fun choice! Unless it had some redeeming factors and qualities back then that it no longer has now that is.

I know for sure as fuck: I'd rather be fighting over Coca plantations! That would at least make sense!

 

[JessFR]

Well fuck me. If that be the case: somebody or someone fucked up bad. I can think of 101 other places that'd have been a more suitable and fun choice! Unless it had some redeeming factors and qualities back then that it no longer has now that is.

I know for sure as fuck: I'd rather be fighting over Coca plantations! That would at least make sense!

If you believe God is petty and sets people up to fail (actually probably the angels too), it helps everything make so much more sense.

 

[Gormur]

The Jews were not the first humans.

Even if you take the Bible as telling the true story you will read that the Nation of Israel and the Jews did not exist until Abraham. The story of the Jews started with Abraham, not Adam and Eve.

Indeed. I didn't know how to word Jews but could've said the tribes that persisted before Abraham. Not that we know that but we do know, based on DNA (I guess science) that Jews are a people with unique genetic markers

As to knowing the earth is this or that many years old seems odd to me if only because I'm not a scientist and don't understand the reliability of carbon dating etc. It does however seem to take a degree of faith to accept these ideas either way so maybe nobody can answer this question for me. EDIT: Also I'm curious about the out of Africa idea/theory and where it comes from

 

[dalpat077]

Also I'm curious about the out of Africa idea/theory and where it comes from

I’m no expert on these matters. But logic dictates that the idea/theory is based on fossils found and carbon dated.

Unfortunately it does take faith in the accuracy of carbon dating (I’ve seen it being supposedly scientifically questioned before though too but who the hell knows).

And of course: until every last inch of the planet has been inspected then it surely can only be an assumption based on the latest find. In just the past few years we’ve gone from thinking that the earliest proof was just up the drag from me (literally) to Morocco (arguably still Africa though). Who is to say they don’t find something older in the Arctic some day? Maybe the dudes starting walking upright there first, decided fuck this it’s getting cold here, and moved somewhere warmer!

 

[cosmic charlie]

I know for a fact that we decended from primates and slowly evolved as a species over millenia and that it's a continuing process. If we are still around a million years from now I'd hardly think we would still look the same. And I know this because "We are All One" and if you travel far enough back we were at one time a a tribe in Africa and then a series of them, and we had dark skin. I know this as truth because I have seen it and the creation of our Universe itself and the formation of galaxies in these time lapsed sort of mental imagery shown to me by the life force that created us, that lies within all things human, animals, bacteria and plants. Don't know if you could even call it a he or male because the one the created us is an entity that is omnipotent and all powerful. I have seen it in one of its forms and it was one of the most beautiful things I ever witnessed. You may think im crazy but if you been the places I have on high dose combinations of psychedelics and dissociatives you would know that it's all true. The Bible is a human construction and our story is much much older than that. Sure some things in there may have happened but a large amount of it is metaphor. The world is ancient and the time scales in which our Universe operates our hard for our brains to conceptualize. The story of our world goes all the way back to single called organisms and they branched out and evolved, I have literally seen this happen on a past journey that changed me and mybelief system to its core.

 

[MydriHaze]

We descended from cyanobacteria for starting. Life is just the result of the arborescent evolution wich followed, and which survive to at least 4 mass extinctions, mass extinctions that going to continue as we are across the end of the 5th by our own hands. There's theories that after this one this gonna be some kind of insects who will find themselves at the top of the foodchain. Hive spirit!

 

[dalpat077]

Well interestingly enough I just noticed one of the many threads that @mr peabody goes to great lengths to maintain. The timing being ironic.

DNA analysis on cave shit and blood (from his Anthropology thread) (most recent post at the end of the thread).

The African idea/theme still alive and kicking. But who knows what the future holds.

ANTHROPOLOGY | +40 articles

A female hunter who may have killed big-game animals in the Andes 9,000 years ago. Native Americans used psychedelic plants and painted rock art, study finds by Katie Hunt | CNN | 23 Nov 2020 The first clear evidence that Native Americans consumed psychedelic plants at rock art sites has been...

www.bluelight.org

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

This remind me of a "documentary" in cartoon format that i saw for like 5min top, this was just too crazy, they were talking that the jews were an alien race and that the pyramids were their spaceship parked underground, waiting to air up...

Was that cartoon or animation made by the Nation of Islam, Nation of gods and earths, 5% nation, or the cult of Scientology?

 

[MydriHaze]

I probably saw that on the news, couldn't tell its been years...

 

[Burnt Offerings]

As to knowing the earth is this or that many years old seems odd to me if only because I'm not a scientist and don't understand the reliability of carbon dating etc. It does however seem to take a degree of faith to accept these ideas either way so maybe nobody can answer this question for me. EDIT: Also I'm curious about the out of Africa idea/theory and where it comes from

Radiocarbon dating is only reliable so far back, I think the limit is around 30,000 years iirc. After that period of time the carbon 14 gets depleted and researchers can only say, "it's older than [the limit]", but wouldn't be able to give anything approaching an exact figure of how old a particular fossil is.

It's also only useful for objects with a biologic origin...for example, artifacts made of stone cannot be radiocarbon dated.

For very old fossils different methods would have to be used, for example potassium-argon dating (i.e. how the famous fossil specimen of Paranthropus Boisei was dated) or correlating the fossils with the geologic stratum it was found in, or correlating the fossils with nearby assemblages of extinct animals to get a relative date, etc...

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Africa is the homeland for our species. This idea goes back to Charles Darwin (at least). We evolved in Africa and fully-modern Homo Sapiens left the African continent to colonize the planet less than 100,000 years ago*. There's a substantial body of evidence to support this conclusion based on both genetic and archeological evidence.

*There's evidence of human habitation in what we now know as Israel more than 100,000 years ago, but there's no evidence (that I'm aware of) that these humans spread further than the Near East. There's also an older theory which maintains that a much more ancient dispersal of hominids from Africa seeded the "old world" (Africa, Asia and Europe) with humans, who then evolved into modern humans in their respective continents: Neanderthals in Europe, Homo Erectus in Asia, and Homo Rhodesienses in Africa. This was somewhat popular before the advent of genetic evidence but has since lost influence in favor of the "recent African origin" theory put forth by Chris Stringer and others, which asserts that all humans alive today are the result of a dispersal out of Africa which occurred less than 100,000 years ago, which subsequently displaced all older populations of "archaic humans".