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I think I may have HPPD?

MindFreak

Greenlighter
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
2
So recently I discovered the disorder known as HPPD or Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder; After reading the symptoms online I think I may have this. One symptom I experience for example is if I happen to look at a ceiling, wall, floor, or another static surface like that I notice it will shift around, similar to a shroom trip. Another symptom I have experienced is a sort of visual static in areas that are very dark. These seems to be my only symptoms but they occurred only after taking shrooms for the first time. While these effect is kinda cool, it does freak me out a bit. Is this something that will stick with me the rest of my life? Is there away to test to find out for sure if I have HPPD? Is there currently any treatment for this disorder? Thank you! :)
 
Hey buddy, welcome to Bluelight!

First and foremost, you should try not to stress over it too much or even focus on it. Try to pretend it isn't there, and don't go 'looking' for the symptoms.

Secondly, you should do your best to abstain from all psychoactive substances, including cannabis, and to a lesser extent alcohol and tobacco. You want to let your mind return to a baseline/unaltered state and remain there for a while. Symptoms will go away eventually...hell, once day you may just wake up and they're goooooone :)

Also plenty of rest, good food, exercise if possible. The food and exercise aren't quite as 'necessary' as when you've overdone something like MDMA, but you'll sort yourself out much quicker the healthier you try to live :)

It's extremely unlikely any of your symptoms will persist for very long, given they're very mild and triggered from a single mushroom trip.

FWIW, I notice similar visual disturbances throughout my daily life. I know it's not HPPD given the unfortunate infrequency I get to trip (like every 6 months lol), so I just ignore it.

A suggestion I've read somewhere that I somewhat agree with is that these minor disturbances have always been there; it's just once you've had a psychedelic trip and experienced OEVs/distortions, you simply notice them more when sober.
 
but they occurred only after taking shrooms for the first time

How confident are you in saying that? I know that "HHPD type" effects are actually observable in, for instance, children of elementary school age. Optical illusions worked on me, at least at that age, and what child hasn't rubbed his or her eyes until they see a shimmering fractal curtain of phosphenes at least once (against their mother's wishes)?

It's very likely they occured before just as frequently as they do in the present time, you're just more aware of it now thanks to the visual distortion induced by 'shrooms. You may try asking some friends of yours and doing an informal experiment, see if people can see "halos" around lights if they concentrate at them, or see patterns or other strange stuff on a flat white surface (especially after "priming" the visual cortex/retina by staring at something displaying say, a simple motion animation.)

THe grey/static in dark areas has a name, it's eigengrau. The current hypothesis is that it is not always totally black because your retina always has some cells that sense light that get triggered by random thermal noise. The visual process in humans is actually really complex, what your brain "sees" is not direct input from your eyes at all, like one might expect. It is instead a mental model, which is continually updated with input from your eyes, ears, memory and so on. I think it is foolish to assume that our biological intermperation of reality is a perfect and flawless image anyway!

This is all kind of pushing away the unpleasant answers to your questions. Because as far as we know, all the underlying effects of HPPD are present (if you look for them) in most sober people, they are just trained to ignore them better. The most effective treatment for HPPD is learning to train your brain to basically edit the "errors" out again, rebuilding trust in the accuracy of your vision, by conditioning yourself to ignore the disortions and concentrate insstead on things that matter to your every day life: images and objects instead.

You will eventually learn to not be so freaked out by it. It's important to remember it's not a sign of damage - if anything it is a sign your visual cortex is tuned for maximum sensitivity. Distortions should not interfere with your ability to read or judge distance, so it is a good idea to have your eyes tested entirely. You'd ideally want to test visual acuity, optical pressure, and corneal tomography if possible. If you can rule out anything physical in your eyes, consider that you have been blessed with seeing that which normally remains unseen.

The main thing is to not worry about it. One treatment that was suggested is clonazepam, an anti-anxirty drug. It does nothing to combat the visual distortions, it make you not care about them though. And not care about a lot of other things. So in the end, training yourself to ignore the distractions naturally is the way to do it.
 
It seems that some people THINK they are completely unaffected permanently by psychedelics. Apparantly the visual cortex is the most sensitive of all effected areas in the brain by drugs which is why it seems to be the main lingering effect of psychedelics. I dont know if this is a "bad" side effect but its seems to vary from person to person. Ive had this for 20 years. Its not severe but its noticeable.

Im not sure why theres even any doubt or argument about "HPPD". WHile I do not consider it a disorder it is certainly a real phenomena. Our first clue into this was a study done on former LSD users and a control group. I believe that this study was done in the 70s or 80s. EIther way , they had a group that has used LSD in the past and the control group that has not. They subjected them to a test in which they flashed a light in their eyes and measured how long it took for the pupil to return to baseline. And another test which asked them to identify between two dark colors such as maroon and deep blue. 100% of the former LSD users did poorer on the test than the control group. WHats even more interesting is that the study did not require the LSD users to have had a minimum amount of exposures to the drug. In other words some of the subjects had only used LSD once and still did poorer than the control group. This is my two cents

I also believe alot of what Seiko above is saying is correct. Its not dangerous or something to lose sleep over. But its wise to be aware that their may be long lasting (sometimes unwanted) changes when using powerful psychoactives
 
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the word "disorder" implies that it is in some ways harmful to the subject experiencing it. if you see tracers, morphing, whatever, but if you're not really bothered by it, it is not a "disorder".
 
Another rather salient question that I'm surprised nobody has asked yet: how long has it been since you last used mushrooms? It's entirely normal for some people to have visual aftereffects for days, weeks, even months after a trip. It's only after the symptoms persist for several months, to such an extent that they cause difficulties with normal sight, that it might be diagnosed as HPPD.
 
Solistus, good point ....I dont believe that visuals persisting a few days after a trip should be classified as HPPD, however according to how I understand it, is its considered HPPD if it persists for any time after the acute intoxication. I dont agree with this but "experts" and HPPD sufferers claim that people who experience this are more likely to be prone to "full bown" HPPD if they continue to use the drugs that cause this. Many people with HPPD said that the extended visuals worsened with every use until it just never went away.
 
Another rather salient question that I'm surprised nobody has asked yet: how long has it been since you last used mushrooms? It's entirely normal for some people to have visual aftereffects for days, weeks, even months after a trip. It's only after the symptoms persist for several months, to such an extent that they cause difficulties with normal sight, that it might be diagnosed as HPPD.

Sorry for the late reply, I'v been very busy the last couple of days. The last time I took mushrooms was in August of last year, so it has almost been a full year.
 
How confident are you in saying that? I know that "HHPD type" effects are actually observable in, for instance, children of elementary school age. Optical illusions worked on me, at least at that age, and what child hasn't rubbed his or her eyes until they see a shimmering fractal curtain of phosphenes at least once (against their mother's wishes)?

It's very likely they occured before just as frequently as they do in the present time, you're just more aware of it now thanks to the visual distortion induced by 'shrooms. You may try asking some friends of yours and doing an informal experiment, see if people can see "halos" around lights if they concentrate at them, or see patterns or other strange stuff on a flat white surface (especially after "priming" the visual cortex/retina by staring at something displaying say, a simple motion animation.)

THe grey/static in dark areas has a name, it's eigengrau. The current hypothesis is that it is not always totally black because your retina always has some cells that sense light that get triggered by random thermal noise. The visual process in humans is actually really complex, what your brain "sees" is not direct input from your eyes at all, like one might expect. It is instead a mental model, which is continually updated with input from your eyes, ears, memory and so on. I think it is foolish to assume that our biological intermperation of reality is a perfect and flawless image anyway!

This is all kind of pushing away the unpleasant answers to your questions. Because as far as we know, all the underlying effects of HPPD are present (if you look for them) in most sober people, they are just trained to ignore them better. The most effective treatment for HPPD is learning to train your brain to basically edit the "errors" out again, rebuilding trust in the accuracy of your vision, by conditioning yourself to ignore the disortions and concentrate insstead on things that matter to your every day life: images and objects instead.

You will eventually learn to not be so freaked out by it. It's important to remember it's not a sign of damage - if anything it is a sign your visual cortex is tuned for maximum sensitivity. Distortions should not interfere with your ability to read or judge distance, so it is a good idea to have your eyes tested entirely. You'd ideally want to test visual acuity, optical pressure, and corneal tomography if possible. If you can rule out anything physical in your eyes, consider that you have been blessed with seeing that which normally remains unseen.

The main thing is to not worry about it. One treatment that was suggested is clonazepam, an anti-anxirty drug. It does nothing to combat the visual distortions, it make you not care about them though. And not care about a lot of other things. So in the end, training yourself to ignore the distractions naturally is the way to do it.

Excellent post.

Some people also get what are called floaters or flashers, and various ophthalmologists have told me how it's not a side effect of taking LSD or mushrooms, and just the vitreous material in your eye crashing against your lens.
 
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