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How you deal with pain vs. How you could do it differently

I do that ish standing up baby.

I grown! or something like that.


<3
 
Erikmen said:
Dogs will like us regardless of our emotions. As long as we treat them reasonably they will do everything to us and stand in our side. They are an excellent company but can't replace a word of support we need sometimes from people. Humans are more complex, so many of us still live in an entire life needing approval only to feel accepted. We often don't like who we have become, definitely different from what we have pictured early in life. Not to mention how life hold us 'hostage' so that we have similar modus operandis which consists in accepting concepts of having to go to work so to enable us to sustain our families. And in the process we forget we need to talk, to share, to have fun.

If you have your problems I think here is the place you could share them. That's what this thread has been all about for these past days. We try to help, share our experiences and even if you might not be satisfied with the answers it does not mean that we don't care.

The impression I have is that people from different generations react differently and sometimes choose to be silent about their own problems. The more I think about this more I remember how older people, for instance don't feel comfortable in talking about their problems. I don't know if it's because they don't want to bother based on the perception we won't care enough or that it won't solve anything. These days people tend to be more individualist but at the same time more open minded as well, imo/e.
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A thoughtful and generous response. Thank you. Being older I know how hard it is for my peers to open up. I often seek the young for these very reasons. I still fell like I'm 24 inside and can't seem to ever shut up.
 
Erikmen said:
The impression I have is that people from different generations react differently and sometimes choose to be silent about their own problems. The more I think about this more I remember how older people, for instance don't feel comfortable in talking about their problems. I don't know if it's because they don't want to bother based on the perception we won't care enough or that it won't solve anything. These days people tend to be more individualist but at the same time more open minded as well, imo/e.
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I take for granted that most people don't talk about their problems. I was in therapy at a young age and embarked on a spiritual path even before then. I take for granted that the things I say in passing are shocking to some people, because I cultivate openness and honesty with all the people in my life by virtue of not keeping anything bottled up. When people talk about what's happening in their lives in a real way, I don't consider it to be talking about their "problems", they're just talking about what's happening. Shouldn't all people have the freedom to merely express the truth of their present existence?
 
Foreigner said:
I take for granted that most people don't talk about their problems. I was in therapy at a young age and embarked on a spiritual path even before then. I take for granted that the things I say in passing are shocking to some people, because I cultivate openness and honesty with all the people in my life by virtue of not keeping anything bottled up. When people talk about what's happening in their lives in a real way, I don't consider it to be talking about their "problems", they're just talking about what's happening. Shouldn't all people have the freedom to merely express the truth of their present existence?
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Absolutely. That's tough to keep it all to yourself. By being opened whenever it's possible it feels like through sharing some of our problems or the situations we find ourselves in allows us to distribute the weight and move on. Besides, in this process we can always find goodness and real friendship.
 
Erikmen said:
Absolutely. That's tough to keep it all to yourself. By being opened whenever it's possible it feels like through sharing some of our problems or the situations we find ourselves in allows us to distribute the weight and move on. Besides, in this process we can always find goodness and real friendship.
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That's true. What I notice though, is that openness is not the norm. Maybe it's because we still live in a relatively competitive social model, and we've been taught that competition is part of nature -- and therefore, vulnerability is taboo. I find that people open up when I take the risk and be vulnerable first... then we can really connect on a real level. But I notice that I often have to be the one to do it, which happens anyway because of who I am.

For instance, today I made a very small opening with someone, which was to mention that I dealt with a severe illness this year. Almost immediately he started opening up about something he's been dealing with, something he tells practically nobody about. Before long he was telling me his life story.

I was really glad to provide that space for him, but at the same time I found myself thinking... how is it that people become this isolated? He obviously had all that shit bottled up for a LONG time, and I don't think my gesture was particularly profound.
 
Here's my little worthless theory. Becker called it the "vital lie" if my memory serves. Our culture is the vital lie. It is serving as a distraction from a terrifying truth. If on some level you feel everyone is lying then there is no reason for trust. Keep the real shit to yourself and maybe you'll be safe. It doesn't work but there it is.

This is a simplification of a rather complex theory I believe in so it might seem a little vague but I'm full of opiates at the moment and I don't want to waste it typing.
 
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Foreigner said:
That's true. What I notice though, is that openness is not the norm. Maybe it's because we still live in a relatively competitive social model, and we've been taught that competition is part of nature -- and therefore, vulnerability is taboo. I find that people open up when I take the risk and be vulnerable first... then we can really connect on a real level. But I notice that I often have to be the one to do it, which happens anyway because of who I am.

For instance, today I made a very small opening with someone, which was to mention that I dealt with a severe illness this year. Almost immediately he started opening up about something he's been dealing with, something he tells practically nobody about. Before long he was telling me his life story.

I was really glad to provide that space for him, but at the same time I found myself thinking... how is it that people become this isolated? He obviously had all that shit bottled up for a LONG time, and I don't think my gesture was particularly profound.
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I find myself very vulnerable when talking something important about my life. I think society has built layers of levels of intimacy until we can feel 'free' to talk about impotant things that might be happening to us. I believe we need to be able to indentify who is that person. If I have a problem and can't share it with nobody, I will feel I'm locked trying to deal with routine life issues but at the same time bothered by my own problems which can grow inside as it's been creating its own life. Things that could potentially slow me down and make me distant from others. Personal unsolved issues can isolate us - or worst, make us pretend everything is okay when I am obviously fighting with my own monters. At some point we start to live a lie as we may find ourselves so far from what's in front of us, that it will seem like we are torn apart in between my secrets and the real life.

Except, that sometimes it's okay to talk. Just like what you have mentioned above. You find the right person to share some of your issues and the other part respond by talking about their own problems too. That makes us closer, and somehow lighter.

Of course there are few things we can't really share because of the nature of some the problems we have. But, we can be selective as we go, and who knows in the future that person might be the one we could actually talk about those things we couldn't as they too will have their 'secrets' so to speak.
 
I guess resilience and self-efficacy are a large part of this, for me.

Like, for a huge part of my life, I have been quite resilient to get through what I have.

But I have also bitched and moaned about things, and have been trying to get to the bottom of whether my addiction features most prominently as a disease/disorder, choice, or self-medication process - or whether this even matters?...

As I have moved through life, where there are different situations that arise, I develop new behaviours, as required.

Treating one drug addiction with another drug is not the answer, but has been part of the journey, for me. Would it have been part of the journey if I had never gotten dependent on hard drugs? Well, probably not. Not at this point in my life, anyway.

Relationships played heavily in my life recently, but maybe they don't need to as much right now.

Due to following my "heart", and chasing a girl across the world, I've had a pretty hectic few months, culminating in possibly the most intense couple of weeks of my life.

Last weekend, I was detained for questioning about an incident in Sweden.

During the week, I was getting baked whilst wondering around Amsterdam.

This weekend, I am laying around in the Mediterranean soaking up the sun.

Throughout that whole process, I've been going through a breakup and fighting on through recovery from hard drug-dependence.

Increasing and improving my self-efficacy needs to continue to take place, at the required pace of life, in spite of apparent setbacks.

Otherwise, I'll become a slave to the pain and die.
 
Hej VL, I'm sorry to hear you are going through difficulties with your relationship. Do you think this is related to your addiction.
You've mentioned that you've tried to treat your addiction by using another drug, and that it did not work. So how are coping with this?
In certain situations I think we need self-efficacy is the only way, you need to be resilient but at what cost, I wonder. I wish I'd be more independent.

As far as relationship goes, I think that if I was not married, we would have certainly gone different ways. Not because I used it as I had gone through surgeries and have had problems with opiates when I was younger. That she understands, except having hidden it from her. We had been through a lot of great things in life and our marriage was a happy one for years and years, despite of all the problems we had, expect for this one. And despite going through therapy, she's the kind of person who wants me to promise that I will never ever do this again, she feels I should have not stopped with my methadone treatment. And on top of that she does not understand how being sober changes your life, no matter if she hears it from me or from the doctor she refuses to see that as a condition I will have to deal with during all my life. Every time I try to talk to her about that it does not end well. And I'm tired of discussions, so we don't talk about it at all.
 
Hej hej, Erikmen

Yes, of course since I have struggled with addiction for many years, relationship issues will often relate directly or indirectly to that struggle. This will likely continue until I can maintain my sobriety to a point where I feel I have recovered. Coping, like right now? Right now, I'm not a positive beacon of mental health. I don't really know where to go or what to do. It is incredibly painful when your own behaviour is regarded as the only reason for a loved one continually having beef with you - by that person and by yourself.

That is the problem with addiction and the misunderstandings inherent in society, as well.

Although addiction is widely regarded as a disease, I don't see it as such, but I would regard it as having components similar with other diseases. What does this matter? Well, not only is it bad science, it may be a means by which addicts are stuck in the cycle of treatment, as well as for certain organisations to get funding, for example through NIDA. You mentioned methadone treatment, and I think many are trapped by a combination of the legal system telling them they must comply with the disease model, doctors pushing the notion of a disease model which one may never recover from, and certain cognitive biases in society.

If one doesn't fit the recipe set out by society, especially where medical professionals are involved, you may miss out on treatment entirely.

I have been thinking about this within the bounds of having a partner who has grown up oblivious to addiction, and I've come to the decision that, while we could make it work, it is dangerous and much more risky for me to stay within a relationship at this point in my recovery.

It's painful. For me. For her. I slept with someone else last week to try get over her, but that didn't go down well, either.

I'm just going to soak up the rays around the Mediterranean archipelago for a while. Might go diving on Monday. Hopefully, I'll start to feel a little better this time next week about my decisions, which are weighing heavily on my conscience right now...
 
I really admire Erikmen's gentle way. <3
 
Thanks @swilow. We try to do our best and I care a lot about what we are trying to build here. :)
 
Lately I've come to the very interesting insight that a lot of the pain in my life comes from, believe it or not, my fear of pain itself. I realized that I wasn't just saddled with anger, remorse, sadness, and fear -- I was also constantly living my life in fear of these things!

How silly, I thought to myself! I shouldn't really be afraid of pain. Pain is a necessary aspect of life, and I should learn to embrace it. One can grow so much from painful experiences... why should I shy away from pain, and plead for a life in a fantastic forever-happy-sunshine land?

Ever since that thought, I've been slowly relaxing my fear of pain, and it's been helping me cope.
 
^ Yes I think so too.
For me fear makes everything worse, and sometimes I feel it's more difficult to deal with what you don't know. Feelings like that sometimes come quite suddenly, even among friends or within places that you know. In certain cases it stops you from doing things you want.
 
You are the hero @Nixiam!! I trust in you as part of the new generation that will save us from destroying our home. ;)
As for TDS I'm always learning from those who inspired me to be here. Great and incredibly amazing examples that gave life and still light this site. <3
 
Well, we'll try not to fuck it up in the process.

I'm so tired, I had to do landscaping and other yard work because our rent lease says "Do shit so the yard is pretty" or something like that.

As for fear, I think we all know we shouldn't live in it daily. Fear in small quantities I feel is a good thing. It keeps us safe. But when being overly cautious leads to a non productive, barren tree of life that affects you negatively, then it becomes a problem.

Everything in moderation, as they say.
 
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