How can my parents ALWAYS tell when I've taken even a tiny dose of a benzo?

[ChemicallyEnhanced]

Right now I have 10mg diazepams. I've been halving them and taking 5mg at a time and my dad still tells me I'm way off normal. He's even told me I've looked zombie-like and my speach is slurred from taken a 2.5mg diaepam? How is this possible?

 

[Cream Gravy?]

The most common side-effect of benzos are delusions of sobriety.

/thread?

Idk man, 10mg diazepam wouldn't have me noticeably zombie-like. But everyone reacts differently.

 

[Xorkoth]

I was gonna say it but CG beat me to it. Benzos cause delusions of sobriety. You can be acting like a total dumbass and believe you're fine.

 

[JessFR]

I was gonna say it butt CG beat me to it. Benzos cause delusions of sobriety. You can be acting like a total dumbass and believe you're fine.

Oh God yeah. A friend of mine used to frequently infuriate me by his complete failure to recognize how fucked up he was every time he was on benzos. It was a nightmare. He was usually very reliable, but every single time he got benzos there'd be a week of chaos all while he's totally oblivious to it.

So it wouldn't be unheard of if you were actually a lot more impaired than you realized.

 

[JTemperance]

Agreed with delusions of sobriety, but 2.5mg of diazepam seems quite low to be causing enough impairment that you'd be detected if you're trying to behave normally, especially if you have at least some experience with it, if not a tolerance per se. Not that it couldn't cause perceptible slurring, etc. -- I know that 5mg definitely can for someone sensitive to benzos with no tolerance -- but it still strikes me as a little odd.

Maybe your behavior/demeanor reflects some attempt to overcompensate for the fact that you know you've taken a benzo? Or you're acting "guilty" in some way that tips your parents off to the fact that you've done something you shouldn't, and they know benzos have been responsible for problems in the past, so they make the intuitive leap that you've taken them and then begin to perceive the symptoms of benzo intoxication in you?

 

[nznity]

This happens to me aswell, My older. Cousin/more like. My aunt because she's like 20 yolder than me but still my. Cus. She can always tell when I'm on benzos and I think the same stuff as you like, wtf but I wasn't even that high etc etc but like Xorkoth and the other guy said benzos make us act like fucking idiots and we think we are fine.
Careful with benzos, the most stupid shit done by some human beings have been under the influence of them.

 

[Jopeth]

Does your family play poker? lol Having a tell is a damning thing for some people.

I have a buddy that had to stop using benzos, cause everybody but him could tell he was fucked up. BTW Im super jealous right now. Valium is one of my favorites but takes 30 mgs without a tolerance, but that is equal in effect to .5 mg of alprazolam. Benzos are one of lifes true miracles....miracles that keep on taking lol

 

[JTemperance]

Valium is one of my favorites but takes 30 mgs without a tolerance, but that is equal in effect to .5 mg of alprazolam.

Is that your personal equivalence? Even so, it would surprise me if you found those two doses to affect you equally. At the higher end of charts that I've seen, 0.5mg alprazolam is the equivalent of 10mg diazepam. (Other charts would say only 5mg diazepam; personally, I find it to be in between the two.)

 

[Jopeth]

I know man its strange. But ive sat down (lied down rather) and done the experiments one week when I had supplies of both. It takes a lot of valium for me to appreciate it, but when I do its great.

 

[JessFR]

I know man its strange. But ive sat down (lied down rather) and done the experiments one week when I had supplies of both. It takes a lot of valium for me to appreciate it, but when I do its great.

Drug effects are super weird. Even in the same person taking the same drug there seems to be considerable variation.

I generally take stuff like drug equivalence as little more than a vague guideline.

 

[JTemperance]

I know man its strange. But ive sat down (lied down rather) and done the experiments one week when I had supplies of both. It takes a lot of valium for me to appreciate it, but when I do its great.

Drug effects are super weird. Even in the same person taking the same drug there seems to be considerable variation.

I generally take stuff like drug equivalence as little more than a vague guideline.

Most of the equivalence charts don't apply directly to the purposes of this board. The opiate equivalence charts are for (supposedly) equivalent analgesic effect, not euphoric effect. And most of the benzo equivalence charts are even less applicable, since many of them are giving dose equivalents for withdrawal/reduction purposes, not therapeutic purposes, let alone recreational.

I just saw the most bizarre chart in a published book on drug detoxifcation giving these equivalents for Phenobarbital 30mg: Alprazolam 1mg / Chlordiazepoxide 25mg / Clonazepam 2mg / Clorazepate 7.5mg (?) / Diazepam 10mg / Lorazepam 2mg / Oxazepam 10mg (??) / Temazepam 15mg / Triazolam 0.25mg

Someone taking a single Ser(ep)ax 30mg capsule a day needs the same 90mg phenobarb as someone taking three 2mg clonazepam tablets a day??

Anyways, they do provide a starting point at least, especially if claiming to give therapeutically equivalent doses. With benzos, the equivalencies always seem to understate the strength of the hypnotic benzos, but I understand that subjective intensity is different than strength per se. That's why I personally accept the equivalence of 1mg alprazolam to 2mg lorazepam, even though the former feels much more subjectively intense to me. But the idea that 10mg nitrazepam is equal to 10mg diazepam, for instance, seems objectively mistaken, even if it could be true that a person can be kept out of seizure-territory by making that substitution.

I'd heard of people finding 0.5mg alprazolam to be as strong or stronger than 10mg diazepam (though I don't), but never as strong as 30mg diazepam, so was curious about those numbers. I guess it does go to show that the effects we focus on when we suggest equivalences are unique from one person to another.

 

[Jopeth]

As for opiate conversion charts, ive found for the most part that the strongest analgesic effects run hand in hand with abusability. Although with something like fent its *almost* past the point of abusability compared with its analgesic strength.

 

[axe battler]

Parents know their kids and arent as daft as some of us think. Glazed, hooded eyes and slow or slurry speech are really obvious, especially if they're looking for signs

 

[axe battler]

I think enzymes and how they metabolise different people make them unpredictable.
Lorazepam does not work on me (much anyway) but I love bromazepam, alp, diazepam, nitraz, clonazepam, etizolam and many moooore I'm sure.
One i want to try most is nemetazepam or flunktrazepam if that's never happening

 

[Specified]

i can take up to 20mg and im still what you call normal. no one has said a thing

 

[GetMeOutOfThisCRAP]

Sometimes on benzos you feel 100% sober but to everyone else you're a total idiot.

I don't know why you can't tell that you're slurring your speech but I stopped taking benzos entirely a long time ago from too many negative situations and me not remembering a single bit of it. I've always thought I was totally sober and offended way too many people (even on lower doses). Sounds like you can only take benzos on days that there aren't people around you. The same thing is happening to you that happened to me long ago. You do not want to offend someone really close to you to the point that they totally avoid you, trust me lol. Benzos are dangerous in behavior. Some people can function on them finely, but it's important to acknowledge if you're not one of those people sooner than later I relate to this thread way too much. I've done too many things I would never ever do sober on benzos. It's just not worth the temporary lack of anxiety to be offending people around you...

Some drugs just aren't for some people. No sense in pushing it farther than it needs to go. I remember going to a quickcheck on 2 mgs of alprazolam a long time ago and wondering why everyone was looking at me so oddly. I must have not been forming sentences correctly. But I got my sandwich. That's all that matters. The scariest part is that you can forget that you've taken a benzo even or taken way more than you initially intended to from blacking out. I've even woken up the next day several hours after taking it and still have been zombied out and in black-out mode. This class of drugs is way stronger for some than others. I have never offended so many people even on heavy doses of alcohol. It's very bizarre but whatever I don't care for benzos anymore. People even decide brilliantly to drive on them and awful permanently-lasting things have occurred. Not worth it.

 

[Jopeth]

Ive known a couple people that have gotten in trouble for walking into a store, any store, and just flat out stealing shit. Happened to my ex to the point she went to prison, and one of my best friends got caught stealing stupid shit....light bulbs and such lol. Just makes you not fucking care. I love them however as they don't do this to me, but now that I live a basically stress free life they are not as special as they used to be.

 

[TheAzo]

That's a really surprisingly strong reaction - like, 10-20mg of diaz equiv, I would expect that.... though diaz is also I think a little more visible, more dis-coordination vs most benzos. I have definitely enjoyed 10mg diazepam with potentiators (with basically no benzo tolerance), but my gf at the time didn't know I was on anything until she asked me why I wasn't getting a beer at the restaurant... I have never once been called out for being on benzos - only things I've been called out for are being quite high on G, and once, looong ago, a comment on what a good mood I was in when I was coming up on some psychedelic and mom wasn't going to bed as early as I expected.

I am very rarely high enough that people comment on it, though - I mean, when I'm not like at a drug-fueled hang-out session or party, and going hard. I think different people have different levels of ability to hide being high. I appear to be really fucking good at it, though that also makes it more tempting to use drugs too often, or too casually, because nobody notices. Benzos are definitely very good at the delusions of sobriety, though - though I've also gotten the impression that the delusion of sobriety, especially if it is a benzo that doesn't impact coordination, so you're not sloppy, not slurring - no blatant tell - sometimes the delusion of sobriety can include the observers. I have known people who on occasion thought they weren't that messed up, people around them thought they were good, but the next day they have no memory of it.

 

[GetMeOutOfThisCRAP]

Some people just have different behavior for taking the same substances. Like how a few folks drink and are mellow while others are violent and obnoxious. I don't know if benzos are "the real you," though. Some people think alcohol brings out lower inhibitions so people are more so themselves. On benzos if you black out it could totally be anything but you lol. The blackouts are what made me permanently avoid benzos. I wish they found an anxiety killer substance that didn't have so many weird side effects and horrible withdrawal symptoms. Gabapentin is amazing for killing anxiety and functioning... but users also report horrible beyond words withdrawal experiences.

It's terrifying to think about the number of individuals who thought it was okay to try alprazolam or clonepazem for the first time right before being in a public place because they thought they could handle their drugs lol! Nothing like waking up in the morning having destroyed your life temporarily and not remembering a second of your actions. Also I've taken alprazolam and had adverse anxiety. I wonder if others have found that certain times benzodiazepines have the opposite effect of what their intended for.

 

[diazepamforever?]

Definitely I'm getting high anxiety from diazepam now. It is totally hit or miss; some days are excellent... others are a form of torture. I may just be out of time, as I've been using high doses for a good few years now. Considering trying Xanax or something. Not ready to leave the v's behind yet. It's really confusing.

But as to the apparition of sobriety. I visited a relative once on about 400mg (40 blues...) and they quickly sized me up and informed me I was looking well now that I was "off the drugs." They had only ever seen me stoned or sober and, all of those times, eyed me up like I was out of my nut. Sometimes, nowadays, I take maybe 5 or 10 mg of the diaz and do feel myself chatting an awful lot of crap. So I take more and seem to get more control. Could be a delusion, maybe. I feel I can quite well recognize when I'm appearing benzoed though. The quandary is trying to even give a toss what people think.