Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
Ismene, there is a very wide variance in strains within the A.muscaria species complex (sensu lato) and indeed, within the sensu stricto A.muscaria var. muscaria itself, dependent on the country it grows in. The sweating and nausea are largely caused by muscarine, a quaternary ammonium cholinergic neurotoxin (and being a quat, its charged, and remains restricted to the peripheral nervous system, and does not pass the blood-brain barrier) not the psychoactive muscimol.
The content of this is very low, compared to some fungi that produce it, tiny in fact, in A.muscaria var. muscaria, some other mushrooms produce much more, such as Chlorophyllum molybdites, a lookalike of the parasol mushroom (Lepiota procera), the latter is delicious, if a little funny looking, whilst the former will sicken you so badly you want to die. Omphalotus spp. are another family that pack a load of muscarine, the glow in the dark, fluorescent jack'o'lantern fungi, which are often mistaken by inexperienced, or plain stupid foragers for chanterelles, and likewise, while they are unlikely to kill you, you will wish they had.
Inocybe species contain, often, much more still, and there are several, such as the red-staining inocybe, I.patouillardii which have enough to be lethal. Poisoning is, however, easily treatable, as unlike most fungal neurotoxins, a specific antidote exists to muscarine poisoning, atropine (a nasty poison in its own right, found in belladonna, Daturas, Brugmansias, and quite a lot of the rest of the nightshade family.
Not something you want to take, unless you are damn careful with it, and it causes memory deficits, as do other antimuscarinic delirients, BUT....there is a nifty little trick one can work with A.muscaria that I came up with.
The OTC IBS medication buscopan. It contains hyoscine butylbromide, hyoscine is otherwise known as scopolamine, again found in nightshades of various kinds, but the butylbromide form is like muscarine, a quaternary amine, and as such bears an electrostatic charge, that prevents its passing into the CNS and acting as a deliriant and amnestic. It is a specific antagonist for muscarinic acetylcholine receptors, that unlike atropine, datura seeds (which I have, carefully, used at a low dose with success, using maybe 10-15 seeds at most, as I have used deadly nightshade seed, again with great care, to prevent nausea on A.muscaria)
Its available OTC, won't cause any central symptoms, for it never gets there to do so, and of course, its a pharmaceutical product, so the doses are not uncontrolled, as they are with the nightshades, their friends and family, and will directly and specifically counteract not just the nausea potential, but the sweating, shivering and increased bowel movement speed.
I pick kilos of amanitas every season, enough to last me the winter, if not the year from a local golf course, where they grow not by the patch, but by the small private army. I dry them out overnight, by putting them on a foil-lined tray, flipping them over a few times, at the lowest heat my oven can go, and make tea. Tastes like meat (I believe, due to harmless traces of ibotenic acid remaining, its a glutamate agonist, so, I believe, is acting similar to MSG to produce what the japs and chinese call 'umami', the fifth basic flavour, that of savoury, which is mediated by glutamatergic receptors on the tongue)
Actually, I use them for cooking too, as well as medicinal and recreational use. A little dried, powdered A.muscaria really improves the flavour of steak and stews and is absolutely fantastic in chilli (with which I add peppery boletus, Chalciporus piperatus [formerly Boletus piperatus before reclassification, in the constantly changing naming system clusterfuck that is mycological taxonomy], this grows under the same silver birch trees that the fly agarics do, quite often found alongside them)
A full recreational dose of fly agaric is very different, as has been said, to psilocybin, very, very different indeed, it isn't even close to the feeling serotonergic psychedelics produce, but rather, induces a waking dream state at the lower end, to a rapid onset of sleep at the higher, with very intense lucid dreaming.
I think, perhaps, I might prefer a proper dose of a good, potent strain of A.muscaria to psilocybin mushrooms, I'm on the fence really, but I like them at least equally. I find taking them as tea acts quickly, and produces little nausea, at least with the strain that grows in the place I pick them from every year, I have little experience of those from other areas, aside from a little from various places mixed in with those from where I make my usual annual harvest. Aside from one place, a reservoir I used to go hiking and picking liberty caps as a little kid, where some amanitas I took from an adjacent coniferous forest, made up of I think, larch, spruce of some kind, and scots pine.
Those were ferociously potent, I took a usual dose in a tea, which absolutely fucking flattened me, asleep within perhaps 15-20 minutes, during which time, I had the most amazing lucid dreams, very intense and realistic (at least, as realistic as dreams can be, as wierd as their subject matter frequently is)
Doses lower than those needed to trip, make a good pick me up, or endurance booster too, specifically against cold, I've been out to shops quite some distance away before, wearing nothing on top, aside from a trenchcoat and my shades, in the middle of a bitter winter, and didn't even notice the cold, let alone feel unconfortable, even without gloves on. It just felt like a fairly mild day Whilst it won't prevent the physical harmful effects of overexposure to extreme cold, hypothermia, frostbite etc, as a tonic of sorts, it can give the endurance of a tank, and there is nothing as good as a hot cup of fly agaric tea, sweetened with a bit of honey, on an icy cold winter night.
The content of this is very low, compared to some fungi that produce it, tiny in fact, in A.muscaria var. muscaria, some other mushrooms produce much more, such as Chlorophyllum molybdites, a lookalike of the parasol mushroom (Lepiota procera), the latter is delicious, if a little funny looking, whilst the former will sicken you so badly you want to die. Omphalotus spp. are another family that pack a load of muscarine, the glow in the dark, fluorescent jack'o'lantern fungi, which are often mistaken by inexperienced, or plain stupid foragers for chanterelles, and likewise, while they are unlikely to kill you, you will wish they had.
Inocybe species contain, often, much more still, and there are several, such as the red-staining inocybe, I.patouillardii which have enough to be lethal. Poisoning is, however, easily treatable, as unlike most fungal neurotoxins, a specific antidote exists to muscarine poisoning, atropine (a nasty poison in its own right, found in belladonna, Daturas, Brugmansias, and quite a lot of the rest of the nightshade family.
Not something you want to take, unless you are damn careful with it, and it causes memory deficits, as do other antimuscarinic delirients, BUT....there is a nifty little trick one can work with A.muscaria that I came up with.
The OTC IBS medication buscopan. It contains hyoscine butylbromide, hyoscine is otherwise known as scopolamine, again found in nightshades of various kinds, but the butylbromide form is like muscarine, a quaternary amine, and as such bears an electrostatic charge, that prevents its passing into the CNS and acting as a deliriant and amnestic. It is a specific antagonist for muscarinic acetylcholine receptors, that unlike atropine, datura seeds (which I have, carefully, used at a low dose with success, using maybe 10-15 seeds at most, as I have used deadly nightshade seed, again with great care, to prevent nausea on A.muscaria)
Its available OTC, won't cause any central symptoms, for it never gets there to do so, and of course, its a pharmaceutical product, so the doses are not uncontrolled, as they are with the nightshades, their friends and family, and will directly and specifically counteract not just the nausea potential, but the sweating, shivering and increased bowel movement speed.
I pick kilos of amanitas every season, enough to last me the winter, if not the year from a local golf course, where they grow not by the patch, but by the small private army. I dry them out overnight, by putting them on a foil-lined tray, flipping them over a few times, at the lowest heat my oven can go, and make tea. Tastes like meat (I believe, due to harmless traces of ibotenic acid remaining, its a glutamate agonist, so, I believe, is acting similar to MSG to produce what the japs and chinese call 'umami', the fifth basic flavour, that of savoury, which is mediated by glutamatergic receptors on the tongue)
Actually, I use them for cooking too, as well as medicinal and recreational use. A little dried, powdered A.muscaria really improves the flavour of steak and stews and is absolutely fantastic in chilli (with which I add peppery boletus, Chalciporus piperatus [formerly Boletus piperatus before reclassification, in the constantly changing naming system clusterfuck that is mycological taxonomy], this grows under the same silver birch trees that the fly agarics do, quite often found alongside them)
A full recreational dose of fly agaric is very different, as has been said, to psilocybin, very, very different indeed, it isn't even close to the feeling serotonergic psychedelics produce, but rather, induces a waking dream state at the lower end, to a rapid onset of sleep at the higher, with very intense lucid dreaming.
I think, perhaps, I might prefer a proper dose of a good, potent strain of A.muscaria to psilocybin mushrooms, I'm on the fence really, but I like them at least equally. I find taking them as tea acts quickly, and produces little nausea, at least with the strain that grows in the place I pick them from every year, I have little experience of those from other areas, aside from a little from various places mixed in with those from where I make my usual annual harvest. Aside from one place, a reservoir I used to go hiking and picking liberty caps as a little kid, where some amanitas I took from an adjacent coniferous forest, made up of I think, larch, spruce of some kind, and scots pine.
Those were ferociously potent, I took a usual dose in a tea, which absolutely fucking flattened me, asleep within perhaps 15-20 minutes, during which time, I had the most amazing lucid dreams, very intense and realistic (at least, as realistic as dreams can be, as wierd as their subject matter frequently is)
Doses lower than those needed to trip, make a good pick me up, or endurance booster too, specifically against cold, I've been out to shops quite some distance away before, wearing nothing on top, aside from a trenchcoat and my shades, in the middle of a bitter winter, and didn't even notice the cold, let alone feel unconfortable, even without gloves on. It just felt like a fairly mild day Whilst it won't prevent the physical harmful effects of overexposure to extreme cold, hypothermia, frostbite etc, as a tonic of sorts, it can give the endurance of a tank, and there is nothing as good as a hot cup of fly agaric tea, sweetened with a bit of honey, on an icy cold winter night.
