film: Kill Bill

[Petersko]

Please explain to me how a belief can be factual...

I said, "purported to be a fact", not "factual".

In one version of a statement (prefaced with "I think" or "it is my opinion that") you are clearly indicating that it is not an opinion held by everybody, nor is it a fact in the grander scheme.

In an unqualified version, the direct implication is that the statement has some independent truth or reality beyond just your belief.

To use your example, "You're a dickhead", at least to me, seems a harder insult than "I think you're a dickhead".

As a film student, you are also aquainted with nuance and intent when it comes to language.

 

[dyscotopia]

petersko, yes its a kung fu film.. a really good one at that.. cinematography, choreography and art direction are jaw dropping.. but its also a tarentino film. he writes great dialogue as pulp fiction and reservoir dogs made clear.. i think a lot of people were probably expecting more than a few choice one-liners.. its really hard to care about the characters in this movie, but i think that's probably a bit of the point.. if you cared about them, the violence would be less entertaining.. tarentino reportedly directed his actors to show the least amount of emotion possible to get the story across..

 

[Rincewind]

Save it for coffee morning fellas...

Back to the movie, i thought it was thoroughly entertaining it was gripping right from the start. I loved it when Uma was trying to wiggle her big toe, then she went off on one about the story of Oren Ishii then when youre totally into it it goes back to her wiggling her big toe and you're like oooh yeeaaah heh.

QT really broke his usual movie mold and has proven he can make a quality martial arts movie. How can you not think it was at least a cool movie with kickass fight scenes!

 

[alasdairm]

i'm going to close this. i'm a little annoyed with myself as i feel partly responsible but this is degenerating into a flame war.

if anybody would like to try another 'kill bill' thread, go ahead.

alasdair

 

[psychetool]

Film : Kill Bill

First of all I would like to say that this movie FUCKING ROCKED! The film style was amazing, the action was amazing, and the characters were amazing too!! Definitly one of my favorite movies of 2003. So, what do you all think will happen in volume 2 ? I'm sure bill will make his appearance. What did y'all think of th scene where she crushed that rapist fucks head in the door ? Man, that was sweeeeeeeeet. I was sad to see both go-go and oren-iseii removed in the first movie, I loved both of those characters. Lucy Lui is a hottie!!

Thats about it.

PLEASE, NO FLAMES IN THIS THREAD.

Now just look at these hot bitches (linked from the great site, kill-bill.com) , check out the review (linked from http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg23035.html ) , and smile.

I really liked the below review, some of you might too.

First Kill Bill review
------------------------------------------------------------------------

* From: Robert Seeberger
* Subject: First Kill Bill review
* Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 19:22:50 -0700
------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,98244,00.html

Success is a double-edged sword as we all know. Tomorrow, Miramax releases
one of the worst films in its history, a misbegotten comedy called "Duplex"
that stars Ben Stiller and Drew Barrymore in a pale rip-off of "Meet the
Parents."

On the other hand, three weeks from tomorrow the company will finally give
us Quentin Tarantino's "Kill Bill: Volume 1." I've seen this
much-anticipated film and I can tell you that it is absolutely brilliant, a
real tour de force.

And it raises interesting questions: Why can Miramax only make this kind of
film? Why are they unable to make high-concept Hollywood films? "Duplex"
falls in the dubious category of "Kate & Leopold," "Serendipity," "A View
from the Top" and "Bounce."

Oy! If only someone knew the answer.

But let's address "Kill Bill," which is the story of a character called The
Bride (Uma Thurman), a hit woman who avenges her newlywed husband's bloody
murder at the altar. The enemy is Bill, her former lover and employer and
his squad of vicious killers known as the Deadly Viper Assassination Squad,
or DiVAS. They are played by Daryl Hannah, Lucy Liu, Vivica A. Fox and
Michael Madsen.

You know this is a movie that's going to be a flash point for all the
cinema-geek-Internet-whatever writers. Tarantino is a cult figure. His every
move is dissected by these 'experts.' God love them, to have the time and
interest for this minutiae. Some want him to fail. Some want him to succeed.
Me? I really liked "Jackie Brown," so go figure. I have not watched the
special edition DVD of "Pulp Fiction" over and over in slow-motion.

Three-and-a-half years ago Tarantino surfaced from a long absence on the
scene during Oscar weekend 2000. He'd been someplace in the Caribbean for a
while and was with a mysterious woman whom he'd met down there. He was
supposedly working on a World War II movie. For some reason I can't
remember, we were sitting on a piano bench at a party. All of a sudden he
told me he was working on a script called "Kill Bill" that would star Warren
Beatty and Uma Thurman. The rest is history.

Eventually Beatty, who I guess couldn't figure out exactly what was going
on, dropped out of the project. He was replaced by "Kung Fu" star David
Carradine.

I remember seeing Tarantino chewing the ears off of Thurman and her husband
Ethan Hawke at the Miramax pre-Oscar bash that year -- almost to the point
of distraction. In fact, I wrote about it in this column. He was so excited
about "Kill Bill" and Thurman's participation that he ignored the skits
being performed on stage by that year's Oscar nominees.

Ironically, this February, Tarantino and Thurman may be asked to perform
similar sketches.

I will admit I'm not a fanatic expert on the subject of samurai movies,
'grind house' pictures, spaghetti westerns or Japanese anime. (The latter
all looks like "Speed Racer" to me.) Until I read the extensive press notes
for "Kill Bill," I assumed a "duck press" was something served a la orange
or with plum sauce. But I do know that "Kill Bill, Volume 1" is the hippest
thing I've seen on screen since "Pulp Fiction."

>From the opening credits (which are in Japanese) to the big finale in a
place called "The House of Blue Leaves" (sorry John Guare), "Kill Bill" is
full of visual knockouts. There are set piece homages to Tarantino's
favorite Japanese films, which are going to be parodied and copied as
slavishly as "Pulp Fiction."

It's "Crouching Tiger" and "The Matrix," mixed together and served with hot
sauce. What a meal these three films will make some day at a revival house!

What surprised me most about "Kill Bill," though, was Thurman. She's had an
iffy movie career, with some good stuff ("Pulp Fiction," "Dangerous
Liaisons," "Hysterical Blindness") and some famously bad stuff ("Gattaca,"
"The Avengers," "Even Cowgirls Get the Blues").

In a way, she's perfect Tarantino material -- someone we think of as a star
whose resume is littered with junk. Tarantino taps into that very
insightfully. "Kill Bill" sort of marries these two ideas together for
Thurman. Now she'll be a star like never before. Her performance is just
stunning, a really glorious piece of physical, witty exertion.

I'll tell you more about "Kill Bill" as its release date (Oct. 10)
approaches. But these were the impressions I was left with after the
screening: that it rocked, that the violence and spurting blood was
cartoon-like fun, that Lucy Liu was the best she's ever been.

I also thought that "Kill Bill" succeeded on every level that "Charlie's
Angels" didn't. And that I really wanted to see Part II as soon as possible
(I'm told it's not finished yet), but that I was happy there was a break.

Oh yeah, and one more thing: The soundtrack is simply amazing.





xponent

No Anti-Matter Was Harmed During The Posting Of This Review Maru

rob

 

[psychetool]

[edit: please keep the discussion to the movie. if you have a problem with another participant's style of posting, take it to a PM. if you feel a giudeline has been broken, please use the report button. thank you.]

 

[n2ofiend]

As I mentioned in the other thread I really enjoyed Kill Bill. You should have posted a spoiler alert above the post though (revealing what happens in the 'Buck' likes to fuck scene) but I imagine that most of the audience pretty much drew that conclusion of his demise when seeing it anyways. The anime sequence was pretty powerful as well. Great flick.

...I appreciate the info about Trantino but it doesnt change my opinion of any of his movies. I liked Dusk till dawn and loved Pulp Fiction.

[edit: please keep the discussion to the movie. if you have a problem with another participant's style of posting, take it to a PM. if you feel a giudeline has been broken, please use the report button. thank you.]

 

[Curious Yellow]

"Au Revoir Les Enfants" is a great movie.

And then where will we turn to discuss the hotness of Lucy Liu???

[edit: please keep the discussion to the movie. if you have a problem with another participant's style of posting, take it to a PM. if you feel a giudeline has been broken, please use the report button. thank you.]

 

[alasdairm]

one man's plagiarism is another's homage?

i expect that if you examine any contemporary movie closely enough, you'll find examples of directing technique, storyline and plot, acting, production design, etc. which reflect or suggest earlier movies.

they say if all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. while there is value in a clinical dissection of a film, there's also value in the experience from a holistic point of view. the whole, for many, being greater than the sum of the parts? in many cases, i believe so.

i'm reminded of the scene at the beginning of 'dead poets society' when robin williams has them rip the 'introduction to poetry' from their text books:

"Excrement! That's what I think of Mr. J. Evans Pritchard! We're not laying pipe! We're talking about poetry. How can you describe poetry like American Bandstand? "I like Byron, I give him a 42 but I can't dance to it!"

is it possible to quantify art?

apologies for all the cliches

alasdair

 

[syntech]

i cant wait to see this. yay!!!

 

[Raving Loony]

It's a good movie, it's just a pity that it wasn't able to continue the pace and humour of the first half an hour. IMO, this film would have been better if the sword fights were more one-v-one exchanges instead of one-v-dozens. The latter action scenes aren't really that impressive. And when I mean impressive I mean impressive like when Neo takes on his predecessors in the Matrix Reloaded.

I like Tarantino's humour and it went largerly missing in this film. But a Samurai movie is still a fresh thing for me as I have never been much of an anime fan nor martial arts movie nut. Uma Thurman, damn fine. Fine as ever in fact despite having three kids. She will always do it for me and she carries this role well.

Four stars.

 

[-spiderman-]

Uma may be fine, but there are some lines in that movie that almost made me cringe when she delivered them. Not so sure about the acting.

Yeap, I liked Kill Bill alot, but I don't think it was a "great" movie. There's a difference. You can like crap movies if you want just becuase they're fun, and realize that they're not really quality movies, you know? I felt that was with Kill Bill. I mean...the dialogue was nothing impressive, the plot was linear as all hell (it coulda been a videogame for christs sakes, her going through the different "levels" of poeple and shit) ----- BUT, it was a fun, stylish, cool, and entertaining flick; and in that sense, it did its job as a film.

You know what though, I'm sure that alot of dumb simplistic shit that he put in the movie was purposely put there for the amount of cheesiness that he intended this movie to have. I realize this. Even so, that doesn't change the fact that it could still make the movie not so good.

All in all, I really liked the movie though, but not a masterpiece or anything by any means.

 

[DJWhat]

...the plot was linear as all hell (it coulda been a videogame for christs sakes, her going through the different "levels" of poeple and shit)

I can kind of see what you mean, but I wouldn't say the plot was linear at all, in fact it was very much non-linear...

SPOILERS!!!!!



















The movie starts 4 1/2 years in the past at the wedding
Then jumps 4 1/2 years ahead to the fight with Copperhead
Then jumps back 6 months to when The Bride wakes up from her coma
Then jumps back several years in the anime flashback explaining Cottonmouth's history
Then goes back to the present time...

It was very much like Pulp Fiction in that the plot was as non-linear as possible.

I thought Kill Bill was great...I hope to see it again sometime soon to get another perspective....

Raving Looney: That's odd that you thought the fight scenes in M:R were better than KB's. I thought that the scenes in KB were far better, and that the showdown at the House of Blue Leaves was so well done it made the well-hyped "Burly Brawl" in M:R look poor. The fight scenes in M:R looked too much like a video game at some points, there were scenes where the CGI was so poor-looking it made me cringe.

 

[alasdairm]

PS. jesus - what's with the edited outs above? i just quoted other people as the original post did... if i showed you something about your beloved master film maker that you don't like.. dont take it out on me, write him a letter.

the comments i edit out of the posts above were personal attacks on you.

tarantino is not, for what it's worth "my beloved master film maker". please don't put words in my mouth - that devalues your contribution.

please stay on topic. if you have a problem with my moderation, use the system provided. if you have a problem with another poster, use a PM. please?

alasdair

 

[-spiderman-]

I can kind of see what you mean, but I wouldn't say the plot was linear at all, in fact it was very much non-linear...

Ok, you're right. poor choice of words. hrmm, maybe I should have said "unoriginal" or something instead of linear.

 

[Raving Loony]

DJWhat, as much I think Keanu can't act he is an okay ameteur fighter. The scene I like above all others is the one Neo takes on the Merovingian's assistants, it just blew me away. But unlike M:R, Kill Bill goes to great lengths to hide Uma Thurman's poor sword fighting ability. IMO, so the scenes don't look that amazing because of it.

 

[Negative]

The fight scenes in Crouching Tiger are better, by far, than the fight scenes in BOTH KB and M:R . . .

 

[SoN_of_SaMurAi]

people seem to regard QT as one of the current revolutionaries of the film industry and he...isn't

......In your most humble opinion.

Personally I loved the film it was great eye candy...there were a few ho-hum moments where I wished the pace would pick-up a bit. But by the same token I only watched it once and maybe on repeat viewings I will be able to better understand the way that he used the pace of the scenes to convey what he wants the more dedicated fans of the film to feel when they watch it repeatedly and pick-up on the nuances that aren't seen/heard on the first or second viewing

I mean if I were a writer/director of his note, I would plan the film to a certain degree with the interests of those who have a passion for my work. Not that I'm a hardcore fan of Tarrantino, but I like his work and all. Hope that made sence.

Anyways I loved the Japanese guys in the sushi hut they were piss funny. Shit like that, YES it's been done before OF COURSE!! But the guy isn't trying to pull the wool over your eyes and claim that it's a totally original idea. In fact he does quite the opposite and in interviews tells you the reason why he copies certain ideas and puts a new face to it....It's to pay HOMAGE....RESPECT to film-makers that he has fallen in love with and that have tugged at his particular artistic sence of beauty. And personally I am glad that he does. Millions of sheep out there now have the opportunity to appreciate a different use of the the medium that they wouldn't have ever seen, what with there passion for all things Schwartzenager/Stallone/Other Monosyllabic Shaved Ape.....

If he was just out there to make an easy buck all he would have to do is make a war film based on the Afagan invasion and call it "2 million Mohummads.......and only One Jesus" He'd make a KILLING!!!

But......all in all if you get so uptight about a matter as close to the heart as creative expression, (and I don't have any qualms with you feeling so strongly)...Just post once in the thread your opinion,laugh and shake your heads at those you despise, then walk away. Easy.

 

[Raving Loony]

I love Pulp Fiction, from start to finish. For me it is the dialogue that grabs me. How on earth washed up actors like Travolta and Jackson could gel so well is beyond me. For me it's up there with my all time favorites like ... A Clockwork Orange, Memento, The Godfather, Empire Strikes Back, The Matrix, Happiness, The Pianist, Being John Malcovich and LA Confidential.

In any case, if you don't like him who cares. I find movies like The Shawshank Redemption and The Usual Suspects to be very overrated, just because I don't like thrillers where everything is just wrapped up in the last five minutes. I find those just plain annoying to my intelligence.

 

[goatyoghurt]

I loved the movie, the scene with the two Japanese guys in the bar in Okinawa was hilarious, I struggled to find anything negative to say besides the excessive spurting of blood from severed limbs and decapitations. Also the fact that she had her samurai sword on her while she was on a plane was a little off-putting. These are all tiny things which detracted from how believable the movie was but overall a great film IMHO.