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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

Ever been busted by cops ?

better safe than sorry... yep
also the 22 pills thingy does not apply in victoria..... it is "intent" that they need proove for trafficking and you must proove your intent was otherwise or where feasible not to either have any knowledge of them.... or recently dicovered and intending to discard/curiosity held to show and ask friend.
 
Ok, i'll try and answer a few questions:
22 may have been the legal amount for possesion in one case, it doesn't mean it will be for all. The amount is taken into consideration by the judge (who could be a mean old anti-drugs bastard) based on your interviews with police, circumstances in which you were found, where they were found, etc.
if you are found in the middle of a nightclub with 22 pills, then sunny jim, you are getting done for a least supply, quite possibly trafficking, there will be no issue of possession because that is a commercial type situation (check my first post). That is some serious shit - maximmum penalty is about 15-20 years.
Ok, if you have dropped and you are fucked, the most the cops will do (usually - there may be variations) is to take you to the lock-up, get you examined by the doc, and possibly fine you. Most times you are left in the watchouse to cool off and let go in the morning - note: only expect this is you are absolutely fucking blitzed as normal jo blow will not get picked up, most times you can't even tell, or prove it (that well
wink.gif
).
Do you ever see smackies getting locked up when smacked off their heads in your respective cities? No? The same thing applies here, you may get a fine under the Vagrancy Act or something similar but if you've ingested, then nothing really can be done.
As for forgetting drugs are illegal, just remember to cover your ass, and keep friend's who can't keep thier mouths shut at an arm's length when something big is going down.
After saying name, address, the police can then either arrest you (if you were being naughty) or if they don't have enough and were just hassling, let you go.
You can be arrested without a warrant, and held for up to 8 hours without legal consult, or being brought before a magistrate. (That's in the Police Powers and Resposibilites Act (2000) QLD. Other states have v similar legislation).
Basically be a pain in teh ass for the cops, but it may backfire and they may let you blow off a bit of steam in the paddywagon, watchhouse, wherever. It's a double edged sword.
Eddi - Holding the pills for a friend/curiousity can still get you done for possession. As i said in post one - not knowing that they were drugs, or what type of drugs is not a defence. You only have to have control of the drugs. You can rely on the defence of mistake of fact, but relying on it is a very weak grounds.
Guys, i'm not trying to be arrogant or anything, but trust me, my first post is all based on the current caselaw and legislation in my home state, and i'm sure all your states are similar. That is what the law is, and that is what police/lawyers will be using if (heaven forbid) you ever get caught.
Don't mention your friends or anyone else when being questioned, as some people can't afford to have a criminal conviction because of loose gums. Certain practices, such as lawyers, police force, etc can not be admitted/work if they have a crim record. Also, for anyone else to get a job with a crim record it is a very hard task, especially for drugs. So take it easy and don't say a word more than you have to, and you may find that is the difference between you having 25 pills and only getting a fine for possession or getting done for trafficking for 3 pills.
Keep the thread going guys :p~
 
Ok, i'll try and answer a few questions:
22 may have been the legal amount for possesion in one case, it doesn't mean it will be for all. The amount is taken into consideration by the judge (who could be a mean old anti-drugs bastard) based on your interviews with police, circumstances in which you were found, where they were found, etc.
if you are found in the middle of a nightclub with 22 pills, then sunny jim, you are getting done for a least supply, quite possibly trafficking, there will be no issue of possession because that is a commercial type situation (check my first post). That is some serious shit - maximmum penalty is about 15-20 years.
Ok, if you have dropped and you are fucked, the most the cops will do (usually - there may be variations) is to take you to the lock-up, get you examined by the doc, and possibly fine you. Most times you are left in the watchouse to cool off and let go in the morning - note: only expect this is you are absolutely fucking blitzed as normal jo blow will not get picked up, most times you can't even tell, or prove it (that well
wink.gif
).
Do you ever see smackies getting locked up when smacked off their heads in your respective cities? No? The same thing applies here, you may get a fine under the Vagrancy Act or something similar but if you've ingested, then nothing really can be done.
As for forgetting drugs are illegal, just remember to cover your ass, and keep friend's who can't keep thier mouths shut at an arm's length when something big is going down.
After saying name, address, the police can then either arrest you (if you were being naughty) or if they don't have enough and were just hassling, let you go.
You can be arrested without a warrant, and held for up to 8 hours without legal consult, or being brought before a magistrate. (That's in the Police Powers and Resposibilites Act (2000) QLD. Other states have v similar legislation).
Basically be a pain in teh ass for the cops, but it may backfire and they may let you blow off a bit of steam in the paddywagon, watchhouse, wherever. It's a double edged sword.
Eddi - Holding the pills for a friend/curiousity can still get you done for possession. As i said in post one - not knowing that they were drugs, or what type of drugs is not a defence. You only have to have control of the drugs. You can rely on the defence of mistake of fact, but relying on it is a very weak grounds.
Guys, i'm not trying to be arrogant or anything, but trust me, my first post is all based on the current caselaw and legislation in my home state, and i'm sure all your states are similar. That is what the law is, and that is what police/lawyers will be using if (heaven forbid) you ever get caught.
Don't mention your friends or anyone else when being questioned, as some people can't afford to have a criminal conviction because of loose gums. Certain practices, such as lawyers, police force, etc can not be admitted/work if they have a crim record. Also, for anyone else to get a job with a crim record it is a very hard task, especially for drugs. So take it easy and don't say a word more than you have to, and you may find that is the difference between you having 25 pills and only getting a fine for possession or getting done for trafficking for 3 pills.
Keep the thread going guys :p~
 
Ok, i'll try and answer a few questions:
22 may have been the legal amount for possesion in one case, it doesn't mean it will be for all. The amount is taken into consideration by the judge (who could be a mean old anti-drugs bastard) based on your interviews with police, circumstances in which you were found, where they were found, etc.
if you are found in the middle of a nightclub with 22 pills, then sunny jim, you are getting done for a least supply, quite possibly trafficking, there will be no issue of possession because that is a commercial type situation (check my first post). That is some serious shit - maximmum penalty is about 15-20 years.
Ok, if you have dropped and you are fucked, the most the cops will do (usually - there may be variations) is to take you to the lock-up, get you examined by the doc, and possibly fine you. Most times you are left in the watchouse to cool off and let go in the morning - note: only expect this is you are absolutely fucking blitzed as normal jo blow will not get picked up, most times you can't even tell, or prove it (that well
wink.gif
).
Do you ever see smackies getting locked up when smacked off their heads in your respective cities? No? The same thing applies here, you may get a fine under the Vagrancy Act or something similar but if you've ingested, then nothing really can be done.
As for forgetting drugs are illegal, just remember to cover your ass, and keep friend's who can't keep thier mouths shut at an arm's length when something big is going down.
After saying name, address, the police can then either arrest you (if you were being naughty) or if they don't have enough and were just hassling, let you go.
You can be arrested without a warrant, and held for up to 8 hours without legal consult, or being brought before a magistrate. (That's in the Police Powers and Resposibilites Act (2000) QLD. Other states have v similar legislation).
Basically be a pain in teh ass for the cops, but it may backfire and they may let you blow off a bit of steam in the paddywagon, watchhouse, wherever. It's a double edged sword.
Eddi - Holding the pills for a friend/curiousity can still get you done for possession. As i said in post one - not knowing that they were drugs, or what type of drugs is not a defence. You only have to have control of the drugs. You can rely on the defence of mistake of fact, but relying on it is a very weak grounds.
Guys, i'm not trying to be arrogant or anything, but trust me, my first post is all based on the current caselaw and legislation in my home state, and i'm sure all your states are similar. That is what the law is, and that is what police/lawyers will be using if (heaven forbid) you ever get caught.
Don't mention your friends or anyone else when being questioned, as some people can't afford to have a criminal conviction because of loose gums. Certain practices, such as lawyers, police force, etc can not be admitted/work if they have a crim record. Also, for anyone else to get a job with a crim record it is a very hard task, especially for drugs. So take it easy and don't say a word more than you have to, and you may find that is the difference between you having 25 pills and only getting a fine for possession or getting done for trafficking for 3 pills.
Keep the thread going guys :p~
 
It'd be good if someone compiled a small FAQ.....*nudge*
smile.gif

------------------
You have to run as fast
as you can just to stay
where you are.
If you want to get
anywhere, you'll have to
run much faster.
--Lewis Carroll
 
eddi: just to clarify, it is the prosecution that must prove intent (beyond reasonable doubt). In court they have to lay their case out, proving both the 'actus reus' (the physical element of the crime - ie: you had the baggy on you) and the 'mens rea' (the criminal intent). Each has to be proven beyond reasonable doubt which is a damn high standard (in theory - practical not always). You are then allowed to make your defence, questioning police evidence and such so as to introduce reasonable doubt. Only in certain other defences are you required to prove anything (like insanity etc).
This is why it is incredibly important for you not to say anything outside the presence of a lawyer. If the police have no evidence as to your intent, then they can only try and infer it from the facts. You only need to create a reasonable doubt at trial to be off scott free (ie: cloak room put it there, i stole the jacket, the devil made me do it
smile.gif
etc..)
Here in vic I'm pretty sure the 8 hour thing doesn't apply, it's simply a reasonable time (usually about 4 hours from memory maybe up to 8).
If anyone's really keen I can scan the arrest section of my crim law notes.
------------------
caution: raver pr0n involving elmo... (884Kb)
 
Just a thought... it may be an idea for the bluelighters in each state to find a good lawer or two in their city/state and post them and their details here/share them with each other. Some of us may one day find ourselves in a bad position, and having the details of a competent lawyer with us would help greatly.
 
Great Thread guys thanks for some realy usefull info!
Not that I ever intend on getting caught!
All I can say is its probably best to sort your shit out before you go out! don't be the one carrying 10pills for all your buddies into a club! make sure everyone has them before you leave.
Most the time I find that cops won't even have a clue your up to anything "Bad" if you just act normaly! its usualy your own paranoia that will give you away!
 
Id just like to make a small point as to what factors, aside from quantity, guide the police in their actions after you have been caught.
Twice I have been caught with a small amoutn of drugs on me. Once a two pills the other time a 50 of pot. On both occassions after they had established the drugs were mine the immediate questions they asked were.
"have u been in trouble with the police before?"- always say no to this one
"Do you have a job?"- which i do
"do you go to uni?"- showed them my student card
both occassions they took the drugs adn my name and let me walk
Friends of mine with different backgrounds, who are unemployed who have been caught with similair amounts of drugs have been searched totally and arrested. It sucks.
This now seems pointless, it seemed like a good point when i started writing
------------------
"A witty saying proves nothing" - Voltaire
 
I think acid_reign is onto something there. Maybe pundi, supaspeed and the other law students/lawyers on this board (I know there's a couple of others) could get together and compile a simple faq to stick up in the faq in the drug discussion menu page (that everyone should have read).
But I think it's pretty obvious that there's a few points to follow:
-sort your stuff out before you go (try not to be the one carrying all the pills for your mates, you'd realise it's alot easier to meetup before and sort it out if you happened to get caught).
-if you are out and have a spare pill, always deny that you have anything to anyone and dont sell or give it to anyone (duh).
-if anyone asks you what you've had I always say 'not much' because nothing really can be implied from that.
-preferably dont carry your pills in little seperate baggies or pieces of foil (will only make you look more guilty of trafficking).
-if you do happen to be requested a search by a cop ask 'what do you suspect me of' or 'why are you searching me' and remember every detail of the situation possible (remember always make the cops work, dont just give in... also try to get their name and rank).
-if you are detained (they have to charge you with something to detain you so remember to ask them what they are charging you with)the golden rule is Name and Address until you get your lawyer, nothing else (and the stupidest thing you could do is provide false details).
------------------
Have fun - Play safe
[This message has been edited by Munchee (edited 11 June 2001).]
 
Maybe in the holidays i can write up a FAQ/Outline for QLD and WA.. each state is different, therefore VIC is a little different from NSW, which is different from QLD. Perthies, your criminal code is based on the Queensland one, therefore most of the stuff i've mentioned applies to you too.
smile.gif

Ok, if you are interested, queensland has made it really easy to navigate the laws, and you can check them out at www.qld.gov.au under the "legislation" heading.
The two relevent acts are:
The Drugs Misuse Act (1986) which covers, production, supply, trafficking, possession, possession instrumnets (bongs, needles), possession property from drug trade, etc. The major (schedule 1) drugs are heroin, coke, LSD and PCP. All other drugs are schedule 2 which means lesser penalties. As a note, to worsen the offence, the cut off amount of amphetamines is 2 grams to up the charges. Scary stuff.
The second legislation is the Police Powers and Responsibilities Act (2000) which sets out the police's powers to search, arrest without warrant, detain, etc. The relevant sections to look for are s198(1) and ALL of chapter 7.
These pieces of legislation make a good read for ANYONE ANYWHERE, as this is mostly just codified law that operates as the common law (judge made law, not made by parliament)elsewhere. Read the PPRA to know what you are up against at least, it's not as hard to read as you would think.
Something to note though, is that everything in the PPRA is a guide only, and just because the police breach those sections, does not mean you will get off, as the Judge has the discretion to choose a course of action for the case.
As for questioning, the PPRA states that you must be informed that you can have a friend/lawyer there, an interpreter if you need one, only be questioned for 4/8hours of detention, and various other civil rights.
just remember, dont be too much of a prick to the cops, as minor stuff you may only get a kick in the as, but if it is serious, don NOT be cocky, just co-operate with name and address then silence. this can not be stressed enough.
smile.gif
L.
 
Don't be a prick to the cops at all.
Call them Sir/Maam. Don't have an attitude. They have the power and if you do something to make them dislike you they'll use that power, simply because it's fun. Alot of police like to feel big. If you only have a small amount of drugs on you and it seems like you might be let off, cry, piss your pants, apologise, call yourself stupid, talk about what your parents are going to do to you, cup your face in your hands, etc. I've gotten off *very* lightly for other crimes using some of these techniques. haha, makes me think, my friend got busted for some serious shop lifting(around 1500) and he started crying and punching his face "because he was so stupid" when the cops were busting him and they eventually let him go without even a caution.
------------------
You have to run as fast as you can just to stay where you are.
If you want to get anywhere you'll have to run much faster.
--Lewis Carroll
 
Good call on the "Say Sorry" idea. It's saved me once before too (not a drug thing though). And I'll also back up the statement that it really helps if you have a job and go to uni...
smile.gif

I've got another question too: If in a legal search the cops can strip you down to your underpants (that's right isn't it?), what happens if you're not wearing any underwear? Seriously! That'd be an interesting situation (but embarrasing if it gets to court)!
smile.gif
 
Ummm, it's probably not always best to say sorry. By admitting your sorry, you are admitting guilt (unless you have a damn fine lawyer). I do agree that it is all situational, and that it's really a judgement call as to whether it will work. You do however have to be damn careful. I learnt this the hard way after being hit by a car. I was the one to say sorry, and it cost me a small pile of drugs (or money, they're the same thing
smile.gif
). If I hadn't said it then I would have probably been able to deflect most liability.
This is one of the reasons the government is soooo keen not to say sorry to the aboriginal population. If it did then it can be construed as an admission of guilt, therefore leading to liability. (note: I'm for reconcilliation despite this, but then thats a whole different topic)
Pleon: sorry can't help you much in the legallity of the no underpants scenario, I have barely touched on that legal area
smile.gif
.
Another good link for everyone else that has already been posted on this site a few times is www.austlii.edu.au.
------------------
caution: raver pr0n involving elmo... (884Kb)
 
Actually, good point. I now change my statement to be:
Don't say sorry, but look sorry...
smile.gif
 
ok, I have no idea how true this is, but i thought it sounded interesting. i heard from a friend that if you are approached by someone while out (club/rave etc) and they start asking you questions about what you have taken etc if you ask them if they are a cop, and they are, but they lie and say no, they cant use what you say against you. as i said before i am not saying that this is factual but maybe someone does know if there is any truth in this...
 
talitha: I'm not sure about this, but I haven't heard it in any of my studies. I still wouldn't think it would work anyway. It probably fits somewhere in the urban myth category, because how do police infiltrate large drug organisations. Even if its true there are ways around it..
Scenario: You ask a guy if he's a cop, and he says no and you tell him all about your drug situation. He then walks away and tells his partner, because he actually is a cop, that you're a dodgy dude. This cop walks over and searches you, based on an anonymous tip. The first cop dissappears never to be seen or heard from again. Just my spin on the situation anyway.
The best advice is to probably not talk about drugs with anyone you don't know. If they ask just state that your 'sorted' and then ask them what they do for a living, what party they last went to or where did they learn to dance so divinely. If it's the first thing they want to talk about then it's probably best to avoid it. The random stories you get are probably better too
smile.gif
.
------------------
caution: raver pr0n involving elmo... (884Kb)
 
Anyone know what happens if 2 pills arrive at your house in the mail from overseas? Do you get busted for importation? Is there any way you can get out of it, or are you definately going to do time (and how long)?
 
3-30boyx: Firstly, it simply ain't worth the hassle for two pills. Customs officers are probably more pedantic than your average cop, and your running the risk of having the sniffer drugs go over it.
If you get caught you will not only get done for possession, you will most likely get done for importation. It is however unlikely that you will do jail time (unless you've got a previous record). The amount of MDMA considered to be a traffikable amount under federal acts is 0.5 grams (not sure whether this is pill weight or MDMA weight).
My advice is don't bother, you would have to be paying me before I would want them sent to me. Domestic mail is slightly different.
----------------
Update:
From a federal point of view you will probably get done for breach of this secion:
CUSTOMS ACT 1901 SECT 233B: Special provisions with respect to narcotic goods and assuming you are found to have less than a traffikable amount the penalty is $2000 or less fine or/and 2 years imprisonment
You might also be nailed with this section, which can include prison time (2 years). CRIMES ACT 1914 SECT 85W (Cth): Causing narcotic substances to be carried by post. Again don't do it...
wink.gif

[This message has been edited by pundi (edited 12 June 2001).]
 
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