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Conspiracies Epstein Dies in Custody - Alleged Suicide, Some Speculate it was a Hit Job

alasdairm said:
you're wasting your time jess. anything that fits? part of the conspiracy! any thing that doesn't fit? faked as part of the conspiracy!
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What do you think happened here? I know you're probably not confident enough to state your opinion publicly, but are you leaning more towards solo suicide or foul play?

JessFR said:
This still doesn't solve the fundamental problem I see here. Which is why allow people to know of the broken cameras which makes it look mega suspect.
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Because it would be more suspect to claim that there were not any cameras at all. That is just beyond ludicrous.
The cameras malfunctioning at that exact moment is also ludicrous but not as much, it's theoretically possible.
And look -they're going to get away with it. This goes so high that there's nothing anyone can do. And because we've consistently seen so many incidents of BLATANT corruption (like Comey absolving Hillary of crimes due to "no intent", Jussie Smollett having all his charges dropped), people will just forget about this one if the media doesn't stay on it, which they won't. It's pretty much a fact that powerful people operate under different rules to the rest of us and often dodge criminal charges or uncomfortable situations. That goes extra for people that have dirt on extremely powerful people.
Epstein needed to be released (like his first sweetheart deal) or killed to remain quiet (as he could've ratted out people for a lesser sentence).

So your questions of why why why?
The answer is - because it doesn't really matter and they'll get away with it anyway.
 
Jeffrey Epstein's 'fixer' who ran major modelling agency vanishes 'like a ghost'
www.mirror.co.uk

Jeffrey Epstein's 'fixer' who ran major modelling agency vanishes 'like a ghost'

EXCLUSIVE: Frenchman Jean-Luc Brunel, 72, denied any wrong-doing in connection to Jeffrey Epstein, but now he has disappeared like a "ghost"
www.mirror.co.uk www.mirror.co.uk

EXCLUSIVE: Frenchman Jean-Luc Brunel, 72, denied any wrong-doing in connection to Jeffrey Epstein, but now he has disappeared like a "ghost"
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Millionaire model agency boss thought to have key information into the Jeffrey Epstein scandal 'has disappeared like a ghost without a trace'
www.dailymail.co.uk

Millionaire thought to have key info on Epstein scandal vanishes

Jean-Luc Brunel, 72, has vanished as police seek to find out whether or not convicted paedophile Jeffrey Epstein abused girls 'sourced' from Paris.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk

A millionaire model agency boss who is thought to have key information about the Jeffrey Epstein scandal 'has disappeared like a ghost without a trace'.
Jean-Luc Brunel, 72, has vanished as police seek to ask the Frenchman 'urgent' questions about the paedophile.
Investigators are making enquiries in Brazil, the US and Europe and French prosecutors are also pursuing claims relating to the financier, who died aged 66 before he could face the latest allegations.
A friend of Prince Andrew, predator Epstein killed himself in jail on August 10 as he faced child sex trafficking charges.
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JGrimez said:
So your questions of why why why?
The answer is - because it doesn't really matter and they'll get away with it anyway.
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Boom. I'm thinking that sometimes if it sounds like a duck, looks like a duck, quacks like a duck... its a duck. Who tied the knot? Or was this guy genuinely embarrassed of the things he was being accused of? Doubtful, because he was so widely known as this rich pedo.
 
JGrimez said:
I know you're probably not confident enough to state your opinion publicly...
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you wrongly assume yet again.

if you bothered to read my posts in the thread - rather than just assume you know what i think because of personal opinion and bias - you'd know the answer to this.

:(

alasdair
 
Uhh @JGrimez. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the case that they ARE saying there was no camera in his cell.

They aren't saying there was a camera in his cell but it broke, they're saying there were two cameras in the hall, but that one or both of them malfunctioned in some way.

What I'm asking, is why confirm that for us? It was initially a rumor. How does it help cover this up to confirm that it's true?

As for it doesn't really matter and they'll get away with anyway. Are you saying that this huge conspiracy that always gets away with it just decides to do things on a whim? Even if it hurts them? Just cause, why not?

What kinda answer is that. They're huge, hyper competent, able to manipulate and orchistrate anything. But ALSO just do things at random.

You're always saying to look at the evidence. Now suddenly when something contradicts your theory, it's suddenly "who cares, they just decided to do it cause it doesn't matter I guess".

You're right, people will forget about this provided it doesn't stay in the news. So are the news controlled by the conspiracy or not? If they are, then why make the suicide so publicized?

And if they don't control the news it makes even less sense that they'd confirm the camera malfunction and provide more news fodder.

It sure as hell sounds from where I'm looking that alasdairm is right. You just accept anything that helps your theory and ignore the rest.
 
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no, it's not necessary parts of conspiracy. Everyone knows there are cameras everywhere, you can't NOT say anything about the cameras - it's the first thing a logical person would ask about. Ok, assuming the footage on these cameras shows either a) a suspect who should be under watch completely unattended, or, alternately - b) someone entering the cell. Well, in either of those cases, it's going to be bad to release said footage. You can't assert there are no camerase in MCC lockup, so you say those cameras have "malfunctioned" or something similar and get them out. This is 100% out of the playbook of dictatatorial regimes. Cameras "fail" ALL THE TIME in russia, for example. And DOJ could clear a lot of this up with just some forthcoming press releases, which are nowhere to be seen.
 
You can't assert that there are no cameras at all. But you can assert that there are no cameras in the cell itself that would capture the suicide.

If you don't believe that, I'd like some evidence for the proposition that there would definitely be a camera in the cell.

As for cameras outside the cell. You could simply say the cameras show noone going in or out. There's no obligation to release the footage.

Obviously if there is a conspiracy and he was murdered you're not gonna want to release the footage. But I would argue that just not releasing it when you don't have too is much less harmful to maintaining the cover than saying there was a camera that just so happened to be broken.

And saying there was a camera that just so happened to be broken is also still less harmful to maintaining the cover than also launching a show investigation over it. Which is also not something they're really obligated to do.

And you can't argue "they want to do it because it looks better" when it's more complicated and still looks worse than just saying that the cameras showed nothing, and moving on and getting it out of the news.
 
alasdairm said:
if you bothered to read my posts in the thread
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Sorry for not remembering every single post that I read on this forum.

alasdairm said:
rather than just assume you know what i think because of personal opinion and bias - you'd know the answer to this.
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Instead of bloviating a pointless post you could have just re-iterated what you said earlier.

I'm going to assume that you will not repeat your stance - prove me wrong.
 
JessFR said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the case that they ARE saying there was no camera in his cell.
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Are you going to believe that there was no camera in the cell of arguably the most important prisoner in the world in a max security federal prison? Doesn't seem plausible, TO ME anyway. But I'm a crazy conspiracy theorist who believes wacko possibilities.

JessFR said:
As for it doesn't really matter and they'll get away with anyway. Are you saying that this huge conspiracy that always gets away with it just decides to do things on a whim? Even if it hurts them? Just cause, why not?
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Look they have to say something. So they'll go with the more believable cover story (if we're saying this was a plot).

JessFR said:
They're huge, hyper competent, able to manipulate and orchistrate anything. But ALSO just do things at random.
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I don't know if you were following the Vegas shooting closely, but the police altered their stories multiple times, sometimes after being caught out in lies. To me anyway, constantly changing stories can be a tad suspicious.

JessFR said:
You're right, people will forget about this provided it doesn't stay in the news. So are the news controlled by the conspiracy or not? If they are, then why make the suicide so publicized?
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This is an impossible to ignore story because of the gravity of it. I'm not sure if you know about the Friday News Dump but often they'll drop damaging stories late on a Friday so everyone's already left the office and are in weekend mode so they may not hear about it until the next week. It's a way to lessen the blow and they'll use this tactic often.

JessFR said:
It sure as hell sounds from where I'm looking that alasdairm is right. You just accept anything that helps your theory and ignore the rest.
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It amuses me a little that you guys are saying this stuff because regarding this case, you look like the conspiracy theorist (i.e. offering an unbelievable explanation). Political assassinations are a common fact of reality, however the details of this case.....?
 
What we know know:

1. The guards watching Epstein did not check on him the entire night he died.
2. The guards falsified the jail records to show that they were checking on him when they were not.
3. One of the guards on duty was not actually a corrections officer.
4. Epstein's cellmate was transferred out of his cell the day before he died.
5. Days before that so-called suicide, Epstein transferred his fortune into a trust, so it could not be accessed by his accusers in civil court.
6. The bones broken in Epstein's neck - the hyoid bone. Yes it can happen when someone hangs themselves. But we're told that it's very rare, and much more common when the case is a strangulation homicide.
7. We now know at least one camera in the hallway of his cell has footage that is "unusable", but no one's saying why.

At this point I think it's fair to say that anyone who believes that all of this is just simply a coincidence is kidding themselves.

MSM is not very honest with their coverage either.

A New York Times report shows that news outlets like Forbes, The National Review and HuffPo accepted money after Epstein's 2008 guilty plea to sex with an underage girl to run stories meant to reform his image. These stories were multiple puff pieces casting the deceased financier as an intelligent and selfless businessman with a passion for science. Those articles failed to mention his criminal past or current controversies. All 3 articles referenced since that report have been deleted but the NYT included quotes from each. The 2013 Forbes article praised him as "one of the largest backers of cutting-edge science around the world". National Review piece from same year called him "a smart businessman with a passion for cutting-edge science". The HuffPo article in 2017 credited him for taking action to help a number of scientists thrive during the "Trump era".

So what we need to ask ourselves is why would we believe any news outlet like CNN or Vox that now suddenly wants to attack anyone who questions how Jeffrey Epstein died or his intelligence community connections?
Where were these outlets for years when Epstein's victims had no voice? When they chose not to report on his non-existent prison sentence - or when they chose to ignore the Presidents, the Princes and the powerful that Epstein surrounded himself even as he continued to abuse young girls.

Personally I'm inclined to more believe the people that were reporting on the real stuff for years (and many are being purged from social media).
 
alasdairm said:
you're wasting your time jess. anything that fits? part of the conspiracy! any thing that doesn't fit? faked as part of the conspiracy!
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This implies that you agree with Jess, who I believe maintains a ludicrous stance. If I'm wrong then you're just being a provocateur and I'd politely ask you to knock it off.
 
i agree with jess that you accept data which fits your narrative and reject data that doesn't. it wouldn't be a problem if you didn't frequently criticize others for same.

i think it's clear there's foul play here - he was allowed to kill himself or he was killed.

again, which 'unbelievable explanation' am i offering?

alasdair
 
JGrimez said:
What we know know:

1. The guards watching Epstein did not check on him the entire night he died.
2. The guards falsified the jail records to show that they were checking on him when they were not.
3. One of the guards on duty was not actually a corrections officer.
4. Epstein's cellmate was transferred out of his cell the day before he died.
5. Days before that so-called suicide, Epstein transferred his fortune into a trust, so it could not be accessed by his accusers in civil court.
6. The bones broken in Epstein's neck - the hyoid bone. Yes it can happen when someone hangs themselves. But we're told that it's very rare, and much more common when the case is a strangulation homicide.
7. We now know at least one camera in the hallway of his cell has footage that is "unusable", but no one's saying why.

At this point I think it's fair to say that anyone who believes that all of this is just simply a coincidence is kidding themselves.

MSM is not very honest with their coverage either.

A New York Times report shows that news outlets like Forbes, The National Review and HuffPo accepted money after Epstein's 2008 guilty plea to sex with an underage girl to run stories meant to reform his image. These stories were multiple puff pieces casting the deceased financier as an intelligent and selfless businessman with a passion for science. Those articles failed to mention his criminal past or current controversies. All 3 articles referenced since that report have been deleted but the NYT included quotes from each. The 2013 Forbes article praised him as "one of the largest backers of cutting-edge science around the world". National Review piece from same year called him "a smart businessman with a passion for cutting-edge science". The HuffPo article in 2017 credited him for taking action to help a number of scientists thrive during the "Trump era".

So what we need to ask ourselves is why would we believe any news outlet like CNN or Vox that now suddenly wants to attack anyone who questions how Jeffrey Epstein died or his intelligence community connections?
Where were these outlets for years when Epstein's victims had no voice? When they chose not to report on his non-existent prison sentence - or when they chose to ignore the Presidents, the Princes and the powerful that Epstein surrounded himself even as he continued to abuse young girls.

Personally I'm inclined to more believe the people that were reporting on the real stuff for years (and many are being purged from social media).
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4 and 5 aren't evidence of murder. They're just as plausible with suicide. And as for 6...

We have the same problem again. WHY do we know that if it's a huge conspiracy? What, they can control the whole prison but not one autopsy report? How does telling us that benefit the conspiracy?

Which brings me back to the part of my post you keep skipping over.

They have to say something about what the cameras saw, yes, I agree.

Why do they have to say they were broken instead of just didn't show anything? How does that make sense with a conspiracy that wishes to remain covert?

And what of the FBI investigation into the cameras? Either they control the FBI, in which case this adds even more complexity to the cover up for no reason, or they don't, in which case saying the cameras were broken is even stupider.
 
For the record, I'm not saying that it's not plausible that there could not have been a conspiracy to murder him, only that it's not plausible that it's this kind of ultra huge hyper competent conspiracy that conspiracy theorists love.

If this were that, he'd have commited suicide, and we'd have no reason to doubt it apart from Grimez insistence that there's simply no way they could have been so incompetent as to enable him to kill himself.

Personally I don't accept a level of incompetence beyond the capability of our government. Our governments capacity for incompetence is boundless. :)
 
JessFR said:
Why do they have to say they were broken instead of just didn't show anything? How does that make sense with a conspiracy that wishes to remain covert?
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Think. If they didn't show anything we'd ask to see the footage. So they have to say the footage is "unusable".

JessFR said:
And what of the FBI investigation into the cameras? Either they control the FBI, in which case this adds even more complexity to the cover up for no reason, or they don't, in which case saying the cameras were broken is even stupider.
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The FBI are obviously compromised. Nor only did Comey commit obstruction of justice to keep Hillary out of prison for mishandling classified information, but the FBI was also weaponized and used false intel to secure a surveillance wiretap against a US presidential candidate. If they're willing to do this and then get away with it - then I think they can handle this Epstein business.

The conspiracy is being exposed right in front of our eyes. Enjoy the show ;)
 
JGrimez said:
Think. If they didn't show anything we'd ask to see the footage. So they have to say the footage is "unusable".


The FBI are obviously compromised. Nor only did Comey commit obstruction of justice to keep Hillary out of prison for mishandling classified information, but the FBI was also weaponized and used false intel to secure a surveillance wiretap against a US presidential candidate. If they're willing to do this and then get away with it - then I think they can handle this Epstein business.

The conspiracy is being exposed right in front of our eyes. Enjoy the show ;)
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People can ask for the footage all they want. That doesn't mean they have to release it. Explain to me how not releasing the footage is more suspicious than the cameras being broken.

While you're at it, can you also explain to me why they told us about his broken neck. Why did we find that out? How does that benefit the coverup? And if it doesn't, why weren't they able to keep it quiet?
 
It's too obvious to say they won't show the footage of a man who was the subject of an investigation hanging himself, but it's not to say the cameras suspiciously happened to not be working?

OK.

So what about the broken neck. Why do we know that, why did they let us find that out?
 
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