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Tech Elon Musk reveals new details about Neuralink

I don’t care where or whom this is coming from it’s potential for good is definitely there, but will likely be used for evil developments as well. I neither like or hate Elon musk, but I have warmed up to him since he’s called out some of the oligarchs. Also mainstream neo liberal propaganda attacking makes me think he has to be doing something right. A simple mention of this guys name on Reddit has every rad lib insta seething.
 
I don’t care where or whom this is coming from it’s potential for good is definitely there, but will likely be used for evil developments as well. I neither like or hate Elon musk, but I have warmed up to him since he’s called out some of the oligarchs. Also mainstream neo liberal propaganda attacking makes me think he has to be doing something right. A simple mention of this guys name on Reddit has every rad lib insta seething.
Nobody is complaining about KIWI or Neuralink being a bad thing.

but I have warmed up to him since he’s called out some of the oligarchs
So easy to warm up to you then ;) about every single human being has called oligarchs out. Also Musk is like the personification of capitalism and is provably a neoliberal (the 'goal' justifies the means), hundreds of examples.

Also, I don't know what media you are consuming, I see a lot of ass kissing, also by Redditors, the tide is turning because people are slowly starting to see through his shit. Don't confuse things. Anti neoliberalism, anti establishment and somehow pro Musk? Things don't compute brother. :D
 


=D

I dislike the man so much, he's my Trump :) the comparison stands as I insist on consuming stories and content on him. In a sense it's pretty sad but I don't care, it's also a lot of fun and I learn a thing or two.
 
Nobody is complaining about KIWI or Neuralink being a bad thing.


So easy to warm up to you then ;) about every single human being has called oligarchs out. Also Musk is like the personification of capitalism and is provably a neoliberal (the 'goal' justifies the means), hundreds of examples.

Also, I don't know what media you are consuming, I see a lot of ass kissing, also by Redditors, the tide is turning because people are slowly starting to see through his shit. Don't confuse things. Anti neoliberalism, anti establishment and somehow pro Musk? Things don't compute brother. :D
From what I’ve seen the neo liberal establishment has more hit pieces and bad things to say about him than good. I admittedly don’t follow this stuff super closely, but he definitely tends to make most liberals seethe on social media from everything I’ve seen.
 
From what I’ve seen the neo liberal establishment has more hit pieces and bad things to say about him than good. I admittedly don’t follow this stuff super closely, but he definitely tends to make most liberals seethe on social media from everything I’ve seen.
Well yeah, through all the scandals, lies and failures it's definitely hard to find positive things to report on. That said, there sure is a lot of ass kissing, but when it comes to actual events there has to be some objectivity.
For once I gladly join the madness :)
 
Well yeah, through all the scandals, lies and failures it's definitely hard to find positive things to report on. That said, there sure is a lot of ass kissing, but when it comes to actual events there has to be some objectivity.
For once I gladly join the madness :)
There’s got to be something good there if the establishment hates him enough to influence propaganda campaigns though 🤔
 
There’s got to be something good there if the establishment hates him enough to influence propaganda campaigns though 🤔
No, I mentioned propaganda because Tesla is basically 'at war' with the CCP, anti Tesla (justified btw) propaganda due to some incidents, but it's obviously with the intention of not having competition for a growing EV market in China. If anything Musk is great friends with the establishment if all the government and Pentagon contracts and tax cuts are an indication.
 
No, I mentioned propaganda because Tesla is basically 'at war' with the CCP, anti Tesla (justified btw) propaganda due to some incidents, but it's obviously with the intention of not having competition for a growing EV market in China. If anything Musk is great friends with the establishment if all the government and Pentagon contracts and tax cuts are an indication.
If he were in good with the establishment there wouldn’t be a propaganda campaign against him. He doesn’t tend to do or say the things they want of him rather has a mind of his own, which isn’t acceptable to the current technocratic oligarchy running things. He definitely is getting the trump treatment.
 
If he were in good with the establishment there wouldn’t be a propaganda campaign against him. He doesn’t tend to do or say the things they want of him rather has a mind of his own, which isn’t acceptable to the current technocratic oligarchy running things. He definitely is getting the trump treatment.
But there is no propaganda campaign against him in the US, quite the opposite, he's actually hosting SNL next week. The US wouldn't do this because e.g. SpaceX has several running contracts. The media reports on Tesla and Elon Musk and whatever, and does this because things actually happen, and there's not a hidden agenda behind everything.
It's China that is leading a propaganda campaign against him, however soft. Why? Because ultimately they want Tesla out of China.

He doesn’t tend to do or say the things they want of him rather has a mind of his own, which isn’t acceptable to the current technocratic oligarchy running things.
Source? I'm gonna need articles here. I don't see at all how he's getting the Trump treatment.

And even then, criticism of his companies, past behavior and criminal activity is totally unrelated to whatever media campaign there would be. I'd like to discuss how you arrived at the anti Musk campaign conclusion but we better leave Musk himself out of it.
 
I don't think he'll be able to keep it up for many more years, his Full Self Driving lie can't stand for 5 more years
Man this timing was fantastic.



After years of lies, Musk realizes what any undergrad computer science student would've told him :) he's admitted it. Looking forward to reading about how shit the next FSD beta will be like, but hopefully with no dead people this time.
 
So he wants us to revamp our entire road system to appeal to literal fucking robots; no thanks.

If Musk ever tries to take over the world the guy at the start of this vid will be the one to take him down.
 
This is truly fucking disturbing, a true Orwellian horror beyond any other. Though, it almost certainly will never happen. Why? First off, changing the way the brain works artificially doesn't work like he's saying, as most here are already familiar with. If a chemist couldn't cook up a drug that has a certain specific effect on the brain that's guaranteed to happen exactly as expected, why would the same be possible with a device? There probably would be an element of unpredictability, which could be huge.

Whatever the chip did would probably affect different people differently, just like a drug affects different people differently. That would very likely prevent the Orwellian horror from actually materializing. Thousands and thousands of new research chemicals have been created, which can dramatically alter the way the brain works. But how many of them do the same thing to everyone? None of them. Because everyone's brain is wired differently. In all probability, Elon Musk's horrifying Orwellian device will simply not work.

If it does, then people will almost always want NOTHING to do with it. There are still people who will just walk around coughing and coughing away in the grocery store with no mask, and I unfortunately happened to be standing in line literally right next to one of them this morning. Thankfully, I got the shot and so did everyone else in the house, so I'm not worried about it or anything. But the fact that some people will so blatantly flout the rules with simple things like "wear a mask because there's a pandemic" and "stay home if you're sick" means that people won't get a brain microchip.
 
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Our technology is extremely far off from creating a mind control chip. Not only do we lack knowledge about how the brain actually works (like a code for it which includes fine grained information), which is necessary for "mind control", we likely lack computer hardware to figure it out, and we lack hardware that would actually be able to regulate consciousness. And on top of that we need to consider indeed massive individual differences, the implantation procedure, charging etc...

So we would require crazy innovation in multiple fields and domains, for 'mind control' to be even a far off possibility, I don't see it happening, but I will resist anyone ever wanting to drill my skull open nonetheless :D especially if the company is owned by Musk, but that goes without saying.

I think we have a tendency to overrate ourselves, we're only sedentary for 20k years or something, with some luck we're here in another 20k years and then we'll talk...
 
Just read this article about the Blue Brain Project, which even mentioned Neuralink as an example of overblown claims.
@Buzz Lightbeer

The Fading Dream of the Computer Brain
Twelve years ago, when I graduated college, I was well aware of the Silicon Valley hype machine, but I considered the salesmanship of private tech companies a world away from objective truths about human biology I had been taught in neuroscience classes. At the time, I saw the neuroscientist Henry Markram proclaim in a TED talk that he had figured out a way to simulate an entire human brain on supercomputers within 10 years. This computer-simulated organ would allow scientists to instantly and noninvasively test new treatments for disorders and diseases, moving us from research that depends on animal experimentation and delicate interventions on living people to an “in silico” approach to neuroscience.
My 22-year-old mind didn’t clock this as an overhyped proposal. Instead, it felt exciting and daring, the kind of moment that transforms a distant scientific pipe dream into a suddenly tangible goal and motivates funders and fellow researchers to think bigger. And so I began a 10-year documentary project following Markram and his Blue Brain Project, with the start of the film coinciding with the beginning of an era of big neuroscience where the humming black boxes produced by Silicon Valley came to be seen as the great new hope for making sense of the black boxes between our ears.

My decade-long journey documenting Markram’s vision has no clear answers except perhaps one: that flashy presentations and sheer ambition are poor indicators of success when it comes to understanding the complex biological mechanisms of brains. Today, as we bear witness to a game of Pong being mind-controlled by a monkey as part of a typically bombastic demonstration by Elon Musk’s start-up Neuralink, there is more of a need than ever to unwind the cycles of hype in order to grapple with what the future of brain technology and neuroscience have in store for humanity.

Hype of these sorts often relies on a selective amnesia for the unfulfilled promises of the past so that enthusiasm around scientific and technological progress can be replenished anew. My own initial excitement for the promises of the Blue Brain Project lingers with me, but has been folded into a messier, more complicated experience. The criticisms and technological limitations I encountered over the decade following Markram’s TED talk have rendered each new neuro hype cycle into a potent reminder of those early enthusiasms and the danger of mishandling them.

My first shift in thinking occurred around three years into my time documenting the Blue Brain Project. Things weren’t going as planned: there were magnificent fly-through visualizations of the first square millimeter of simulated rat brain set to The Blue Danube available in a visitor’s screening room, but a definite lack of progress along the road map towards a human brain. Soon, there was talk of a necessary, larger endeavor known as the Human Brain Project that would require more money but would finally provide the resources necessary to achieve the goal. Proposals were submitted and the project won a billion euros in funding from the European Union, only to then be mired in controversy a year later after an open letter was signed by over 800 neuroscientists disagreeing with the core vision of how to simulate a human brain and objecting to the leadership style of its originator and director, Markram.

As scientific controversy and interpersonal fallout gradually made clear to me that the 10-year plan to recreate a human brain on a computer had perhaps been a pipe dream all along, I started to interview more critics of the endeavor, and began to examine in greater detail what it even meant to say you wanted to do such a thing. Princeton neuroscientist Sebastian Seung had posed a question to me during our interview that over time had come to vex me, pointing to scientific, ethical and moral pitfalls that this work was hurtling toward: “I would ask you this,” Seung had begun, turning the question onto my own time so far filming at the Blue Brain Project and the nature of the piece of simulated mouse brain that project researchers had rendered in dazzling visualizations. “They showed you a simulation of some neural activity inside this. Suppose it looked different; how would you know that that was wrong or right?” Sitting behind the camera, I replied, “Well, I wouldn’t know.” Seung reiterated: “Right, how would anybody know what was a wrong activity pattern or right activity pattern?”

The problems arrive when one begins to interrogate what “right” would entail in this situation, for recreating a profoundly noisy biological system inside the circuits of a perfectly programmed machine seems to eventually reach a fundamental platform issue. Biology runs on a motor of unpredictable “mistakes”—known as mutations—that generate the variability seen across individuals in a species and interact with our environment to drive evolutionary change through natural selection. Neurons are also known to be noisy elements, generating action potentials that are far from perfectly predictable events. In computers, on the other hand, structural mistakes, known as “bugs,” are quickly fixed to make way for the perfect code for the task at hand.

Certainly, many elements of a human brain can be modeled, probed and have their generalities extracted, just as we’ve done for the human heart in order to create a device that could function in my body or yours, keeping us alive. But when it comes to building a full simulation of an individual human brain, which would “have a consciousness” and “would speak languages,” as Markram had told me in our first interview, how would the determinate system of software running on computers ever capture the truly unpredictable mistakes seen at every level of biological life, from mutations in our DNA to the activity at a synapse?

Though the scientists I interviewed over the years shared a range of perspectives on the thorny issues of noise and chaos in computer simulations of biology, it wasn’t until I conducted an interview with a more junior neuroscientist at the Blue Brain Project that I heard an answer that cut through the positivist public-relations gloss. Asked how one would ever find the “right” kind of variability in a simulation of a biological organism, she replied: “That’s a good question, because the right kind, we can never know what’s the right kind of variability.”

If we can never know the right kind of variability, it seems that what we’re really talking about in efforts to simulate biological structures on computers is a digital system that does exactly what its creators want it to do. Taking cues from AI, computational neuroscience is gradually leaving behind biological brains in search of perfect algorithms, which like its cousins in deep learning, may ultimately produce more black boxes that execute tasks but remain internally inscrutable.


In the halls of server farms and neuroscience labs intent on reproducing biological function on digital machines, ethical accountability for the identity of the simulation then becomes a central issue. Far from reaching an objective reconstruction of “the human brain,” simulations of neural activity will ultimately hold a mirror up to the biases of their creators. And when it comes to tech companies that believe understanding a system is not essential to manipulating it or reproducing a version of it for profit, what will that mean when the system in question is the human brain?

One of Markram’s motivations for wanting to accelerate neuroscience towards a full simulation of a human brain was the helplessness he felt when confronted by his son’s autism diagnosis. Indeed, for many researchers in the field, the intentions behind the work can be deeply personal and, at least in theory, widely beneficial—which is why I remain drawn to the capability for improving the human condition enabled by experimentation and scientific ambition. Yet as technology races ahead and a certain strain of technocratic salesmanship continues to command the collective human ear, the line between fiction and reality will continue to be blurred, leading to cycles of hype and disappointment that threaten long-term public confidence in science.

This article originally appeared in Scientific American. This is a link to what appears a clipping service that reposted the article.
(I can’t get the Scientific American link on my browser from my newsfeed.)
 
Thanks @cduggles great article! Some additional difficulties brought up even...

Yet as technology races ahead and a certain strain of technocratic salesmanship continues to command the collective human ear, the line between fiction and reality will continue to be blurred, leading to cycles of hype and disappointment that threaten long-term public confidence in science.
Uff great Elon burn.

I tend to be always extremely skeptical when it comes to extreme technological advances (interplanetary race, AI takeover, mind control etc), always a lot of buzz words which ultimately is counter productive and frankly ridiculous. I really liked the point about 'selective amnesia' as well, we can approach it from all sorts of ways but specifically with the rise of internet and computers we all grew up with these dystopian images of the year 2020 and whatever and look at us :D where are the flying cars! We still have our jobs, and we're not communicating with Mars colonies...
 
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