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Ecstasy kills 18-year-old

superbabydoc

superbabydoc

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Full article appears in Europe, UK and Africa Drug Discussion

Mods: I realise this is double posting, but given the unusual specifics of the death, and the fact that EUA Drug Discussion is not a high traffic forum, I thought it warranted posting here too. Hope that is OK.
 
Full Article

Ecstasy kills 18-year-old

Wendy Papas had taken one of the biggest doses ever recorded
A "perfectly normal" young woman died after taking one of the biggest doses of the drug ecstasy ever recorded.
Shop worker Wendy Papas, 18, was sharing a room at the Ibis Hotel, in Southampton, with her 26-year-old boyfriend James Hatcher, when he woke during the night of 8 March to find her lying dead beside him.

Dr Allen Anscombe, a pathologist, told an inquest on Tueday that Miss Papas had 4,100 micrograms per litre of blood of the drug in her body, although he could not say how many tablets she might have taken.

It was one of the highest levels ever encountered, he said, and a verdict of death due to the non-dependent use of drugs was recorded by the coroner.

This is very much one of the highest levels encountered

Mr Hatcher, from Southampton, told the inquest that his girlfriend of one year had taken two ecstasy tablets earlier in the evening while the couple were in the hotel bar.

After she took the second tablet, he told the court he had thought this was "a bit heavy".

He said Miss Papas had taken them out of a bag which he thought contained about 10 tablets, and had offered him the drug.

He told the hearing he took two half tablets.

When they returned to their hotel room, Mr Hatcher said he fell asleep.

When he awoke, he knew there was a problem.

"I put my arm on Wendy. I then felt there was something badly wrong," he said.

He called for help but Miss Papas, who lived with her family in the city, was pronounced dead.

Heart attack

Dr Anscombe told the hearing in Southampton that Miss Papas was fit and healthy, but toxicology tests showed the massive dose in her system, which caused her death.

It was likely she died of a heart attack.

"This is very much one of the highest levels encountered. Death has occurred at a much lower amount of the drug in the system," he said.

The death was originally treated as manslaughter but Detective Sergeant David Morgan, of Hampshire Constabulary, said no charges were brought.

The supplier of the drugs has never been traced.

Southampton coroner Keith Wiseman said the death was a tragedy waiting to happen.

"There cannot be anything more tragic than the death of a lovely young girl with her whole life in front of her especially occurring in this way," he said.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/hampshire/dorset/2978832.stm
 
I don't understand how its manslaughter if she took more than she should of. It's not lilke the pills were "faulty". If I gorged myself to death on fast food or even water can they arrest McDonald or (gasp) mother nature. There are enough precautions she could have taken to avoid this whole incident. Like taking them a half at a time like her friend (who is still alive) did.
 
I'm little confused here, if they say 4100 micro grams, that's 4.1 milligrams/liter of blood.

I thought lethal dose was around 15 milligrams/liter or even higher ? 8(
 
great. something else the media can blow out of proportion, shutting down more raves and increasing funds for their drug war.
 
funny how the article never mentioned what else was in the pills besides mdma(id bet a million there were impurities) or if she was using other drugs as well. its extremely unfortunate that someone had to die this way, but STOP BLAMING THE DRUGS.
 
ummm, i know the line we are supposed to say is "it wasn't the drugs fault!" but this doesn't seem like one of the common scare tactics they use. she took a massive amount of drugs apparantly and died. yes, you can od on e. while usually there is other circumstances to the death like other drug use, it doesn't have to be the case. your arguement is just as irrational as those who would claim e kills every time.

e isn't perfectly safe, it can kill you if you take to much. we are going to have to accept this if ever we hope to get the government to accept that it isn't as bad as they say.
 
Crazee said:
I thought lethal dose was around 15 milligrams/liter or even higher ?
Click to expand...

Lethal doses are usually given as milligrams per kilogram of body weight. For MDMA it's a shade over 100mg/kg.

Don't put ANY faith in that number though. Remember that the lethal dose is LD50 - when that dosage is reached, 50% of the tested animals had died.

They didn't all magically die right at 50%. Some died at much lower levels.
 
This is what I posted in the original thread:
"This article doesn't make sense:
A "perfectly normal" young woman died after taking one of the biggest doses of the drug ecstasy ever recorded.
Click to expand...
I realise her blood levels were extraordinarily high, but if they had 10 pills to start with, and the guy took 2, the most she could have had was 8 right? Even 8 pills would not normally lead to such high blood levels. In fact, 18 pills wouldn't lead to this result normally. How many of you mad for it UK types take 8 pills regularly, without dying? (Not that I am condoning 8 pills!)

My suspicion is that this death was related to either 1) a drug interaction. Remember the guy who died after taking two MDMA pills while on Ritonavir, his blood level was:
4.56 mg/liter, "nearly ten times that at which we would expect to see serious toxic effects" -- roughly the level that would be expected after taking 22 MDMA tablets
Click to expand...
from DANGER: Possibly Fatal Interactions Between Ritonavir and "Ecstasy," Some Other Psychoactive Drugs

Or 2) this girl was deficient in the liver enzymes responsible for metabolising MDMA, which can lead to higher blood levels.

If one of the above factors was indeed the case, if we assume the pills were particularly strong, plus the fact that alcohol can also raise blood levels of MDMA, these factors combined would go some way towards explaining the high blood levels. Anyhow, my point is this is far more complicated than the article suggests, but I doubt we will ever know as it looks like the coroner has ruled on the death."

So unless this girl took many more pills than her boyfriend claimed they had in their possession, something else has contributed to this girls death.
 
it seems as though mods like baby vic are more knowledgable than the ME. Maybe the prob is in ME's not being specialized??
 
wendy was not just a girl , she was my sister who had suspicious circumstances surrounding her death !!!!

the tests she had showed she was NOT a regular drug user and after her death extacy pills were found hidden under the hotel carpet abit hard to do when you died 3 hours earlier !!!!
 
Jus curious about who the hell could fall asleep on 8 e pills? Her boyfriend took 2 pills and went to sleep? Wtf were they, morphine pills, damn.

Who gets a hotel room with their girlfriend and then some E pills, eats them, and then goes "Hey, aight, well, well uh, gettin late honey. I ate those pills like 10 minutes ago, it was nice wasnt it. Ahhh, time for bed." Thats like ordering a huge dinner and not eatin it.

Oh and to the insightful poster who is CLAMING to be her sister:

If you aint full of shit, which i would assume anyone would be who would read this story then register the name just to say that, and just happened to know about BL too.....If theres any truth to what youre sayin, If they really did find pills under the carpet, Maybe she put the pills under the rug......Dun dun dun....wait for it, cuz you could never predict this in a million years.....

.....
....

BEFORE she died?
eek.gif
 
I would've guessed that the boyfriend got the pills and just said she got them so he couldn't be charged with murder.
 
lacey k said:
Jus curious about who the hell could fall asleep on 8 e pills? Her boyfriend took 2 pills and went to sleep? Wtf were they, morphine pills, damn.

Who gets a hotel room with their girlfriend and then some E pills, eats them, and then goes "Hey, aight, well, well uh, gettin late honey. I ate those pills like 10 minutes ago, it was nice wasnt it. Ahhh, time for bed." Thats like ordering a huge dinner and not eatin it.

Oh and to the insightful poster who is CLAMING to be her sister:

If you aint full of shit, which i would assume anyone would be who would read this story then register the name just to say that, and just happened to know about BL too.....If theres any truth to what youre sayin, If they really did find pills under the carpet, Maybe she put the pills under the rug......Dun dun dun....wait for it, cuz you could never predict this in a million years.....

.....
....

BEFORE she died?
eek.gif
Click to expand...

I was wondering how in the hell he fell asleep too. Something is fishy about that.

As far as the pills under the carpet go, why is that so suspicious? I mean, you wouldn't want housekeeping finding that shit. I've hid things in stranger places.
 
ditto, it doesn't mean it was hidden after to hide them, it really means nothing.

i am sorry about your loss of your sister, i have one too and can totally appreciate your loss. it would kill me.

as babydoc told you, there are ways this can happen, but trying to prescribe "malicious will" to a simple freak accident isn't going to help you cope with this.

were the pills tested? i have gotten mda when hoping for mdma, a few years ago, we had deaths from pma being sold as mdma....ecstasy is not always ecstasy
 
CretiNation said:
I would've guessed that the boyfriend got the pills and just said she got them so he couldn't be charged with murder.
Click to expand...

Why do you say that? Thats a completely baseless idea with nothing in the story to even slightly point to that. Why does everyone always want to push blame off the dead person. I dont know what happened but thats pure speculation.

"What do you mean she had drank a full bottle of Bacardi and 18 beers and took a half oz of mushrooms and was driving in reverse, towards the east, in the westbound , 'trucks over 24 tons only' lane while changing the CD player and talking on her cellphone while she had 10 gallons of gasoline in the passenger seat that spilled on her and then she lit a match? ITS HER BOYFRIENDS FAULT!!!!!!"
 
Why do you say that? Thats a completely baseless idea with nothing in the story to even slightly point to that. Why does everyone always want to push blame off the dead person. I dont know what happened but thats pure speculation
Click to expand...

Well basically because whenever I've heard of anyone ODing from illegal drugs they always go after whoever supplied the drugs and try to get them for murder. Obviously it makes no sense at all but that's what I've read. Have you found that this isn't the case? Cause if so I guess we just read different news articles.

My guess that he got the pills is yeah, obviously baseless, but you know. He was 26, she was 18. He probably got the hotel room for a good time that night so is it really that absurd to assume he also bought the drugs? Maybe, but if my girlfriend died from ecstasy I had gotten there's no way in hell I would say that I was the one that got it, would you?
 
had 4,100 micrograms per litre of blood of the drug in her body,
Click to expand...

had 4100 micrograms OF WHAT??? It never says specifically that it was MDMA. And we all know how LE use the term "Ecstasy" for pretty much any drug taken in pill form. I would like to know exactly what drug the ME is stating was 4100 micrograms per litre. MDMA or something else?

In order for this story to be believable, you have to make 2 assumptions

1) she was a very tiny (low weight) woman
2) those 2 pills were some of the best/strongest MDMA pills on the planet. 8(
 
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