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Ecstasy and Asperger's Syndrome/Social Anxiety

PsychonautRyan

PsychonautRyan

Bluelighter
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So I have a very mild form of Asperger's syndrome, which is considered high-functioning autism and shares many symptoms with social anxiety disorders. For the most part, it's not a huge problem in my life, and I have many friends and acquaintances, and am on good terms with my co-workers, but despite my intelligence and physical attractiveness (not to mention modesty) I've often felt insecure, shy and reclusive in social situations such as being in the classroom or at work. For example, if a hot girl from one of my earlier summer classes flirtatiously smiles at me, although I'm flattered by her interest, if I try and work up the guts to talk to her, I'm constantly blushing, stuttering and I'm awkward as hell around her if I'm trying to spark a conversation, otherwise, I'll just shy away and avoid her.

Summer classes are over, and I probably won't see her around, at best it's probably practice for socializing with the opposite sex, at worst, it's a reflection of the ineptitude of my social abilities and my awkwardness in general. So anyway, I'm considering taking an empathogen/entactogen drug such as MDMA, MDA, or methylone as a solo session for therapeutic purposes instead of recreation. I'm kind of wondering if there are both anecdotal reports of lasting effects as well as documented empirical evidence in the afterglow of taking the drug.

Whereas if it's just some arbitrary chemical imbalance in my brain that's being induced for a few hours, I couldn't really see how it could be beneficial and therapeutic, no better than alcohol being disinhibiting for a few hours. So any input on that dichotomy would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
Hello Ryan

I personally have suffered from exactly what you describe and was in my young 20s during the 90s when the whole E / Rave scene hit the UK. I will tell you my experience and hopefully this will be of some help to you.

At first I was really reluctant to try E but eventually gave in to all the social pressure around me at the time.

It certainly solves your temporary social problems thats for sure! You get to feel what its like to feel normal. Taking E for me didnt feel like taking a hallucinogen or amphetamine you just feel amazing. Lots of confidence, lots of happiness. I assume this is what normal people feel like.

For the next 18 years every girl friend I ever met was whilst I was on E. For me at the time it didnt seem like a problem it had all the benefits and none of the negatives. It was an amazing time for me.

Little did I know..

Initially E changed my outlook on being social. Gave me more energy in 'normal' life. Was very energetic very happy.

Over the course of the next 18 years things changed. Over time things changed from one extreme to another.

Became more OCD, more anxious, more paranoid, more socially isolated. This all happened slowly very very slowly unnoticable until for me it was too late. I would describe the E for someone with this condition as a subtle, slow and progressive. the more you took the more the symptoms got worse. Kind of a trojan horse in a way.

After having an awful reaction with a mix of MDMA and BZP I now suffer from chronic Anxiety, Panic Attacks, Paranoia, Total Social Isolation, Insomnia, Time Perception Disorder, Memory Loss, OCD, Depression, Apathy, Loss of appetite, Constantly Nervous and general feeling of dread and unsettled. I have had this since September last year. many days for me life is not worth living but i fight on.

I also lost my hair at the age of 21 from excess anxiety argubley caused by MDMA (I didnt know the cause at the time). I also suffered from a UTI caused by the water retention ability of MDMA. This happened at about the age of 25.

I promise you nothing in that list is exagerated in any way. I have clearly been very unlucky.

I am not saying this will happen to you but please be very careful when experimenting with this disorder and using the MDMA as 'self medication'

At first I think you will find it positive.

Social experience you will find fun and rewarding.

If you reserve the E for only special moments it might well work for you.

Use test kits make sure you are buying quality product.

If you are in the USA you will have to fight harder to get good product. Buying online is a safer option these days. I cannot mention sources but some of the good sites have feedback systems and you can spot the good sellers. The quality of product online is way superior to street Molly.

For therapy MDMA 'Molly' powder is more recommended than pills. Pills are frequently mastered for more dancey and rushey hits.

Follow all the rules on here about not redosing and watch the actual dose you take.

Follow all the pre loading rules / apply all the after effect supps

I am not saying to you dont do it but..

You have a disorder based on interupted transmission and levels of seretonin. You are about to take a drug that will give you a strong blast and release of Seretonin, Dopamine, Noradrenaline and plus a load of enzymes and general body disturbances.

MDMA has the potential to be one of the most powerful neurotoxins out there. It can if abused damage the brain more than crack and heroin. If you like it too much and abuse it will haunt you in your later years.

Just so you know I am 38 and have taken about 400 doses over an 18 year period. I am described as a high dose user. I dont take Ecstasy anymore due to mental health reasons.

If I had my time again I would not have taken Ecstasy.

if I had the option of taking E again but how would I do it again. I would have taken far less dose in one session, I would have taken far less in general and I would have quit once I hit 30. I feel from experience most of the main damage for me was done during the time of being over 30.


I am not preaching to you. Everything in life is a personal choice. This is an extreme and bad outcome story but I do suffer from the same condition as you so please be careful when choosing this path of experimentation.

Please feel free to page me if you want to ask any direct questions.

I hope this information is of help for you in your future decisions.

Take Care, be Safe

Futura
 
I too have a form of Asperger's and suffer from social anxiety and shyness. In addition, I have a dislike of physical intimacy that has led to me leading a largely asexual lifestyle. Like you, I am secure in my intelligence and appearance, and find it very easy to make friends, but generally regarded any flirtatious advances with anxiousness and repulsion. When I started using ecstasy recreationally about 2 years ago, I found that my social anxiety melted away in social situations. I didn't feel any desire to do anything that I wouldn't normally do, but I was able to socialise with anyone and respond to any situation without anxiety or repulsion. On ecstasy, I've had intimate experiences with friends and strangers that would have made me run for the hills before I tried it. Now, these experiences have helped me to partly overcome this social anxiety in my normal life. I still get it to some degree and still exhibit autistic behaviour, but the point is that it has given me a perspective that stays with me after the experience.

In conclusion, you might find that occassionally and safely taking ecstasy/mdma with friends in social situations helps you to relax, accept yourself, maybe even realise that you aren't missing out on anything or that you're not much different to anyone else. What I would definitely not do is to experiment with it by yourself to see if you can change your behaviour. This will not work, and may lead to health problems and/or dependancy, not to mention financial or social issues. Only use these drugs to enhance a social experience. Don't take them thinking that they'll change who you are or with some intent of what you're going to do that you wouldn't normally do. This will only lead to frustration and confusion. Be safe and have fun.
 
Also, you don't want to be trying to be someone you're not for the sake of someone else. It just leads to more social anxiety. The people I'm closest to know that I might feel awkward or anxious from time to time or come across as aloof or unsociable. Them knowing that makes it easier for me not to be like that, as I have little reason to be anxious around them if they know what to expect.
 
I also suggest LSD with Cannabis, particularly high THC sativas like White Widow. LSD will increase your awareness to external stimuli. In particular, LSD and mushrooms showed me new detail and clarity in things I have misunderstood on a daily basis. I have found facial expressions in particular come alive on these hallucinogens. You might be more inhibited on LSD since it is a disorientating experience but I have learned a lot about reading people by studying faces under the influence. Mad Men was a great one to watch for this purpose.

I don't know much about the social anxiety aspects of Ecstasy from experience but I have read great things. I don't do most illegal drugs at parties or with anyone I'd feel shy around.

You didn't mention other symptoms of Aspergers. Check out this article, Do Neurologists Dance? where a man with Parkinsons talks about the dramatic effect of Ecstasy on his physical symptoms. Although our Aspergers symptoms are much milder than those of Parkinsons, I experienced a night-and-day difference in my balance, co-ordination, and fine motor skills. Mentally, I felt high, but physically I felt…maybe I felt normal, not that I'd know a lot about what normal feels like. I could definitely do things I'd never done before. For a few hours I knew how to move and apply my strength effectively. I felt like I could do a cartwheel, something I was never interested in even in childhood. (but didn't want to risk doing it in my small house...someday I will build a privacy fence so I feel safe tripping outside)
 
MDMA will not cause you to have life changing experiences, it can however strengthen relationships if you take it with another person. Hallucinogens are pretty decent if you want to have a retrospective on your life, they allow you to confront your problems and find ways to work round it if that's your goal, but I would recommend 2C-B though as its not so much of a headfuck as typical hallucinogens and has a relatively mild duration so you can see what your up against
 
etasu


Please can you clarify a few things for me:

You are suggesting the OP takes Ecstasy, LSD, Mushrooms and White Widow Cannabis of high THC content to assist with social anxiety and aspergers?

You think taking MDMA is a good idea for social anxiety because an article online suggests it provides temporary relief from someone with parkinsons motor movements?

im kinda confused are you a parkinsons sufferer? Do you suffer from asperges yourself? Whats the link between the two?


I am just amazed that you are suggesting someone with a clear mental disorder to take more hallucinogens and additional illicit drugs. Like they offer some kind of therapy.

Your advice is not harm reduction on any level this in my opinion would be Russian Roulette for the OP.

Hallucinogens could fuck him up plain and simple. So could cannabis, So could ecstasy. If you have any type of mental disorder and you experiment with drugs there are VERY HIGH RISKS. I speak from personal bitter experience.

Square root also makes this very clear. I notice he even posts a second time with additional conscience and caution suggesting a non drug route. Great advice in my opinion!

Sorry mate I dont even see words of caution in your post this advice is just total INSANITY. Whats your message?
 
PsychonautRyan said:
Whereas if it's just some arbitrary chemical imbalance in my brain that's being induced for a few hours, I couldn't really see how it could be beneficial and therapeutic, no better than alcohol being disinhibiting for a few hours. So any input on that dichotomy would be appreciated. Thanks!
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this. all your problems would still be there after the comedown and it's not like you can be on mdma all the time. severe serotonin syndrome, mania, etc.
 
I am just amazed that you are suggesting someone with a clear mental disorder to take more hallucinogens and additional illicit drugs. Like they offer some kind of therapy.

Your advice is not harm reduction on any level this in my opinion would be Russian Roulette for the OP.

Hallucinogens could fuck him up plain and simple. So could cannabis, So could ecstasy. If you have any type of mental disorder and you experiment with drugs there are VERY HIGH RISKS. I speak from personal bitter experience.
Click to expand...

Asperger's isn't a mental disorder, it's a high-functioning autism spectrum disorder with social impairments but with average to above-average intelligence and cognitive ability. I wouldn't classify Asperger's as being a mental disorder in the same sense as bipolar disorder, schizophrenia or psychosis, no more than I would consider ADHD or social anxiety to be a mental disorder by comparison. Second, I've smoked/eaten pot on forty different occasions and dropped acid four times and at any rate, I've considered the experiences to be insightful and mind-opening, as well as accelerating the expansion of my consciousness.

Anyway, I've decided to try Ecstasy just once, in order to see if there are any lasting beneficial effects. I'm not going to take anymore than fifty to a hundred milligrams of MDA/MDMA, but would there be any benefit to ingesting it alone in order to have self-reflection, contemplation and introspective thinking within myself for the duration of the experience. I've generally taken LSD on that basis and that's how I've considered it to be therapeutic and insightful, but would taking MDMA/MDA alone be just as effective in the same set and setting as with psychedelics? Or would I be better off taking it in the company of close friends?

this. all your problems would still be there after the comedown and it's not like you can be on mdma all the time. severe serotonin syndrome, mania, etc.
Click to expand...

With reading the Psychedelic Experience, isn't the temporary chemical imbalance in the brain also functioning as a sort of "chemical key" for higher inner awareness, spirituality and expansive consciousness? I might be confusing the effects of psychedelics with entactogens though.
 
No you should take it with friends in a social setting - night club, house party etc. An important factor is feeling empathy for people around you who are doing the same thing. If you take it by yourself at home you'll just feel jittery and unrelaxed, and it'd be a bit of a waste of money. The higher inner awareness you talk about comes from feeling at ease around people, sharing things with them, being frank and honest, receiving sincere compliments from other uninhibited individuals. It's all dependent on socialising
 
I suggest taking it with a group of friends with whom you share a mutual respect. People who you feel like have at least some shred of understanding of how you feel and think and whose opinions you would respect. Taking MDMA in a setting like that will make you much more comfortable with talking about such things as well as much more receptive to the things you might discuss.

I think you would still benefit from doing it solo, the way that you said, but I think the addition of more input from close friends would stimulate a lot more thoughts that could lead to some lasting changes.
 
Hello Ryan

"Asperger's isn't a mental disorder, it's a high-functioning autism spectrum disorder with social impairments"

It is a disorder, it involves your mind sorry but it is 100% a mental disorder. I dont mean this in a bad way as I have it too but lets not be under any illusions here.

" I wouldn't classify Asperger's as being a mental disorder in the same sense as bipolar disorder, schizophrenia or psychosis, no more than I would consider ADHD or social anxiety to be a mental disorder by comparison."

Sure neither would I or anyone else on here. However, they all involve the mind and they are all disorders so are all types of mental disorder. if you suffer from any of the listed disorders and you experiment with mind altering drugs you role the dice each time you take them.

"Second, I've smoked/eaten pot on forty different occasions and dropped acid four times and at any rate, I've considered the experiences to be insightful and mind-opening, as well as accelerating the expansion of my consciousness."

I am happy to hear this but it doesnt escape from the fact that if you experiment with psychedelic drugs and you suffer from asperges and social anxiety you are at a greater risk from an adverse mental reaction to any of these substances including MDA and MDMA.

"would there be any benefit to ingesting it alone in order to have self-reflection, contemplation and introspective thinking within myself for the duration of the experience. I've generally taken LSD on that basis and that's how I've considered it to be therapeutic and insightful, but would taking MDMA/MDA alone be just as effective in the same set and setting as with psychedelics? Or would I be better off taking it in the company of close friends?"

Both MDMA and MDA are also psychedelics. If you are taking these drugs as a form of therapy I think it would be a mistake to make some kind of grouping of the two compounds. They are totally different. For a true theraputic trial you would have to look at seperate dosing, environment, setting, aim of the session etc etc. The comments from Squareroot about setting an experience seem very appropiate. He also mentions about dose. 50-100mG of MDA is going to be very different to 50-100mG of MDMA. i think different doses and different criterias for each compound would be sensible.


What drugs you choose to take and how you take them are clearly your own personal choice.

I am not saying dont take them. I am not saying your ideas are wrong.

My point is to exercise caution thats all.

I wish you all the best what ever you choose.

Take care

Futura
 
As somebody with severe social anxiety, I can honestly say discovering 4-FA (weaker than MDMA but still a RC stimulant/empathogen) was the best thing I've ever done for my social life.
 
OK, I don't have time to read all of these posts that happened after I posted, but I wanted to bring up the fact that LSD, Shrooms and Ecstasy have been used for therapy before. It was a controversial practice and generally ended when the drugs were made illegal. Check out MAPS who is studying Ecstasy therapy for PTSD. I believe there is a lot of unexplored potential in the therapeutic benefits of hallucinogens.
 
*grabs a beer and a chair to watch this go down*
But, FWIW the only ASD person I know who has done MDMA had a very entertaining/horrifying/why the hell would you do this at work reaction.

This guy was ASD to the point where I was hired at this one store because everyone else there threatened to quit rather than work with him. Being the middle of the 2009 recession I was happy to work and deal with whatever shit I had to, so I put up with him.
He ended up eating "a baggie of pure molly in the back" then going into some sort of psychotic breakdown involving him professing his love to some customers, trying to kiss a homeless man, and then screaming at the heavens about the "warm bleakness of existence" until he was pumped full of risperidone.

This all occurred on a Tuesday night at a Liquor store :/
Hope it works better for you.
 
Ive only taken mdma crystal for 4 years and it seems to relax my social anxieties more than the pills did.
 
Mdma is better when doing it with some else rolling as well. The drug has powerful bonding effects. It has greatly freed my wife and I from emotional barriers that we built up. Don't do it alone or be the only one.
 
For example, if a hot girl from one of my earlier summer classes flirtatiously smiles at me, although I'm flattered by her interest, if I try and work up the guts to talk to her, I'm constantly blushing, stuttering and I'm awkward as hell around her if I'm trying to spark a conversation, otherwise, I'll just shy away and avoid her.
Click to expand...

Given your description, I'm wondering why your primary diagnosis is mild Aspergers rather than social anxiety. Social anxiety secondary to Aspergers stems largely from a lack of confidence due social cue blindness and primary anxiety from sensoria-overload. That you can notice flirtations and hell, even your own blushing, makes me wonder.
...
IME, it's hard to take entactogenic social insight back with you once you come down.


ebola
 
ebola? has a point. Your problem might stem from social anxiety rather than a form of autism, which is good news as it'll be easier to overcome your instinctive shyness and reluctance. Just knowing that you're being flirted with is a good indication. I generally don't realise I'm being flirted with until someone points it out after the event ("What's the matter with you? She was definitely flirting with you. Why didn't you..." etc.) Apparently, what I recognise as flirting amounts to very blatant forwardness, which is probably why my customary reaction is one of repulsion. Having said that, I'm getting better at noticing the more subtle signs of flirting, especially when I'm just an observer and not at the receiving end of it.

Anyway, in my opinion, do it with your friends and make your agenda just to have a good time and relax. Then maybe you can see what insights you can hold onto when you come down.
 
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