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TDS Eating Disorders Megathread

Alex000 said:
Regardless of many opinions that support the idea that food is "addictive", I don't believe this to be true. In fact, I do not believe one can be addicted to anything but a drug. One can be obssessed, even neurotic about a certain activity (eating, gambling, sex etc.), but I don't see these obssessions the same as drug addictions, and I believe it is important to make the distinction in order to better understand either. Binge eating, or over-eating, can indeed be a serious issue, and food/eating can be an obssession, but it is in our basic nature to eat. One must eat to live. We aren't born with the instinct to take drugs, but we are born with the instinct to eat. Because one cannot stop eating completely for any appreciable amount of time, eating will always be a part of one's life. Your girlfriend cannot simply give up eating, but by eating at all she fuels her obssession with food, and continues. Her eating practices and her views of food are likely askew, and she has become over-indulgent in an activity which is otherwise vital. When one is obssessed with something they have done all of their life, and which they will continue to do all of their life, one likely feels much more wrapped up in the obssession, and stopping might not seem feasible in her mind. Eating is a comfort we all know, drugs are an accquired comfort. I would suggest psychotherapy to help alleviate your girlfriend of this neurosis.
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On the contrary, my dear Watson:

"Studies like the one reported in this N.Y.Times article have shown that people with a family history of alcoholism also may have a substantially higher risk of being obese than people without such a family history. More significantly, recent animal studies have made it clear that rats (our close relatives when it comes to the neurobiology of eating behaviors) can indeed become addicted to certain types of foods, exhibiting the same kinds of behaviors observed in humans with late-stage addiction to drugs.

And most telling of all are new insights stemming from advances in brain imaging technology, which make it possible to "see" inside the human brain and witness what’s going on when people eat certain foods and/or get caught up in compulsive overeating. It turns out that this brain activity looks very much the same, regardless of whether the individual is a drug addict taking a drug or a habitual overeater eating a double cheeseburger with fries."
 
51fifty said:
We both know well that she lacks the will power not to eat junk food or finish all of the restuarant meal with 2 high sugar drinks. or came to my work last night to buy a $3.50 bag of hot cheetos which i know she will finish in 3 hours. It's almost exactly like when someone cant stop at just 2-3 beers a night and has to finish the whole 12 pack.
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exactly. she can't stop. it's an addiction. here's a little snippet; did you know that dairy products react the same way in our brains as opioids do? a little article:

"Part of the answer lies in the addictive qualities of cheese. Yes, that’s right, cheese is addictive. It’s not like you’re going to go into seizures or begin vomiting when you give up cheese, but certainly the opiate qualities of cheese help to explain what makes it so hard for people to stop.
The principle protein in milk is casein. (Casein makes up 80 – 86% of the proteins in cow milk and 60% – 65% of the proteins in human milk). When we digest casein, something called casomorphins are formed. And these casomorphins have an opioid effect on us (similar to morphine but with one-tenth the power). In other words, it makes us feel good.
Cheese is produced by curdling the milk (by adding rennet, an enzyme produced in mammalian stomachs to digest mother’s milk, which “digests” the milk into cheese – um, gross!). The curds become cheese and the whey (liquid) is discarded. Doing this causes the casein concentration to be much higher in cheese than in milk. This is why Dr. Neal Barnard refers to cheese as “dairy crack.”
But wait, there’s more. Cheese also contains an amphetamine-like chemical, phenylethylamine (also found in chocolate) which is often called an aphrodisiac because it “arouses the pleasure areas of the brain,” and is even used as an anti-depressant because of its mood-elevating qualities."

51fifty said:
I would prefer going to the gym and working hard with her so she has someone to push her. But still I hear every excuse there is (I havent eaten for 4 hours) when the last meal was pizza or some othe horrific american food. I dont think overeater's anonymous would help because attending AA/NA meetings 6 years ago at my parents behest turned me into a complete poly drug user when all I used to do was smoke weed & drink. So I see it as if you treat someone as an addict they'll live up to your expectations.
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just because it didn't work for you, doesn't mean it won't work for her. if you truly want to help her, you shouldn't quit options before you even start them. and what would they do at overeaters anon - secretly slip naughty recipes to eachother on the sly?? "omgggg you gotta try this pound cake, yo! straight firrrrre!!"



51fifty said:
I've been noticing how the "vicious cycle" works lately. Depressed about body, eat food (that shit is mind boggling to me) stressed out, eat food and so on. Guilty for eating such food, and after a stressful day massive cravings for unhealthy food.
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try this: replace the words "eat food" in the above sentence with "slam heroin" or "smoke meth" or "snort coke"

51fifty said:
Is it possible for someone to get over that if they dont have a strong will power and has said a few times that it's the only short term thing that makes them happy? Can people like that be helped? The ones who have basically convinced themselves that they don't have the strength. Food is everywhere but I still don't see why some can't just stop eating until they're completely full. It's taking quite a toll on my self esteem when I feel embarrassed to have the biggest girlfriend at a social function and end up doing copious amounts of drugs and alcohol to hide my shame (as shallow as it sounds).
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yep. shallow as a damn near dried up puddle in the middle of a desert. taking a toll on YOUR self esteem!??!?!? how do you think she feels??????? she's got a superficial boyfriend who doesn't understand that her overeating is her screaming from the inside, trying to cover something up that is obviously bothering her. she's got a boyfriend who is straight up EMBARASSED of her because she's gained some weight. she is confused and probably doesn't know how the hell she got herself into this mess, but now she knows that the only thing that will silence the madness in her brain is to shove food in the gullet.
would it be okay with you if she was a skinny, strung out heroin junkie? with track marks on her arms, looking like hell...oh, but she'd be skinny, right? that way, nobody would know, you'd be able to hide her addiction. but her addiction hangs off of her body and she can't hide it.
 
littlepenguin said:
On the contrary, my dear Watson:

"Studies like the one reported in this N.Y.Times article have shown that people with a family history of alcoholism also may have a substantially higher risk of being obese than people without such a family history. More significantly, recent animal studies have made it clear that rats (our close relatives when it comes to the neurobiology of eating behaviors) can indeed become addicted to certain types of foods, exhibiting the same kinds of behaviors observed in humans with late-stage addiction to drugs.

And most telling of all are new insights stemming from advances in brain imaging technology, which make it possible to "see" inside the human brain and witness what’s going on when people eat certain foods and/or get caught up in compulsive overeating. It turns out that this brain activity looks very much the same, regardless of whether the individual is a drug addict taking a drug or a habitual overeater eating a double cheeseburger with fries."
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Science and technology have far over-complicated things esp. when it comes to the field of medicine. I don't doubt there could be correlation between neurotic disorders like binge-eating and drug addiction, in fact I would rather suspect there to be, however, they are very different things. This new wave of brain imagery is just bullshit IMO. Internal imagery can be manipulated easily, and one can see what one wants to see looking at the results. It is a very shaky, inaccurate methodology and I won't be sold. Studies can show anything or at least seem to, doesn't mean that they are correct. Neurotic behaviors can be very much akin to addictive behaviors, but there is a huge difference.
 
littlepenguin coud you please post the links to the sources from which you got all that information you've quoted? Thank you :)
 
Yeah, those are some big claims, and I'd love to see the backing research.

I have heard of the dairy/opioid link before, but haven't seen much in the way of solid data to back it up. As I'm transitioning to veganism, I'd love to see a good source on that claim! :)
 
What's the summary of the dairy/opioid aspect?
People certainly piled cheese on anything they can, and ice cream is the devil, etc.
Opioids give me the munchies to eat literally anything, and stops me from feeling full.
 
Dave said:
Yeah, those are some big claims, and I'd love to see the backing research.

I have heard of the dairy/opioid link before, but haven't seen much in the way of solid data to back it up. As I'm transitioning to veganism, I'd love to see a good source on that claim! :)
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veganism is awesome. I suggest reading the book "skinny bitch," not only does it have great recipes for vegans, but it's a great read on how disgusting and asinine the food is that the govt is trying to shove down our gullets.
 
^ As a former drug addict yourself I find it a bit peculiar how you seem to differentiate her binge eating compared to your drug addictions. From what you've written, you really seem to be suggesting that her binge eating and her weight is a moral failing, a lack of willpower, a weakness, and so on - something that she could fix if only she gave enough of a fuck.

You've said previously that you never let your addictions significantly affect your life, work, relationships and so on, and because of that, I'd dispute whether you've actually truly been an addict, rather than just having a habit. An addiction is a real biological and neurological state; the result of a natural nervous system vulnerability. Our brains seek reward - food, drugs, sex and so on - as a survival mechanism, but this same system can easily become maladaptive when reward seeking behaviour instead becomes detrimental to survival. Whether beneficial or detrimental, survival mechanisms can carry an insistency that is extremely hard to ignore. The perception of a drug or food craving can be just as salient as the desire for water after days without drinking.

As such, cravings can have little to do with a lack of willpower, though accumulated choices will strengthen or weaken addictive pathways. It is a natural and real result of brain plasticity - and fighting an addiction (to anything) is not simply a matter of not being lazy, but rather fighting against your instincts - your very self.

If your girlfriend was putting on weight due to a physical disease, would you find this so hard to deal with? Is it purely the change in her physical appearance, or is it also your perception of her weakness in dealing with the problem? It seems to me, through your posts, that you don't consider this a real biological problem; rather a lack of ambition, and an area where she just needs to get her act together. I think this perception could be contributing more to your unhappiness in this situation than her physical appearance itself.

As an addiction, I doubt this problem will be easily or quickly fixed. I guess it's upto you whether you can support her through this illness, or whether the symptoms of it are unnacceptable to you.
 
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As a suggestion, have her (if she's ready for help) write down everytime she eats. No matter what it is, from a snack to a meal. Write what she ate, how she was feelin, what she was doin and where she ate, ie: in front of the tv, at the table.
I went from a bulemic to an anorexic to a binge eater. Writin all that down made me realize how my feelings were affectin my eatin and what my triggers are. I can't eat anywhere but the table or I focus on the tv/computer and I eat too much bc I'm not eatin slowly and I'm not payin attention to my body sayin I'm full!
After this & on-goin therapy I managed to lose 86 lbs and become healthy and happy!
I'm also more aware of my choices now as if second nature. Sugar free candy, more veggies than starches, diet drinks, etc.
Good luck to you both!
 
littlepenguin - the actual, primary source linked from the second link that you gave (not actually available free, but the article is here for those with journal accesss) looks interesting. I'll have to wait until Monday before I can read it, as I don't have journal access away from the office, but it seems to imply that the same neurological pathways (striatal D2 receptors, commonly associated with both inhibitory - as in damage to this area causes Parkinson's and Ozzbourne-is Pseudo-Parkinsonism - and reward pathways) are used for compulsive behaviours in general. Whether the compulsion is strictly chemical (i.e. cocaine) or otherwise (binge eating, gambling, etc..) would not appear to be relevant with respect to these particular pathways. From the abstract, the methodolgy looks sound, but I'd have to take a closer look at the statistics to see if I believe it. Nature is pretty reliable, but there is no such thing as an infalliable source.

The first linkthat you gave only cited the same primary source, albeit in a rather roundabout way; it linked to another article that linked to it. This study mentions nothing about the dairy-opioid link, incidentally, but rather the fact that binge eating likely (assuming that the stats and their methodology are sound) uses the same neurological mechanism for compulsion as 'addiction'; to cocaine in particular.
 
BabyGurl3171 said:
As a suggestion, have her (if she's ready for help) write down everytime she eats. No matter what it is, from a snack to a meal. Write what she ate, how she was feelin, what she was doin and where she ate, ie: in front of the tv, at the table.
I went from a bulemic to an anorexic to a binge eater. Writin all that down made me realize how my feelings were affectin my eatin and what my triggers are. I can't eat anywhere but the table or I focus on the tv/computer and I eat too much bc I'm not eatin slowly and I'm not payin attention to my body sayin I'm full!
After this & on-goin therapy I managed to lose 86 lbs and become healthy and happy!
I'm also more aware of my choices now as if second nature. Sugar free candy, more veggies than starches, diet drinks, etc.
Good luck to you both!
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The food/eating journal is a good idea, and thank you for sharing your experience with us Babygurl <3
 
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