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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

EADD-Heroin-Discussion-v-XXIII-New shit - same old problems

I cannot really understand the dealers' logic behind this dramatic increase in ODs due to fentanyl laced heroin. I know one OD will make people running around like crazy after that particular brand of heroin, but the extend of deaths in the US due to fetanyl is just ti much out of proportion. The dealers are effectively killing of the customers faster and faster. I know the dealers (with some exceptions) are not so stupid that they cannot see past an increase in short-term profits at the cost of decreasing long-term profits.
Maybe the media distort the picture so I have a misconception of the numbers of addicts dying versus the total amout of addicts - I don't know. But my impression is that before dealers would make a 100 small bags and lace one with fentanyl, that is 1 death out of 100 sold bags (I saw this in an old episode of Drugs Inc). But now it seems to be more and more heroin that is laced with fentanyl in the US.

In Denmark, we have not seen an OD resulting in death from heroin laced with Fentanyl as far as I know. In the city I live, we have seen two deaths due to capsules sold with the claim that they contained oxycodone powder whereas it was pure acetyl-fentanyl powder (how people can believe that capsules contain oxycodone powder is beyond me). The most dangerous things was that they were being sold for a very small amount of money, so they spread very fast. The city I live in is the fifth largest in Denmark and it was only in the addict community here that the capsules were in circulation. But they did cause several ODs and as I said two deaths. The person(s) responsible were never caught and we haven't seen any since that episode. But, how common is fentanyl laced heroin in the rest of Europe? In England, Germany et cetera?. Is it still mostly contained to the US, or are it starting to spread in Europe as well? I wish someone could develop a relatively cheap way of testing whether a powder contain fentanyl or its analogues. This is the only way I can see a stop to this. People will not stop taking heroin as there is no (cheaper) alternative.
 
I've seen media reports of fent cut H doing the rounds in the UK but it's still a very rare occurrence especially when compared to the sheer prevalence of fentanyl in the USA.
 
Ignio said:
I cannot really understand the dealers' logic behind this dramatic increase in ODs due to fentanyl laced heroin. I know one OD will make people running around like crazy after that particular brand of heroin.
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yeah, there's a rather sad trend around the south of England (and i'm sure everywhere) wherein a death of a user will spread around the addict community like wildfire and serve as a potent advert for that particular dealer's product. in Mitcham (south london) there was a quite tragic case of a couple's simultaneous OD, and rather than shock and outrage as you'd expect, we had people coming from as far afield as Edgware looking for that banging b (b = brown aka heroin) :/ i've even heard from a reputable source (well, as reputable as a drug addicted benefit fraud can be) that some of the more unscrupulous dealers have cottoned on to this morbid form of advertising and are specifically bundling up uncut or fent-laced hotshots.

Ignio said:
In Denmark, we have not seen an OD resulting in death from heroin laced with Fentanyl as far as I know. In the city I live, we have seen two deaths due to capsules sold with the claim that they contained oxycodone powder whereas it was pure acetyl-fentanyl powder (how people can believe that capsules contain oxycodone powder is beyond me). The most dangerous things was that they were being sold for a very small amount of money, so they spread very fast. The city I live in is the fifth largest in Denmark and it was only in the addict community here that the capsules were in circulation. But they did cause several ODs and as I said two deaths. The person(s) responsible were never caught and we haven't seen any since that episode. But, how common is fentanyl laced heroin in the rest of Europe? In England, Germany et cetera?. Is it still mostly contained to the US, or are it starting to spread in Europe as well? I wish someone could develop a relatively cheap way of testing whether a powder contain fentanyl or its analogues. This is the only way I can see a stop to this. People will not stop taking heroin as there is no (cheaper) alternative.
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i don't know if you yourself have experienced the ordeal that is the rattle, but when you're in the throws of withdrawal you know that whatever it is doesn't belong in a capsule, and it is far, far to cheap to oxy or heroin but its a calculated risk. i'm quite sure the addict/homeless community know exactly who those persons are, but they daren't cut off their source. i know from firsthard experience that fent is openly for sale by some dealers [in london*], they refered to it as lasers or laser-dots? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ they seemed a unsure as to what it was exactly as it was kind of new but they said it was stronger than heroin and was used for big animals and wasn't ket.

laced-b is more common than i for one thought, i ODd on one such bag and nearly died - 24 weeks in hospital, had to learn to walk again etc etc - i too wish there was some such testing kit or better yet! prescription diamorphine available to those who haven't found methadone or buperenorphine viable alternatives,

ho hum, a man can dream can't he...? a man can dream (ツ
 
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I am sorry to hear about that keeping. I am glad you made it despite the hard recovery.
I am fighting the urge to move to heroin. Two things have kept me away so far, 1) the quality here sucks, so I would have to risk getting it by mail, 2) I have a job in science that I love and which is probably the only thing keeping me alive.

I have had an enourmous amount of irregular drug connects (pharmeceutical) but they are disappearing one by one (some dying, some discovering the money inherent in sending their things to the US etc). So my options are getting smaller by the day. Okay I realize this is an extreeemly selfish post, but who are more selfish than drug addicts? I have one more option I used at the hight of my addiction, but that require me to use those who are worse of than me living on the streets etc so make the last move needed for me to collect the drugs without implicating myself on surveillance but I have forbidden myself to drop that low ever ever again. Even since I was a kid I have had a need to protect those weaker than me (due to some experiences I had in a very young age) so it goes against every fiber in my body to do that. But I am rambling off the trail again now.

As such I am actually having the same convictions as you, I wish you could get prescription diamorphine as that would be the only way for me to avoid being a part-time criminal. I would so much love the an option as I am afraid all the time of that ringing bell at my home that is the door phone and then opening the door to see to police officers standing there. I have nightmare about it, I cannot concentrate sometimes due to it, I get panick attacks, I have a hard time enjoying buying a new car because I think "what is the point, I only get to drive it a week, then I am goinh to jail". I fear it so much that I have become convinved that it is going to happen sooner or later because that is easier to deel with that hopening that it will not happen.
When I was young I did care, I hated the law, I hated the police. But not I care. Now I like the law because that is going to protect my kids one day. Damn it is hard getting older and getting wise :D
 
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Had to say something about the purity of gear/coke -- the b iv'e been getting for a long time is up in the 40-45% and up to 60 if you want .1 for a tenner. As for the coke it's the best i have seen for years raw is fish scale and oily 75-80% and the hard is like it was years ago proper bell ringing sweaty pipes - this is london so dont know how others are finding it here.
 
Been getting lovely stuff in Paisley the last week. Quite a dark powder and it produces a lovely thick dark beetle and it's sticking to my teeth, not had kit do that in years.


Would you say anything:


A few months ago I sold my mate my 0.001 scales. He's now doing 3 years and 8 months for dealing so his missus has kept on a few decent punters who will never give her any hassle.

2 nights ago she dropped my old scales on to the floor and they landed with quite an impact. Yesterday I bought 2 scorebags for me and another mate and she usually weighs them out at just over 0.5g. She said to me one is slightly bigger so I kept that one. When I got home I noticed the bag looked huge, when I emptied it out it was nearer a gram. I phoned my mate to ask him what his was like and he said the same: massive bag.

I went and got another score bag off her again at 9 this morning and again it was well over. I think because she's been out her nut on Pregabalin the last 3 days she's just been looking at the digits on the scale and not been noticing how much over the bags are. Before she dropped them the were really accurate. I wonder if I should tell her, but to me that seems like madness if you are getting way more than you should. If she says anything I'll deny knowledge but I'll see if any of the other people she sells to say anything.
 
Ignio said:
I am sorry to hear about that keeping. I am glad you made it despite the hard recovery.
I am fighting the urge to move to heroin. Two things have kept me away so far, 1) the quality here sucks, so I would have to risk getting it by mail, 2) I have a job in science that I love and which is probably the only thing keeping me alive.

I have had an enourmous amount of irregular drug connects (pharmeceutical) but they are disappearing one by one (some dying, some discovering the money inherent in sending their things to the US etc). So my options are getting smaller by the day. Okay I realize this is an extreeemly selfish post, but who are more selfish than drug addicts? I have one more option I used at the hight of my addiction, but that require me to use those who are worse of than me living on the streets etc so make the last move needed for me to collect the drugs without implicating myself on surveillance but I have forbidden myself to drop that low ever ever again. Even since I was a kid I have had a need to protect those weaker than me (due to some experiences I had in a very young age) so it goes against every fiber in my body to do that. But I am rambling off the trail again now.
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cheers ignio, appreciate it. and i wouldn't worry about utilizing the homeless to get you drugs mate; as long as you buy them a couple of bits alongside your own gear i'm sure that 99% of them would be perfectly happy in assisting you in your endeavors (i certainly always was when i myself ws begging on the streets and got sent on a copping quest for some people). as long as you treat them like people, i don't see why not.

blondin said:
Had to say something about the purity of gear/coke -- the b iv'e been getting for a long time is up in the 40-45% and up to 60 if you want .1 for a tenner. As for the coke it's the best i have seen for years raw is fish scale and oily 75-80% and the hard is like it was years ago proper bell ringing sweaty pipes - this is london so dont know how others are finding it here.
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jesus blondin you always get some of the most bangin stuff - do you get it off DNMs or just score on the street? cause if its the later i might need to start communing to my gear soon =D
 
I got a hold of a small amount of a substance claiming to be "98% pure Fentanyl" freebase, I had planned to dissolve it in a 10ml dropper of brandy, and then take it orally by dropping it under my tounge.

I'm a bit weary in terms of how much i should put in, I've just put in about 1mg into the solution and have closed it up and given it a good shake..

I'm half tempted to try and run a tiny speck off foil to see if it has any effect, though I don't know if this is a terrible idea or not. My tollerance is pretty high and I have one of those nose plungers on standby with nalaxone in. How long should I leave this solution to dissolve? all the visible specks appear to have dissolved and it's been sat there 10 minutes.

This might be incredibly stupid. I am starting to rattle though and my subutex ran out yesterday, I really hope I can drag this out a few days.
 
PredatorVision said:
I got a hold of a small amount of a substance claiming to be "98% pure Fentanyl" freebase, I had planned to dissolve it in a 10ml dropper of brandy, and then take it orally by dropping it under my tounge.

I'm a bit weary in terms of how much i should put in, I've just put in about 1mg into the solution and have closed it up and given it a good shake..

I'm half tempted to try and run a tiny speck off foil to see if it has any effect, though I don't know if this is a terrible idea or not. My tollerance is pretty high and I have one of those nose plungers on standby with nalaxone in. How long should I leave this solution to dissolve? all the visible specks appear to have dissolved and it's been sat there 10 minutes.

This might be incredibly stupid. I am starting to rattle though and my subutex ran out yesterday, I really hope I can drag this out a few days.
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this doesn't sound like a particularly exacting science, make sure that the mixture is totally homogeneous cause if you get like a .2 blob of fent under your tongue that'd be pretty unfortunate.
did you vape any off foil yet?
 
keeping said:
this doesn't sound like a particularly exacting science, make sure that the mixture is totally homogeneous cause if you get like a .2 blob of fent under your tongue that'd be pretty unfortunate.
did you vape any off foil yet?
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Yeah I ended up vaping all of it off foil actually, after pissing about with a dropper for a couple of hours and not getting much out of it I smoked a tiny amount, which was pretty good gave me the feeling of a whole bag in one tiny go. Then repeated the same things several times and I got a pretty good feeling out of it, maybe about the equivelent of smoking 2 grams of street gear. Not bad for 50mg, it didn't really run as much as immediately fizzle a tiny vapour.

Goddammit I should have put it into my E-liquid! can't believe I didn't think of that until I saw your post.. oh well maybe next time :(

The half-life seems pretty terrible, I have a feeling i'm going to feel shit tomorrow.
 
fent half life 4h max it the worse opioid to get in to - much sickness for short high , i stick to gear mate
 
With things so shit recently and my stress and anxiety at an all time high since I relapsed 4 years ago, I have had (to the detriment of the forum due to my whingy whiney outbursts - during what to someone currently so pathetically incapable of handling anything) an intolerable couple of months which has been addressed of course by returning to regular heroin use.

Despite the majority of it being the the mediocre stepped on to fuck shot robber dust, I have managed to locate an old acquaintance who is selling the real deal at reassuringly expensive (i.e. back to pre - 2010 price) bona - fide, nice and chunky off the block.

With this mornings dreaded commitments addressed, which without going into details here was an appointment I have been so worried about I have spent the last week either using the genuine, albeit poor quality heroin that is easiest for me to source or shots of volumetrically dosed, vodka dissolved, Flubromazepam or Clonazolam (or both) I'm finally home enjoying the half gram of lovely chunky medium brown heroin I had kept since coming across it at the weekend.

So, as ll advised as this particular drug use is, I can only apologise for stating that while not exactly on cloud 9, I am now enjoying a plate after cranking the first 2 bags (I paid 40 quid for what are supposed to be 3 0.2 efforts and a white). Could be the last. Either way, rehab is now only 3 weeks away and I am done apologising to everyone for who I am and what I dio.

Heroin is a bad drug to develop a taste for it, but if you unfortunate enough to posses such a taste this is lovely. Long live the drug which brings joy to those who deserve it and short live stupid cunts like me who get greedy without doing anything proactive about it.

It is beyond a doubt the most addicting drug along with nicotine and alcohol and it is a rare thing to see people use it 'on occasion' but It is possible, myself having still managed to use it for 2 years as part of the weekend ritual of killing off the hangovers from the use of dance drugs on a Friday / Saturday night, so it can be done. It was more than inevitable that the wheels came off regarding my own use, as I am weak and greedy and its that same weakness and greed that has me glowing extremely pleasantly at this moment.

Long live heroin! And a big fuck you to our stupid and backwards society that makes the use and dependence on a drug, that is already highly addictive and its use life threatening (in both the long a short term) infinitely more dangerous than it already is by legislating against anything that may make the product safe (which it is on the whole, unless too much is taken and the user goes into respiratory arrest, which would be easy to avoid, hundreds of doses of diamorphine are administered every day sub - cutaneously and intra - venously with no problems) and instantly provide a culture whee users can engage with treatment the moment they identify that things may be getting of hand.

If we did live in the utopia of drug legalisation and the safest possible preparations of the 'classics' were to become commercially available for recreational use, then it is unlikely that among the small increase in young people who would be tempted to experiment with drugs (most probably cannabis or Ecstasy or something along those line) - the main reason stopping us from legalisation... would be extremely unlikely to be tempted to try heroin

(it would create a country of zombies if folk could get hold of such items easily, as the laws currently protect young people from coming into contact with drugs by threatening them with prosecution if they do, as the application of the law would create a climate where billions of pounds would be made by criminals selling clandestine, inconsistent and often dangerous drugs synthesised with no satiety or quality control.)

Anyway, I'm high, I needed to vent, I'm having one more dig after which I may have to seriously consider going our separate ways, as I will be in detox in about 3 weeks and need to get re - stabilised on my meth pronto and fuck off the on top use, and really when all is said and done, the drug itself.

Good to see you back around Blondin - goes without saying you probably have access to good kit. That aside I hope yo and yours are all well.
 
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But the thing is, it's not really fair to compare an illegal drug with a legal one.

To begin at the beginning, with some definitions so we can all be sure of what each other means, let's say primary effects are those of the drug itself, secondary effects are those of its illegality and tertiary effects are those of the taboo surrounding it. I think that distinction can be important. Some things are not illegal but still taboo (e.g. being transsexual), and some things are illegal but everybody does them anyway (e.g. driving faster than the speed limit, but still able to brake to a halt within the distance that you can see to be clear ahead; low-level copyright violations; smoking pot). So, something like
  • ]it gets you stoned, and it is addictive, but it is not especially toxic unless you literally take so much that your body slows down so much that it just stops working altogether.
  • You have to get it from criminals, whose first concerns are making money and not getting caught. Your well-being is only important to the extent that dead customers do not come back for more.
  • You are very careful who you talk to, if you have been using heroin. You are labelled a criminal, and therefore might not feel quite so bad about committing further crimes.
If heroin were legalised, then its dosage and purity would be known, eliminating the risk of nasty surprises. There would be no harmful adulterants, nor unexpectedly strong batches. That would certainly be a Harm Reduction win. And the primary effects of the drug itself are entirely manageable -- it's just a matter of how long until you are fit for work again, and how long you should leave before redosing. But as long it still remained taboo, then people might still be reluctant to come forward for help until it is already too late. In order to catch people at the best possible time for a safe and successful withdrawal, it would require for people to be able to talk openly about heroin. If the need for secrecy remained, so would the temptation to take too much, too soon -- which only makes or worsens a habit.

One thing is for sure, though: Just legalising drugs, by itself, will not magically make all the social problems go away at once. That's going to require a whole lot of effort .....
 
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