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e and schitzophrenia(sp)

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seniorovoertourq

Bluelighter
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Dec 29, 2002
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i have a buddy who about two years ago was diagnosed as being schitzo. he sadi after he was diagnosed that the doctor told him that his extensive use of e and acid contributed heavily to his becoming ill. anyone know whether it is the acid and not the e? i figure acid would be the more likely culprit.any info would be great
 
i would figure it was the E because dont people with schitzophrenia have underdeveloped areas of the brain? And E decreases brain mass....
 
First of all, it's SCHIZOphrenia, and it's not a disease, but a term used for series of (some quite different from others) psychiatric disorders, characterised by hallucinations, delusions etc...
And second... claims that drugs themselves can cause psychosis is highly controversial. Some, mostly from the anti-drug camp will say yes, while most of the evidence shows that some drugs (E & LSD included), can trigger a pre-existing (but latent) disorder, but cannot cause the disorder itself.
As for the stuff about E's, decreased brain mass & underdeveloped brains... Huh... It is yet unclear what exactly causes schizophrenia, but claims that MDMA causes decrease in the brain mass is something taken out of Oprah show, not serious science.
 
I had a quick look on www.pubmed.com - I searched for "MDMA AND schizophrenia" (7 results) and "LSD AND schizophrenia" (20 results).
From my brief reading it seems that scientists currently see a relation between serotonin and schizophrenia, though this isn't fully understood. It seems to me, therefore, that if you were predisposed to schizophrenia, then taking ecstasy might not be a good idea.
It also seems that people with schizophrenia are more likely to report drug abuse than the general population - though this, of course, doesn't mean that the drug abuse caused the schizophrenia - it could be the other way around.
 
but what about all those commericals and stuff that show pictures of really messed up brains from E use? MTV has a thing a while ago on E on True Life and they had a girl who did a shitload of E and had serious loss of brain mass and she was really messed up mentally.
 
asianfreek: here's a quote taken from our forthcoming MDMA mega-FAQ, from the 'ecstasy myths' section - it basically answers your question ;) - feel free to ask more if you don't understand it :)
5. Ecstasy burns holes in your brain
Status: myth
Source: MTV's Special on Ecstasy, 11/28/2000.
Rebuttal: Rick Doblin, PhD – see http://www.maps.org/media/mtvclarify.html
MTV presented a brain scan of a woman named Lynn Smith, who had consumed a large amount of MDMA. This brain scan was described as showing ‘holes in her brain’, similar to the brain of an elderly woman who had had many strokes. However, the scan actually measures the amount of blood flow in the brain. The ‘holes’ merely demonstrate a lower blood flow in some regions of her brain. These lower figures are relative, not absolute – they are lower relative to her own brain, not to anyone else’s. Not to a “normal” standard. In other words, you could scan anyone’s brain and get the same results, if you wanted to.
Another study, which used more sophisticated techniques to compare MDMA users and non-users, found no significant difference in brain blood flow between the two groups.
More information at the above hyperlink.
 
thanks ya'll i appreciate everything including the spelling correction. i just know that everyone i know who has done e seems to be well... alittle different during their roll. i know i am really different. i have been told that i am downright scary sometimes. i don't mean it but it happens. looking at my buddy ... man i hope i don't end up like him.
 
while LSD and shrooms and even cannabis are known and proven to have triggered psychosis such as schizophrenia, i have never heard claims in this regard concerning MDMA.
On the contrary, there have been studies done and books writen on the use of mdma in the treatment of schoziphrenia. and it is also used in the treatment of post traumatic stress disorder, depression, psychological guidance of terminally ill, coupl;e therapy...it all still ahppens, by wise therapists who keep it quiet.
remember though that we're talking here about responsible moderate use -- taking mulitple doses every weekend is not going to be good for yr mental health anyway
however, even if that's true, y
 
er, that last line should have been deleted.
what i wanted to ass Seniorovoertouq is that i think it's the acid rather that triggered yr friend's problems. on the other hand, as said, extensive intensive mdma use won't contribute to psychological equilibrium either
 
Originally posted by haku:
while LSD and shrooms and even cannabis are known and proven to have triggered psychosis such as schizophrenia, i have never heard claims in this regard concerning MDMA
it's a psychoactive... there are risks involved with the use of ANY psychoactive
Click to expand...
 
Haku, you can edit your own posts - click on the icon of a pencil and paper.
Never heard of MDMA as a *treatment* for schizophrenia, and I didn't find anything along those lines when I searched Pubmed (see my earlier post). You got any references for that? I'd be interested to read 'em. :)
 
thanks for all the write backs. i also have never heard of e being used to treat schitzo or anythng other than couples therapy in the 70's. where did you get that info haku? so lemme get this straight, E DOESN'T burn holes in your brain? where can you find info on any negative effects of extended e use. i really feel that it would be the lsd more than the mdma. acid accesses a whole different part of yur brain. parts you don't normally use. isn't it more likely that lsd could keep those parts open permanantly? didn't that happen to the dude form pink floyd? i appreciate all the interest in thsi thread, thanks ya'll..
 
Anytime the brain is in a period of overstimulation, there is a heightened chance for something to just flip the switch, so to speak, between normal and psychotic states. The comedown from most drugs also has something to do with this, as it is affectively similar to the negative symptoms of schizophrenia.
Dopamine release trigerred by MDMA obviously affects the D2 receptor that is the site of action of conventional antipsychotics and D2 antagonists such as halperidol.
The 5-HT2A receptor, to which MDMA binds, also plays a role in schizophrenia. Atypical antipsychotics, to which even most neuroleptic-resistant patients respond, are antagonists of the receptor.
 
I have personally nursed 4 separate young men who had psychotic episodes that appeared to be related to ecstasy use. Two were using multiple substances, so clearly this was a contributing factor, but the other two were just using ecstasy. These two both recovered with anti-psychotics and abstinence from ecstasy. However one guy would go out and use heavily again and end up psychotic and in hospital again. This happened at least 5 times that I was aware of. I have no doubt there is a link between ecstasy and psychosis, but whether ecstasy causes schizophrenia is another matter entirely.
 
I am schizophrenic (for details do a search), and I have not found MDMA to exacerbate it in any way. In fact, I would have to say that my experience with MDMA,LSD,and other psychedelics has helped, if anything.
I am currently on no medication, and I will not go on any again.
I am also at the beginning of a long break from these drugs (at least a year). My last break was two years long. I tend to do these drugs in spurts, with heavy intensity and consumption.
In any event, I think schizophrenia is still so misunderstood that there can be no reliable conclusions drawn about the impact of these drugs on the schizophrenic mind.
 
There is a proven link between amphetamines and psychosis... however, it is quite likely that those people with a genetic predisposition to it will require lower doses.
There is a definite difference in the brains of normal people and schizophrenics, but it's the chicken and egg really. Did you go schizophrenic because of underlying differences, or did the going becoming schizophrenic change the brain?
 
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