drugs - are they best kept a secret?

[Jakeperson]

I have quit weed, alcohol, opiates, benzos, dissociatives and currently working on meth addictions and gone back to infrequent/recreational use just as willpower exercises. I recommend every one try it, it gets easier.

 

[Foreigner]

@OP

Society must learn to live with its most dangerous knowledge if we are to navigate evolution. Everyone knows how to use a knife but not everyone is hurting themselves or other people with knives in violent acts. We have dangerous technology all around us yet we learn to live in harmony with it.

The deaths you speak of, a great deal of them are a result of prohibition: ignorance, tainted drugs, lack of access to healthcare without legal consequences, gang related violence, and people doing drugs in private and creating a distorted world for themselves because they can't openly talk about it.

Decriminalization in Portugal actually lowered drug use because a lot of people could seek addiction treatment without the system attacking them. All the studies on Spain and Portugal show no significant increases in use.

My point is... drug use is not a technology that we can avoid. The cat's been out of the bag for millennia now. We might as well take the route of harm reduction.

 

[Stevenski]

While I see valid points in many of the arguments here, even/maybe even especially Busty's, I am an advocate for heroin to be legalised. Heroin and meth are vastly different in my opinion, if you are just basing your views on addictiveness, then surely we should ban, or criminalize nicotine and alcohol as well. Surely. No, this has been tried, and it failed dismally, much like the current state of affairs.

If you look at these two drugs in particular, heroin and methamphetamine, which of the two are more damaging to long term users. No, scratch that. Which of the two are damaging to long term users? If you consider heroin to be damaging long term, apart from the obvious addiction itself, then you should send all those doctors like Busty to jail for prescribing morphine, oxycodone, fentanyl, codeine, buprenorphine, methadone, whatever. It's not the substance that causes damage in the case of the opiods, it's the fact they're illegal, they're cut with shit and because of their expense, people often neglect themselves, and as Busty likes to mention, their families. That could change if it was legal, prescribed and cheap.

Meth, no. It could not happen. It's not just that it's addictive. It also causes enormous physical and mental issues.

I would like to agree with you opi8 but a Dr has a duty of care. Good doctors prescribe large dose strong opiates only for terminally ill or those in chronic pain. Opiates are addictive & (Busty would know) would it not violate the hippocratic oath to knowingly supply drugs of addiction without good reason? The drugs I mentioned & alluded to are not addictive in the physical sense & that is why I suggested a psychiatrist prescribe them.

I would be undoubtedly addicted to strong opiates if they were legal but that does not make legalising highly addictive drugs a good idea in my eyes.

 

[opi8]

I don't mean make them free for all, and of course there should be safeguards in place to prevent people, such as yourself, from becoming addicted in the first place. But, when there are people already being prescribed strong opiates for treatment to addiction, what is the difference between heroin and methadone or morphine and buprenorphine? I don't see it and I fail to see why addicts should be criminals simply for being addicts. It is fucked up.

 

[Busty St Clare]

Not as fucked up as reading the misery and despair in the Benzo thread. And I'm pretty sure they have plenty of "safe guards " too and I bet almost every person trying to escape from them started off arguing that they knew what was best for their body.

 

[Jakeperson]

You can know what's best for your body but lose sight of it due to drug addiction.

 

[opi8]

Benzo and opiod addiction are similar in that they are both mentally addictive and cause physical dependance, but that's about where the similarities end.

Benzo users aren't demonized like heroin "junkies", nor are they criminalized like opiod addicts. I don't think your example is relevant in this discussion.

 

[Busty St Clare]

I think it is more than relevant. Benzo's are prescribed for a wide range of conditions, some justified, some not so much. Even this strict regulation has resulted in an unacceptable underclass of addict who struggle to get themselves off once they find their effects unmanageable. You only have to read the last 4-5 pages of our own thread to see numerous BLers who are struggling to taper, or are suddenly caught without a prescription and are suffering the adverse effects of acute withdrawal. How many started via the black market without even having to face any restrictions due to government regulation?

You seem fixated on the "demonization of addicts" where I am more concerned about the physical (or psychological) effects. How is your proposed regulation of the heroin trade going to be different or more successful than how benzo's are handled?

 

[opi8]

I don't pretend to have all the answers, a lot of what I say is thought up on the spot and my opinions change when new facts or information is brought to light. What I do know is that the current way is failing dismally and will continue to do so. As a society, I think we could do better.

I don't have any statistics on this matter, so I don't know how prevalent benzo misuse is compared to heroin misuse, I think on a drug forum you may be getting highly skewed figures, however I dare say that a lot more lives are negatively affected and many more ultimately ruined because of the illegal nature of heroin, that's not even considering it's prohibitive cost, than that of benzos.

Also, here's a contradiction for you and your kind. A vast majority of doctors would happily prescribe valium for someone who is a self admitted benzo addict, because they know the withdrawals are dangerous and potentially life threatening. They do not prescribe morphine to a self described opiod addict, even though it would be in the best interests of the patients physical and mental wellbeing, the best interest of the patients family, the community and world as a whole.

It is not a black and white issue, but doctors especially need to show a little understanding if it's ever going to work.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Education is always the way. Sure, education on drugs will mean more people using drugs, and would most likely result in more incidents than keeping it a secret. But I believe that the incidents after a while (not entirely sure on how long a time period it would take, i'd hope no-longer than a few years) would decline and eventually stop. To progress as a society we have to be prepared for losses and I wish it wasn't true, as I'd love to see mass awareness work without any repercussions, but we have to set sensitivity aside for the sake of the progression of society.

Just my opinion, if this seems brutal, or offends anyone I apologise in advance.

 

[gimpan]

I think that providing education on drugs, and legalising them, is a way to reduce harm. But, I also think that if drugs were legalised, or even if more education was provided, that more people would use drugs. You just have to look at the amount of people who use alchohol and tobacco - it's not because they're the best drugs, it's because they're legal. I think if drugs were decriminalised or legalised, there'd be a big surge in usage, at least to begin with. Especially with something like methamphetamine, which can make people so much more productive - something that's highly valued in our society.

The sad story of the teenager who died after using Tassie poppies made me think about this. Is it perhaps better not to educate the world about drugs, because overall, less people will use that way, and hence there'll be less deaths? Or do you think all the information should be put out there, and people can decide for themselves whether to use or not? It's a hard one for me. I believe that the info should be out there, and criminalising drugs is wrong, but at the same time...I think that coming across drugs can alter your life, and it's impossible to make a fully informed choice to first use a highly addictive drug. Sometimes I wish I just hadn't known about drugs for a few more years; it's one of those things you can't un-know.

What does everyone else think...?

Wow, Its quite refreshing to hear this kind of reasoned, rational debate when it comes to the dangers of legalising of drugs in Australia.

I know there is people on this site that are wary of extreme thinking, such as advocating legalising hard drugs.