Opioids Does Kratom interfere with Vivitrol (causing pwd)?

[Realmccoy]

Post acute withdrawal is usually caused by either the naloxone in the Suboxone or the fact that Suboxone has a high affinity for the receptors so it throws the heroin off. Kratom has a much lower affinity.

Sorry for being a dick! I spent six hours looking for my wallet yesterday. And I everything else!

 

[Shant]

Sorry for being a dick! I spent six hours looking for my wallet yesterday. And I everything else!

Nah man you weren’t even close to being a dick, you posted a shit ton of good information and I appreciate all of it. Did you find your wallet?

 

[Realmccoy]

Nah man you weren’t even close to being a dick, you posted a shit ton of good information and I appreciate all of it. Did you find your wallet?

Krogers had it satan be praised! I cleaned my entire house so it wasn’t time completely wasted.

 

[angelomorgano]

PS - to all 12 to 15 posters on here who told you that 2mgs of suboxone would get you “MUCH MUCH HIGHER” than Kratom are all liars or fools. You could slip 2mg in the drink of someone who has never done an opiate in their life and they probably wouldn’t even notice.

suboxone (buprenorphine) is 22 times as strong heroin, bioavailability sublingual is 30% which means 2mg * 22 * 0.33 =13.2mg heroin/oxy Trust me, people will who never done opiates feel that shit.

 

[Realmccoy]

suboxone (buprenorphine) is 22 times as strong heroin, bioavailability sublingual is 30% which means 2mg * 22 * 0.33 =13.2mg heroin/oxy Trust me, people will who never done opiates feel that shit.

No it has a 22 times higher affinity for the receptor. But it is only a partial agonist so most would say it isn’t stronger. In what way are you trying to say it’s stronger?

 

[Shady's Fox]

They bind the same receptors, lol

 

[angelomorgano]

No it has a 22 times higher affinity for the receptor. But it is only a partial agonist so most would say it isn’t stronger. In what way are you trying to say it’s stronger?

I meant in terms of equivalent dosage. Morphine equivalent dose (mme). Methadone is about twice as strong as oxy and heroin, which are about equal. Not sure if that strength is actually affinity though...

 

[Sdonyblogna]

I’ll give you my 2 cents amigo, as I’ve gone both routes multiple times. Suboxone is better for kicking. For the sheer reason you feel absolutely nothing, which is why it’s good for beating the psychological addiction which any addict knows is 10 times harder to shake than the physical addiction.Suboxone is a strange drug in that you can start at 24mg and ween down to 4mg inside a week, maybe 10 days and not notice a damn thing. Plus it’s got a 37 hour half life which is much longer than Kratom so you can do it once a day or split your dose morning and night and you’re all good. Kratom you’ll be doing a few times a day. It’s unpredictable which is very bad for detoxing.

But that’s not to say you can’t make the Kratom work for you. You can, there’s plenty of people in this forum that have done it. But for me? Beating years of heroin/fentanyl/methadone abuse, suboxone was literally the only thing that gave me half a chance.

I am 15 days off 2g daily habit. On 8mg subs 2x daily. I've been. Cutting down. Taking either one once a day or breaking up one. I got precipitated withdrawals badly so I never felt that buzz that subs used to give me. Anyways. What was your experience getting off of subs? I feel like they do nothing at all

 

[Shant]

suboxone (buprenorphine) is 22 times as strong heroin, bioavailability sublingual is 30% which means 2mg * 22 * 0.33 =13.2mg heroin/oxy Trust me, people will who never done opiates feel that shit.

I’m pretty sure I don’t believe that but let’s suppose by some metric it is indeed 22 times stronger than heroin. Then we have to get into what we mean when we say “stronger”. It may be stronger, mg for mg, as a painkiller (I’m still skeptical) but that doesn’t mean you’re gonna feel it. Maybe somebody with absolutely no tolerance would feel the 2mg but nobody in their right mind is gonna describe the way they feel is “very very high.”

Dunno, maybe I’m weird, but I literally can’t detect any amount of suboxone from 2mg to 24mg. It’s all the same: nothing. And that’s a major reason why it’s as effective as it is.Because there is no euphoria or feeling of any kind, you’re dealing with the psychological addiction on top of the physical addiction.

 

[GetMeOutOfThisCRAP]

I've taken subs 5 minutes after my last dose of kratom. I'm convinced that for me personally there is no correlation between the two and precipitated withdrawal. It might also depend on the sub dose or how large you're dosing kratom?

I just don't want to tell someone that the two have no interaction and then have someone go into PWD! Just my experience of subs never causing PWD from kratom alone (but I wouldn't do this with opioids for example).

 

[angelomorgano]

I’m pretty sure I don’t believe that but let’s suppose by some metric it is indeed 22 times stronger than heroin. Then we have to get into what we mean when we say “stronger”. It may be stronger, mg for mg, as a painkiller (I’m still skeptical) but that doesn’t mean you’re gonna feel it. Maybe somebody with absolutely no tolerance would feel the 2mg but nobody in their right mind is gonna describe the way they feel is “very very high.”

Dunno, maybe I’m weird, but I literally can’t detect any amount of suboxone from 2mg to 24mg. It’s all the same: nothing. And that’s a major reason why it’s as effective as it is.Because there is no euphoria or feeling of any kind, you’re dealing with the psychological addiction on top of the physical addiction.

I googled for morphine equivalence and found many sources that confirm that the equivalent dose to 10mg morphine is 0.3 mg buprenorphine: https://cdn.sanity.io/images/0vv8mo...d8dd225a9bea871046bc4-630x444.png?auto=format

Maybe my assumptions are all wrong, but I calculate it like that when tapering. So if I have a 150mg oxy habit, then I divide my 22 a go a little lower even and that's my starting dose usually.

While I was tapering off, I started with 5mgs sub, it's not really a "high" but I definitely feel something, my pupils were small and I did feel a certain blanked of comfort and sedation over me.

 

[Shant]

It gets way more complicated than that but it’s not worth all the writing. I don’t disagree with anything you said there, but I definitely denounce the idea that 2mg of bile is “much much stronger” than Kratom.