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Do people use dope as an excuse for being sheisty?

carniegirl818

carniegirl818

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Jan 6, 2013
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So Cal
I hear alot of people talk about the horrible things they do/did for dope. And I see shows like, 'Intervention,' (which I HATE,) that show people on drugs who are the absolute worst examples of the stereotypical drug addict that reality T.V. producers can dig up. All of this feeding into this idea that doing drugs turns people into low-life, lying, stealing, dirt-bags. I've been using drugs for the majority of the last 20 years, (mostly meth,) and I still have most of my teeth, (all the front ones-I had 2 pulled in the back.) I've never stolen from anyone to get high, or stolen dope from anyone. I've never compromised myself to get high. (i.e. trading sexual favors.) And the only lying I do is when I pretend I don't do drugs to people who will "punish" me for it. I have a job, I pay my bills and I take care of myself. If I didn't, I'd be broke and homeless, which makes it alot harder to support my habit. I've known several other people like me, who manage to be decent human beings and even maintain the illusion of normalcy.

What I think is this: doing drugs doesn't make you scandalous. It simply removes self control. Personally, when I see money laying around at someone's house, my first impulse is to either find out who's it is and tell them to put it away before someone takes it, or just ignore it. People always find things and ask,"who's is this?" Thinking that if no one speaks up that makes it okay to keep it. I already know the answer: It's not mine. Beyond that it doesn't matter. My point is that it's just a matter of two different types of people. And while some people manage to reign themselves in while they're sober, when they get high they give in to the impulse to be whatever kind of shithead they've always wished they could be. And then they go,"It wasn't me who ripped you off / slept with your SO / left you hanging for 3 days, etc... it was the dope." I say BS. It was the real person, with the filters turned off. What do you think?
 
The girlfriend and I always joke that if we were ever put on a show like Intervention, it would be the most boring episode ever; we don't steal, trade sexual favors for drugs, pawn priceless family heirlooms...

For the most part, our days go a little something like this: we wake up, go to work, come home, and if we've found some way to come up with money, then we'll go pick up some bags, and if we haven't, well then we won't. If we begin feeling sick, then we'll take a little bit of suboxone and call it a day...

Most of the time, we can come up with some money or some way to get bags, but it's never anything underhanded or shiesty. We'll borrow the money (and we're always very careful to pay the person back in full and on time), ask to have my paycheck advanced (work for a small mom and pop shop so again, it's no big deal), ask for a front from our dealer, or we have a few other tricks as well, none of which are illegal or involve doing anyone dirty.
 
carniegirl818 said:
All of this feeding into this idea that doing drugs turns people into low-life, lying, stealing, dirt-bags.
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Yep. Most of us junkies are surprisingly responsible. I've always managed to hold down a job when dabbling in various drugs off the clock. I've never let it affect my work, I've never had to steal or do anything degrading to pay for drugs. In fact, drugs inspired my interest in the sciences more than anything else. Some of the best agricultural minds out there today are cannabis producers, some of the best chemists are old dudes cooking up LSD in California.

When you see people who's lives have completely deteriorated from drug use - the problem there's the individual, not the drug. Hell, they probably didn't need the drug. They probably could've let their life be ruined by many things, be it gambling, shopping, the variety of addictions people cope with. The key is to know yourself, know what you can do and what you can't. Blaming the drug is just a total cop-out - no different than a drunk blaming what he did the night before on alcohol. You've got to be responsible for your own actions, and most of us are.
 
carniegirl818 said:
I've been using drugs for the majority of the last 20 years, (mostly meth,) and I still have most of my teeth, (all the front ones-I had 2 pulled in the back.) I've never stolen from anyone to get high, or stolen dope from anyone.
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Oh that West Coast slang.
 
I generally agree here, but not fully.

Sometimes, the experiences that an organism (in this case a human) has can change them, temporarily or permanently. Sometimes they change positively, sometimes negatively, but the experiences they go through mediate what actually happens to their mind and behaviour.

I DO believe that sometimes a person's use of a drug or multiple drugs can lead to serious ethical impairment. This is because they are obviously affected by what they go through while dealing with their addiction. The things they have to do to score affect them, and the way that withdrawal feels also affects them.

Just using the drug is not enough. If you have an endless supply, then I don't think, in most cases, that it'd cause these problems. I think that your ethics only get seriously assaulted when you accidentally (and often slowly) brainwash yourself by getting addicted and constantly having to seek the substance your body is screaming that it needs. The negative experiences you go through while addicted are what destroy or taint a person's behaviour.

I'm not saying the drug is the problem, not at all. Just that when there are many difficulties and harsh emotional experiences related to one's use of a drug, then they are entering into dangerous waters, and these difficulties and experiences are likely going to alter their mental experience and their behaviours.

We're a brain with a body. If our actions/choices for what to do with our body cause our brain to have to deal with horrible feelings/events, then we are changing the way our brain (and thus mind) functions. All experiences change people, and bad experiences like many drug users experience change people for the worse.
 
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i don't know, i think the people who are sheisty in the first place will definitely use drugs as an excuse to perpetuate their behavior. The truth is, most people can handle their drugs, it's the odd person that ends up an addict on intervention, and they usually have severe family/mental issues to deal with that are the bigger problem than the drugs themselves. The drug population is not fairly represented as unfortunately there are no TV shows that show real life stories of people getting fucking high and doing well in life.

I've met a lot of fucked up people on the street who are like the addicts you see on intervention, and it's not all bullshit, there are enough people in my area who are completely fucking addicted to shooting dilaudid and have no ethical/moral problems about doing whatever the fuck they can to get more. I bet they are sketchy fucking people in the first place though, most grew up in terrible situations and have had terrible lives, so they've told me at least. I never shot dillies but snorted my fair share and never resorted to doing anything i would consider immoral/unethical, definitely affected my life though and personal relationships.

the question is which dope are we talking about here, heroin/strong opiates or meth/amps? I find tweakers much less predictable than opiate users, and as such more likely to do really fucking sketchy things, especially when they are up for days and are in psychosis.
 
the question is which dope are we talking about here, heroin/strong opiates or meth/amps? I find tweakers much less predictable than opiate users, and as such more likely to do really fucking sketchy things, especially when they are up for days and are in psychosis.
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Good point. But again, that would be the person, not the dope. First of all, only the idiots who stay awake for days & days are getting to that level of delusional. Sleep deprivation causes cognitive difficulty and hallucinations. It's actually the sleep deprivation that causes most of the psycho-behavior in tweekers. When I was young & first started using the stuff I once stayed awake for 5 days. I couldn't tell what was real & what wasn't. It was not a feeling I enjoyed. I went to sleep for a long time and decided to never ever do that again. Someone who seeks out that feeling is messed up to begin with. I do think there are plenty of people who are normal, functioning people who happen to get high. But there are so many more idiots who blame drugs for all the stupid things they do, that it makes the rest of us look bad. I love people who say, "I didn't mean that. I was just drunk." What is the latin expression? I don't remember, but basically it means, "In wine there is truth." I think that makes alot of sense. When people are under the influence of any substance, their inner selves come out. Even the tweeker who's been up for 26 days and is literally seeing things, will give you an idea of what's in their head just by the nature of their hallucinations.
 
I used to live in Cali, think about having to deal with it when youre the only Heroin user in a group of mostly Meth smokers and you all call your DOC "dope"
 
LOL. I apologize. I guess it is a west coast thing. I tend to call anything but weed "dope". Around here it's just a question of black or white. If it really bothers you, I'll try to remember that "speed isn't dope". But then what do I call it? It feels weird to say "meth" or "crystal" all the time. The only other word I'm used to using for it is "shit". I'm still trying to figure out what a stamp is. And all the pills and prescriptions people talk about on here? Makes me feel like I took my first hit of weed yesterday. It's kinda nice. :D But anyway, I'm pretty sure all the terminology is already the subject of another thread.
 
Yeah, we all called it Shit or Crystal. You may want to check out the slang thread but its a lot either to just call it Meth or Crystal on BL since, like we already experienced here, slang is all geographical.
 
Let's face it were animals. It don't matter what anyone will say otherwise. Morals are an illusion we put in place to have a well functioning society. We are no diffrnt than the wild tigers killin prey or other tigers for territory or survival.

Some ppl will do 'bad' things for drugs. Its not the substance but the person. Others gotta eat n the only way to do that is by commiting 'crimes'. Ppl will use their addiction as an excuse sometimes or they legitimately need to rob in order to keep from gettn sick. I don't blame em. Animals gonna be animals. Step or get stepped on is what I always say.
 
I dont feel bad for people who become pieces of shit to support their habit.

I really dont.

Make the rest of us look bad anyway, fuck them
 
See? That's what I mean. I'm not perfect or anything. I've done the wrong thing a few times. But not because of drugs or to get drugs. People blame their bad behavior on the dope and it's a cop out. It makes the rest of us look bad. I'm just saying that instead of sitting in an NA meeting telling everyone all the bad things the "dope made me do," people just need to own up.
 
carniegirl818 said:
LOL. I apologize. I guess it is a west coast thing. I tend to call anything but weed "dope". Around here it's just a question of black or white. If it really bothers you, I'll try to remember that "speed isn't dope". But then what do I call it? It feels weird to say "meth" or "crystal" all the time. The only other word I'm used to using for it is "shit". I'm still trying to figure out what a stamp is. And all the pills and prescriptions people talk about on here? Makes me feel like I took my first hit of weed yesterday. It's kinda nice. :D But anyway, I'm pretty sure all the terminology is already the subject of another thread.
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dont appologize, its not like you're wrong or anything

slang is one of those things, and essentially dope can mean heroin or meth

its just a personal pet peeve of mine i guess, n i think there are more h users on this forum then meth users, but dope can be whatever someone wants it to be i guess i just personally feel dope=heroin
 
XThexXTank said:
Let's face it were animals. It don't matter what anyone will say otherwise. Morals are an illusion we put in place to have a well functioning society. We are no diffrnt than the wild tigers killin prey or other tigers for territory or survival.

Some ppl will do 'bad' things for drugs. Its not the substance but the person. Others gotta eat n the only way to do that is by commiting 'crimes'. Ppl will use their addiction as an excuse sometimes or they legitimately need to rob in order to keep from gettn sick. I don't blame em. Animals gonna be animals. Step or get stepped on is what I always say.
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well we are slightly different than a tiger, for one we have rationality. If you can base your morals on rationality (act in such a way that it would make sense that everyone could act that way, ie. if everyone steals, no one will trust each other, so no one will be able to steal, therefor immoral. That's Kant's sense of morality. It is all subjective IMO though and if you kill someone in cold blood i doubt you face any consequences other than the ones we impose on ourselves. Still there is human empathy, and if you lack that, you can end up doing some terrible things to people that cause them pain and misery. There is definitely a percentage of drug users who are like this, most often i find they like stimulants but they can like any drug. Are they acting immoral? well it's not really their fault, they were made that way, it's tough to prove (impossible) that morality is not subjective, so there really is no right or wrong.

However empathy can guide us to what we think is right or wrong based on how we feel the other person would feel, ie. golden rule. Doesn't apply to sociopaths or sadists or whatever though, therein lies the problem because they lack empathy, they also have the ability to manipulate otherwise empathetic people. For example the alcoholic who begs and pleads for a few dollars so they can get drunk or the junkie who steals all your shit to get high. Some feel bad about these things and don't do it again, others couldn't give a fuck.

which brings me back to my first point, the type of people willing to do terrible things on drugs for drugs or whatever else, are probably the type of people who would do it anyway. Drugs are irrelevant in this case and my answer is Yes people use 'dope' as an excuse for their behavior in many cases. But there are more of us that aren't like this than are (no i dont have sources or stats for this). If we were all fucked like that the whole drug market would shut down. It's not a kill or be killed thing, without cooperation the drug trade does not work.
 
i would equate people usin drugs as an excuse for bein shiesty to people usin the excuse of bein drunk for doin fucked up shit

its all bout not takin responsibility for your actions
 
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