Desert island Discs/Drugs

[Marmalade]

I understand jung's ideas on collective unconsciousness pretty well

but your reference to 'a mantra that's emerged in the collective' just infers to me that you're distancing yourself from the 'collective' and I honestly dont know who or what they are in your terms.

[edit] I generally try to quote my own perspectives [which, it's a given to me] are a combined/mashup developed from all the great and relative ideas ive identified with throughout my life and experiences, rather than just quote someone elses thoughts.
Black and whites are something that no longer make proper sense to me, although Im not 100% on that either, lol

 

[YellowPolkaDotHalo]

Durkheim talked about unconscious forces that impact the consciousness but do we have to mince words?

Yeah I suppose I am observing as if from outside of it Marmz its because Im an enlightened soul and am conscious of truths that the lumpen collectai are not party to.

By collective I mean society at large.

 

[Marmalade]

Durkheim talked about unconscious forces that impact the consciousness but do we have to mince words?

in this case, yes. it was valid. especially as you initially tried to polarise the intent of my ideology into something it wasn't, despite me being fairly clear about it. maybe 'word or thought mincing' is a privilege for 'non-collectives' only

i'm going to try to go sleep now.

g'nite fellow collectives, it feels kinda weird being part of that umbrella ... but I'm gonna try to bond and start networking with everyone tomorrow

non-collectives? ... here's some love ---->

 

[YellowPolkaDotHalo]

I didnt try to 'polarise' anything. I took your idealogy 'do what thou will and be your own law while it harms no-one' to be
Aleister Crowleys ' do what thou will be the whole of your law' I'm sure you can see the similarity.

Is this the first time you have seen the Aleister Crowley quote? If so then I'm obviously imagining that its in fashion as a philosophy. If not then surely we are over analysing my original post here.

I dont really like Aleister Crowley.. I think hes a dickhead and I dont want to take his 'law' to my island. I respect your ideology
and your right to have it and Im saddened that you would think that I'm intolerant but I wouldnt want to take your ' law'
to my island either.

 

[knock]

Oi you two stop your argy-bargying!

I think the "while it harms no-one" makes the world of difference between the two "quotes".

 

[Allein]

The above is a fine example of why I don't but into organised religions or belief systems in general, although I'm not accusing anyone here of doing that. I don't believe we can communicate such things through something as crude as language. The truth, our own truth is within us all and not something that can be shared with others merely by sharing some writings be it on an internet forum or a 1000/2000...... year old book, of course IMO

Now a good few years on your own on a dessert island contemplating and meditating could well lead to greater enlightenment, maybe I should change my drug of choice to DMT...in fact this morning I have a new list :-


Music:-

Public Image Ltd - Metal box

13th Floor Elevators - Easter Everywhere

The Orb - Adventures Beyond the Ultraworld

Book:-

A blank notepad and pen - I'll write my own thoughts

Substance :-

DMT to aid my meditation

 

[koneko]

DMT to aid my meditation

How'd that work Mr atm?

"Meditation refers to a family of self-regulation practices that focus on training attention and awareness in order to bring mental processes under greater voluntary control and thereby foster general mental well-being and development and/or specific capacities such as calm, compassion, clarity, and concentration"

 

[Marmalade]

Oi you two stop your argy-bargying!

I think the "while it harms no-one" makes the world of difference between the two "quotes".

yes, and to me, it's all about that difference.

@YDPH - yes I've seen the crowley quote and have also read about crowley enough to know that I don't like him too much either, but some of his underlying baseline ideology is worth considering. however it's not enough for me, and he doesn't consider enough of humanities 'fundamentals' especially some of the most important ones that I value the most, and I dont like the implications of such, and will never do.

I apply the same criteria to most of the ideologies I consider, and everyone & thing gets the same cross reference. cherry picking what makes most fundamental sense to me from the whole spectrum of them, and adding/developing my own mainly just serves as a proccess to making sure that all the fundamental values I possess as a person can in some way be 'explained' and made sense of in a fairly loose but specific set of words, for the sake of relativity with others.

what should and usually does emerge is a philosophical outlook of my own that adequately explains to me and confirms that Im being 'true' and consistent with my value system, 'values' being for me key beliefs I almost 'absolutely' believe in, and are nearly 99% cast in stone in my mind [but certainly open to question]

If I'm going to an island, to be on my own, I'm certainly not going to be living by anyone else's specific laws or value systems. I'm responsible and accountable and can take responsibility for my own behaviour, and as such will create my own laws.

If I get stuck with the whole thing I might ask myself, 'what would Buddha do'? since an esoteric [edit] and 'internally reflective'[/edit] approach when being alone on a desert island might be a good partnership to remaining sane.

 

[Marmalade]

I respect your ideology
and your right to have it and Im saddened that you would think that I'm intolerant but I wouldnt want to take your ' law'
to my island either.

and I wouldnt want you to either, I think you'd be better off developing your own, rather than living with someone elses, by verbatim. including mine.

and you can't take mine anyway, since you've only seen/are aware of a small snippet and I'm not going to be producing any kind of 'manual' for it anytime soon for you to know the rest. I'm a poor writer, so I'll leave that to Cult Leaders and Prophets. Most of my law stays inside my head, where it belongs, and what its for

 

[Allein]

How'd that work Mr atm?

"Meditation refers to a family of self-regulation practices that focus on training attention and awareness in order to bring mental processes under greater voluntary control and thereby foster general mental well-being and development and/or specific capacities such as calm, compassion, clarity, and concentration"

Many South American tribes use their experiences under such things as DMT and then use sessions of meditation to integrate the experiences into themselves and aid in enlightenment. Maybe I didn't explain it all that well (you see words cannot really convey truth all that well if at all IMO) I'm not suggesting you can really meditating as such under the influence but I do believe that psychedelics can have a part to play in the path to personal enlightenment, if used the the correct set and setting and what better than a desert island

 

[koneko]

Many South American tribes use their experiences under such things as DMT and then use sessions of meditation to integrate the experiences into themselves and aid in enlightenment. Maybe I didn't explain it all that well (you see words cannot really convey truth all that well if at all IMO) I'm not suggesting you can really meditating as such under the influence but I do believe that psychedelics can have a part to play in the path to personal enlightenment, if used the the correct set and setting and what better than a desert island

No you explained that very well sir - like shamens you mean? (btw have you read any Carlos Castaneda?) Yes, I can see that. I practice mindful meditation, no need for anything but your breath

(Hugs) to you.

 

[jancrow]

'And you harm none, do what you will' came from Wicca (and probably somewhere else before that). Crowley took it and bastardized it, flipped the script, done a number on it (and that number shall be... LOL).

 

[Allein]

No you explained that very well sir - like shamens you mean? (btw have you read any Carlos Castaneda?) Yes, I can see that. I practice mindful meditation, no need for anything but your breath

(Hugs) to you.

I haven't Kate but the audio books are now winging their way to my PC across the internet, thank you for the tip, I have read (listened) to quite a bit of Terrnece McKenna, like I mentioned before I find reading difficult and pretty much didn't read anything other than technical manuals, and magazines. Not really sure why I just don't have the inclination although I do, of course read to my kids.

Believe me people could learn allot from reading simple kids books like "Find a Smile - Melrose and Croc" my personal favorite

I few years ago I discovered Audio books and have been playing catch up ever since, I started on Sci-fi Philip K Dick and William Gibson but have been through all sorts now from The teachings of Buddha to Richard Dawkins.

I'll let you know how I get on with Carlos, but I'm sticking with my notepad, as truth comes from within.

I started practising meditation and muscle relaxation recently as part of my CBT work, I still find it difficult to focus but I've got a lifetime to work on it

 

[brimz]

I'm loving the way this thread has deviated , was kinda of what i was hoping for when i started it .
But lets not have it turn in to a religious beliefs type thing , that could be another thread entirely

 

[koneko]

Carlos was outted at a scam merchant, but worthy of a read even for the lols.

I started practising meditation and muscle relaxation recently as part of my CBT work, I still find it difficult to focus but I've got a lifetime to work on it

No effort, non attainment are worth remembering with any meditation practises, its all just in "the doing". Have you been introduced to the body-scan, that's very useful. Hope you've been given some guided tapes / CD's, learning the practises on your own is hard, a guide or practitioner makes a massive difference. I have a group I go to once a month. We all sit there in silence for 2 hours, must look bloody ridiculous to anyone peeking in haha.

Jon Kabat Zinn is yer man for mindfulness mixed with the medical - I'd have to say his teachings have turned my life around
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Kabat-Zinn

So pleased to here you're getting something from the cbt and practices like this %)

Back to the desert - I'll be making desserts from the tropical island fruits. Make yourself a banana boat and come over for dinner sometime.

 

[YellowPolkaDotHalo]

lawdy. just FUCK the rules, like you do with your TV licence

make a list of whatever you want to take with you, and just fucking take it. end of

hide it in your cooch/knickers/whutever.

you may get it confiscated, or you might get away with it, but why restrict yourself? the penalties in this case are meaningless

do what thou will and be your own law while it harms no-one


hoe noes!
*cue stringent & 'reactive' legislation from the Brimster*

[love j00, Brimzy ;p ]

Heres your reply to my ideas about my Island thing..Have another look at it and tell me if you can see where you might have suggested an ideology of yours to take. Perhaps I just took umbrage to a perceived dogmatic tone..

I'm just not into rules and laws Marmz..but if I do decide to submit to the Grand Lodge of the Big Knickered Crabs and walk around on Wednesdays with an octopus tentacle up my arse I'll be doing that too. End of. x

'And you harm none, do what you will' came from Wicca (and probably somewhere else before that). Crowley took it and bastardized it, flipped the script, done a number on it (and that number shall be... LOL).

Jancrow I think its the popularity of Wicca and atheism that has bought that 'do what you will' rule into fashion in terms of
ideologies or spiritualities.

 

[YellowPolkaDotHalo]

I'm loving the way this thread has deviated , was kinda of what i was hoping for when i started it .
But lets not have it turn in to a religious beliefs type thing , that could be another thread entirely

Yeah Sorry Brimz its another thread and a tired old thing it would be too. Religion does my head in.

 

[Allein]

I'm loving the way this thread has deviated , was kinda of what i was hoping for when i started it .
But lets not have it turn in to a religious beliefs type thing , that could be another thread entirely

What not even the holy temple of Melrose and Croc

Your a stickler Mr Brimz!

PIL - Religion

 

[Myshkin]

'And you harm none, do what you will' came from Wicca (and probably somewhere else before that). Crowley took it and bastardized it, flipped the script, done a number on it (and that number shall be... LOL).

Crowley actually took it from Rabelais ("Do as thou wilt" - published in 1534), and Crowley's own use certainly predates the Wiccan Rede, which was first recorded in 1964 (as opposed to Crowley's motto which dates back to 1904 and the reception of the Book Of The Law). It doesn't mean 'do what you want' either, and it certainly doesn't mean you have the right to interfere with somebody else carrying out their will.

Whether you believe that the Rede predates Gardnerian Wicca is another matter entirely but I couldn't resist that bit of pedantry, especially where Uncle Al's involved. Sorry.