Dealing with Addiction.

[the seeker]

marijuana addiction is not entirely psychological (although its certainly mostly psychological), a marijuana user can be at least in part motivated to continue using in order to avoid minor (yet unpleasant) withdrawal symptoms.

 

[killo]

Only people who aren't comfortable with their lives are addicted to weed.

Weed adds that extra change in the way you look at things, it might be the only thing that can motivate you to go outside, play videogames.

It's you, and only you.

Weed isn't addictive, you've just got problems.

Stop being pussies, this ain't speed, this ain't heroin.

 

[killo]

It's all in your head, just like tobacco and crack cocaine and meth and sex and video games.

Weed is in your head.

But crack, coke, and meth aren't the same mental dependency at all. Meth depletes your dopamine with excessive use, the wanting to do more has alot to do with wanting that confidence and wanting to replenish dopamine because you're sad without it, addicted to it.

IT IS NOT THE SAME.

I swear, this forum is full of fucktard lazy/pussy stoners, the type that give me and my friends a bad name.

Weed DOES NOT TOUCH DOPAMINE, it is a psychedelic. Psychedelics are not fucking addicting.

I'm sorry but I am sick of this thread, it's not addicting it's all about the person.

 

[Khadijah]

i
hypocritical much? you can't prove that smoking cant have a negative affect on your tongue. all you can do is listen to my experience and choose to believe it not to believe it. i don't see why you find it necessary to be hostle about this. what kind of moderator are you anyway?

Dude, youre the one whose like "WAAAH, YOUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT FACT! JUST CUZ IT HAPPEND THAT WAY TO YOU DONT MAKE IT A DEFINITIVE TRUTH"

8)

Then you come in here like "well, whether or not there is any medical or scientific evidence whatsoever for this, this is what happened to me, so believe it, cuz its true, cuz i said so."

Experience dont = facts. Theres alot of things that we, as non medical doctors, and average humans, dont know. Theres alot of reasons why your tongue could be fucked up. and chances are unless you, out of the thousands of other people on this board, have some strange, evil, mysterious tongue illness that only comes out when weed is involved, then there was probably some other reason for this "pot tongue rot" you claim. and theres nothin wrong with the fact that you wouldnt know what really caused it, cuz thats what research an ddoctors are for.

But when people make claims like "well, it happened to me, so it must be real!" they forget the hundreds of thousands of amazing things goin on in the human body, that can be upset by even the tiniest unnoticable thing to cause some "mystery illness" like you described. While you, the victim, knows nothing about the background of other shit goin on that might cause it, the only thing you know is to attribute it to weed, cuz thats the thing that seems to make sense.

That dont mean that you are correct, or that its really what happened. its just your best hypothesis.

 

[Khadijah]

Heroin and Alcohol and Barbs and Benzos can cause physical addiction, and addiction to these substances is much harder and worse than a marijuana addiction will ever be. Marijuana addiction is a joke in comparison. Stop trying to sound like you've been through it all.

What your trying to argue is ridiculous. Rereading this thread just makes the topic seem more and more absurd.

You came a long way, CR. Gotta give u a double thumbs up for this one.

And if you cut them off cold turkey, their body would not function normally. Their body will have gained a physical dependence, and they would be addicted - as 'defunked' as it may be. This would not happen in the same case with marijuana. Are you so stupid that this doesn't make any sense to you? Do I need to draw this for you? Why are you even arguing this?

LMFAO.........Man.....it might not be worded all diplomatic, but that shits hilarious....what i been sayin....

 

[Sprinklervibes]

Why the hell are we comparing cannabis to other drugs in this topic? Yes, we've heard it, there are other drugs that have much worse withdrawal. Yes, you're a badass junky. Rolleyes.

 

[Blowmonkey]

you can't prove that smoking cant have a negative affect on your tongue. all you can do is listen to my experience and choose to believe it not to believe it.

Tongues don't rot away due to smoking.. You'd be making medical history if it were true. Subject closed, I'm not gonna argue about it further.

I'm gonna back you up on the other stuff though. Most people I see posting in this thread probably aren't well read on the subject, I see a lot of phallacies..

Here you go again. I've posted this several times in the last couple of years to silence the critics. The ones who still refuse to believe this all aren't worth talking to in my eyes, we could have a bit of a laugh seeing their rebuttals.

Despite past skepticism, it has been established that, although it is not common, a vulnerable subpopulation of marijuana users can develop dependence. Adolescents, particularly those with conduct disorders, individuals with psychiatric disorders, or problems with substance abuse appear to be at greater risk for marijuana dependence than the general population.

CONCLUSION: A distinctive marijuana withdrawal syndrome has been identified, but it is mild and short-lived. The syndrome includes restlessness, irritability, mild agitation, insomnia, sleep EEG disturbance, nausea, and cramping.

Under "Summary and Conclusions"
http://www.rism.org/isg/dlp/ganja/analyses/Marijuana and Medicine 3a.html#psycho

Review of the Validity and Significance of Cannabis Withdrawal Syndrome
Alan J. Budney, Ph.D., John R. Hughes, M.D., Brent A. Moore, Ph.D. and Ryan Vandrey, M.A.

We propose that the cannabis withdrawal syndrome is reliable, valid, and clinically important and should be included in the next revision of DSM.

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/161/11/1967#SEC6

And a list of some other articles:

Didcott P, Reilly D, Swift W, Hall W. Long-term cannabis users on the New South Wales North Coast. NDARC Monograph No. 30. Sydney, Australia:NDARC, 1997:36-41.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=pubmed&list_uids=10812291&dopt=Citation

Swift W, Hall W, Copeland J. Cannabis dependence among long-term users in Sydney, Australia. NDARC Tech Rep No. 47. Sydney, Australia:NDARC, 1997.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9744119&dopt=Citation

Crowley TJ, Macdonald MJ, Whitmore EA, Mikulich SK. Cannabis dependence, withdrawal, and reinforcing effects among adolescents with conduct symptoms and substance use disorders. Drug Alcohol Depend 1998;50:27-37.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9589270&dopt=Citation

Wiesbeck GA, Schuckit MA, Kalmijn JA, Tipp JE, Bucholz KK, Smith TL. An evaluation of the history of a marijuana withdrawal syndrome in a large population. Addiction 1996;91:1469-1478
http://www.ingentaconnect.com/searc...//carfax/cadd/1996/00000091/00000010/art00006

Haney M, Ward AS, Comer SD, Foltin RW, Fischman MW. Abstinence symptoms following oral THC administration to humans. Psychopharmacology 1999;141:385-394.
http://www.springerlink.com/app/hom...,134,189;linkingpublicationresults,1:100390,1

Haney M, Ward AS, Comer SD, Foltin RW, Fischman MW. Abstinence symptoms following smoked marijuana in humans. Psychopharmacology 1999;141:395-404.
http://www.springerlink.com/app/hom...,134,189;linkingpublicationresults,1:100390,1

Aceto MD, Scates SM, Lowe JA, Martin BR. Cannabinoid precipitated withdrawal by the selective cannabinoid receptor antagonist, SR 141716A. Eur J Pharmacol 1995;282:R1-R2
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7498260&dopt=Citation

Abood ME, Sauss C, Fan F, Tilton CL, Martin BR.Development of behavioral tolerance to delta 9-THC without alteration of cannabinoid receptor binding or mRNA levels in whole brain. Department of Pharmacology and Toxicology, Medical College of Virginia, Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond 23298.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=retrieve&db=pubmed&list_uids=8278434&dopt=Abstract

MD Aceto, SM Scates, JA Lowe and BR Martin Dependence on delta 9-tetrahydrocannabinol: studies on precipitated and abrupt withdrawal Department of Pharmacology and Toxicology, Medical College of Virginia, Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond, USA.
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/cgi/c...31e4e607314ee067f9a455b5&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha

Aceto MD, Scates SM, Lowe JA, Martin BR.Cannabinoid precipitated withdrawal by the selective cannabinoid receptor antagonist, SR 141716A. Department of Pharmacology and Toxicology, Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond 23298-0613, USA
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=retrieve&db=pubmed&list_uids=7498260&dopt=Abstract

Weed DOES NOT TOUCH DOPAMINE, it is a psychedelic. Psychedelics are not fucking addicting.

You, my friend, are giving the stoners a bad name by spouting incorrect information. Let us have a look at which receptors cannabis has an effect on.. And it's not solely a "psychedelic", it has psychedelic effects, it's not a classic 5HT2A agonist, it's in it's own class.. Cannabis has effects on the following receptors; acetylcholine, dopamine, GABA, histamine, serotonin, glutamate, norepinephrine, prostaglandins and opioid peptides.



Case closed.

 

[LightTrailz]

^ Very nice .

 

[Khadijah]

CONCLUSION: A distinctive marijuana withdrawal syndrome has been identified, but it is mild and short-lived. The syndrome includes restlessness, irritability, mild agitation, insomnia, sleep EEG disturbance, nausea, and cramping.

Word.

I think what alot of people aint gettin is not everyone is sayin "it aint addictive." Were just sayin, its addictive, but the addiction really aint that bad. I believe the withdraw symptoms that are listed here being described as "mild" would also add some weight to that point.

Good looks!

 

[dirmaster0]

Basically, two spectrums of addiction when it comes to Cannabis...

Theres people like me that have an addictive personality (runs through families prone to alcoholism/substance abuse)--heh come to think of it I'll never be able to quit smoking thanks to that..

And theres people who have the mental addiction--thinking they need to smoke (yet really dont need to)...Or rather their economic situation (in which cannabis provides for them) relies on..well..canna-exposure? Always being around it...would probably smoke it...etc...

Ugh burnt out X_X

 

[the seeker]

Weed is in your head.

But crack, coke, and meth aren't the same mental dependency at all. Meth depletes your dopamine with excessive use, the wanting to do more has alot to do with wanting that confidence and wanting to replenish dopamine because you're sad without it, addicted to it.

IT IS NOT THE SAME.

I swear, this forum is full of fucktard lazy/pussy stoners, the type that give me and my friends a bad name.

Weed DOES NOT TOUCH DOPAMINE, it is a psychedelic. Psychedelics are not fucking addicting.

I'm sorry but I am sick of this thread, it's not addicting it's all about the person.

LOL @ weed not touching dopamine.

Delta9-THC and heroin exert similar effects on mesolimbic dopamine transmission through a common mu1 opioid receptor mechanism located in the ventral mesencephalic tegmentum.

http://biopsychiatry.com/canher.htm

 

[the seeker]

Dude, youre the one whose like "WAAAH, YOUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT FACT! JUST CUZ IT HAPPEND THAT WAY TO YOU DONT MAKE IT A DEFINITIVE TRUTH"

8)

Then you come in here like "well, whether or not there is any medical or scientific evidence whatsoever for this, this is what happened to me, so believe it, cuz its true, cuz i said so."

Experience dont = facts. Theres alot of things that we, as non medical doctors, and average humans, dont know. Theres alot of reasons why your tongue could be fucked up. and chances are unless you, out of the thousands of other people on this board, have some strange, evil, mysterious tongue illness that only comes out when weed is involved, then there was probably some other reason for this "pot tongue rot" you claim. and theres nothin wrong with the fact that you wouldnt know what really caused it, cuz thats what research an ddoctors are for.

But when people make claims like "well, it happened to me, so it must be real!" they forget the hundreds of thousands of amazing things goin on in the human body, that can be upset by even the tiniest unnoticable thing to cause some "mystery illness" like you described. While you, the victim, knows nothing about the background of other shit goin on that might cause it, the only thing you know is to attribute it to weed, cuz thats the thing that seems to make sense.

That dont mean that you are correct, or that its really what happened. its just your best hypothesis.

yeah, its my best hypothesis.

 

[the seeker]

Tongues don't rot away due to smoking.. You'd be making medical history if it were true.

i never claimed my tongue literally rotted away, i said there was irritation and dead skin on it and all signs pointed to this being caused by cannabis smoking. the condition immediately improved when i stopped smoking and worsened every time i smoked. also, it wouldn't be making history since eminem (and probably other people as well) apparently experienced something similar. just because a rare complication of smoking hasn't been documented in medical literature yet doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Subject closed, I'm not gonna argue about it further.

how many times are you going to say this? do you think that adding "subject closed" after every statement you make somehow makes you right?

 

[Khadijah]

LOL, do you think making increasingly non-fact-or-logic-based posts after others have chosen to stop arguing with you, just to have the last word makes you right?

 

[the seeker]

LOL, do you think making increasingly non-fact-or-logic-based posts after others have chosen to stop arguing with you, just to have the last word makes you right?

LOL do you think claiming my posts are not logic based makes it true?

 

[swilow]

I doubt 7-10% become physically addicted to any serious degree besides a minor headache and a little loss of appetite.

I doubt marijuana withdrawal causes inability to eat. You can still shove food into that hole. As for loss of appetite, that's just a little shock from having marijuana increase your appetite. That's a little different, then say, DTs from alcohol withdrawal. It's not like you normally have them.

Marijuana physical dependency does not exist in any severe form. It is mild at worst. Marijuana addiction is entirely psychological. Benzo addiction is much more severe, in every way. Marijuana is not a particularly harmful drug.

I;m gonna jump in on this argument because I think someones talking a bit of shit here.

Reading your posts you've gone from claiming marijuna is not physically addictvie to above ackowledgeing their existence, mild as you may term them. Incidentally, in another post you said that psychological dependence is harder to abstain from, proving that you agree that weed is addictive.

Plus- what the fuck are you saying tobacco isn't addivtive for? That is absolute crap mate.

As someone thats been through benzo withdrawal and weed, I found weed to be way harder to stop. If you haven't experienced weed withdrawal, why are hyou posting in this thread? Its not about you trying to slam your opinion down peoples throats, an opinion which is untrue.

I don't like people who try to discount other peoples experiences simply because it hasn't happened to them, it smacks of selfishness and arrogance.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

I said marijuana is not physically addictive, but you guys posted some sources saying that it can cause mild physical dependency. I could say that insomnia and restlessness are just from being bored after dropping such a routine part of life, and that is bullshit, but okay, whatever, I'm not here to argue against sources because that would get us nowhere. Fine, sure, I'll concede I'm wrong in this argument and that marijuana can cause slight physical dependency.

However, my points still stand.

What you seem to misunderstand, just like seeker, is that I am saying that marijuana is not an addictive substance (or it is, but very slightly). Methamphetamine and crack cocaine are also not addictive substances. Rather, they are, like sex and video games, addictive activities.

What I mean is you will not get physical dependence to these substances and go into withdrawal from them. You only get withdrawal from substances that you can get a physical depdence to, such as heroin.

I am by no means saying marijuana is not addictive, or that physical dependency is what marks how addictive an activity can be.

Do I need to keep repeating myself here? Do you guys not read what I say at all or something? I never said addiction here.

People get addicted to many things and it all depends on how you handle the situation.

I'm not trying to discount people's experience here, your just smacking of being a brick wall for not getting what I'm saying here.

I'll repeat what I said -

Physical dependency does not develop from marijuana, or methamphetamine, or sex (or it may, but slightly). Therefore, these substances are not addictive substances, but rather addictive activities. Heroin and alcohol, on the other hand, are both addictive substances and addictive activities. Despite physical dependency or not, addiction is entirely psychological and that is the trouble with addiction.

That is all. So I can see marijuana being extremely addictive, and not saying that it is impossible. Sex can be extremely addictive. And heroin can be extremely addictive.

With all the bureacratic stuff out of the way, I must say that in my personal, biased opinion, I just find that an addiction to marijuana seems a little silly. That's just my opinion, it holds no merit or value, and I'm not trying to argue anything with it. That's just my opinion, take it or leave it. You can say it's wrong and I couldn't argue otherwise with you on that.

But I'm not gonna sit here all day and apologize for my opinions.

 

[swilow]

addictionto marijunan seems a little silly- well, yeah, I will tell you your wrong on this count. I hear what your saying, but if you read your posts, you've changed your view so many times as to compltely void any meaning behind them. Explain how tobacco ISN'T addictive, damnit! I want evidence, because that will change the world.

If you make statements with no facts, and actually pass by facts to stick to your argument, then I'm afraid your spreading misinformation, which Bluelight should not tolerate. If some 14 year old reads your posts, and forms what they think is a factual opinion on that, well, they've been deceived. I hear your argument, and far from being a brick wall, I'm trying to make sense of what your saying. Alas, I can't.

Why comment on an issue you think is merely silly anyway, whilst for some people weed has wrecked their lives? Anyone who developed a psychosis from marijuana is unlikely to consider it silly- its dead serious. You obviously are not willing to admit that weed is a strong, potent drug. To believe its not, is to follow the same line of mass reasoning that has ultimately made drugs illegal- ignorance. I smoke pot daily, and I know it to be a powerful, mind-changing plant, so I accord it a large degree of respect- in truth, it is too powerful to take everyday, but thats for a future thread.

Physical dependency DOES form after using marijuana- addiction is NOT just psychological, it is physical.

 

[swilow]

Physical dependency does not develop from marijuana, or methamphetamine, or sex (or it may, but slightly). Therefore, these substances are not addictive substances, but rather addictive activities. Heroin and alcohol, on the other hand, are both addictive substances and addictive activities. Despite physical dependency or not, addiction is entirely psychological and that is the trouble with addiction.

Bullshit, sorry, but that is just wrong.

 

[the seeker]

I said marijuana is not physically addictive, but you guys posted some sources saying that it can cause mild physical dependency. I could say that insomnia and restlessness are just from being bored after dropping such a routine part of life, and that is bullshit, but okay, whatever, I'm not here to argue against sources because that would get us nowhere. Fine, sure, I'll concede I'm wrong in this argument and that marijuana can cause slight physical dependency.

However, my points still stand.

What you seem to misunderstand, just like seeker, is that I am saying that marijuana is not an addictive substance (or it is, but very slightly). Methamphetamine and crack cocaine are also not addictive substances. Rather, they are, like sex and video games, addictive activities.

the problem with your points is not that we dont understand, its that they are either wrong, confusing or misleading. your distinction between an addictive substance and an addictive activity is not recognized. for example:

CONCLUSIONS: This study has provided evidence of a methamphetamine withdrawal syndrome that can be categorized into two phases, the acute phase lasting 7-10 days during which overall symptom severity declined in a linear pattern from a high initial peak, and a subacute phase lasting at least a further 2 weeks.

McGregor C, Srisurapanont M, Jittiwutikarn J, Laobhripatr S, Wongtan T, White JM. The nature, time course and severity of methamphetamine withdrawal.

What I mean is you will not get physical dependence to these substances and go into withdrawal from them. You only get withdrawal from substances that you can get a physical depdence to, such as heroin.

then you're wrong. people do get withdrawal from these substances and numerous studies have been posted which confirm this.

I am by no means saying marijuana is not addictive, or that physical dependency is what marks how addictive an activity can be.

Do I need to keep repeating myself here? Do you guys not read what I say at all or something? I never said addiction here.

People get addicted to many things and it all depends on how you handle the situation.

I'm not trying to discount people's experience here, your just smacking of being a brick wall for not getting what I'm saying here.

I'll repeat what I said -

Physical dependency does not develop from marijuana, or methamphetamine, or sex (or it may, but slightly).

so you just contradicted yourself. first you say it does not develop and then you say it might. do you see how ambiguous and confusing your posts are? how much physical depedence does there need to be in order for a substance to cross your imaginary line between being an addictive activity and an addictive substance? because you failed to address this crucial question, your points are meaningless.