• H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist | cdin | Lil'LinaptkSix

Colon Cleanse / Cleansing your System / Colonic Irrigation

Yay Dj Danny!

Most doctors know diddley squat about really being healthy. All they know is to give you pills. They don't see the dynamic interaction between what you eat, how you live life, and your health.
Doctor-bashing in the "Healthy Living" forum? If you knew anything about medical school curriculum, you would not have made that comment.

I think western medicine is way ahead when it comes to acute things (broken legs, gunshot wounds, heart attack, etc) but when it comes to preventing illness, we are way behind.
More "western medicine" bashing...Most diseases are directly caused by lifestyle choices. Smoking, poor diet, and lack of excercise are the biggest killers. Has your doctor ever told you to start smoking and stop excercising? lol.

Alternative medicine is very slow to gain any type of credibility when there's no significant demand for studies and I doubt you will see colon cleansing attract any sort of in-depth study anytime soon, especially with issues like SARS, Avian flu, and other issues that put alternative and complementary medicine on the back burner
Oh YEA, breast cancer, AIDS, prostate cancer, MS, and Alzheimers are all pushing colon-cleansing to the back burner. Those crazy doctors just don't want people to find out about colon-cleansing. Yah, OK.

Why do you think when you buy herbs you see the "this statement has not been evaluated by the FDA" message?
Maybe, because the stuff doesn't DO ANYTHING?

For example, many people will say the colon doesn't need to be cleaned because the outer epithelial wall of the large intestine completely replaces itself and therefore doesn't need to be cleaned.
That is true, but it doesn't really have anything to do with why colon-cleansing is bullshit.

However, this is not the case for impacted stool which putrefies and subsequently the old epithelium becomes part of that impaction.
Always with the *descriptive* words. The stool is always "putrifying" or "rotting."

Define "putrifying"?
Where exactly is the feces impacting?
What is preventing the body from reabsorbing the old epithelial cells?
What is preventing the body from expelling the feces?
Is this a medically recognized disorder that I don't know about?
How common is this condition?
What role does diet play in the impaction process?
Is there a correlation with shape of the colon?
Correlation with fluid intake?


I don't suspect I'll get an answer to any of these questions from anybody trying to sell me on colon-cleansing. I will, however, hear a lot of talk about rotting feces and how gross it is, and how badly I need to buy their product.
 
My God, does anybody actually believe this crap? What would it take to get people to stop believing moronic "cure-all solutions?" I bet that they would even ignore me, or even a GI. It's just... mind-baffling. I've skimmed the thread and know there are people here who have already helped to repudiate this "colon cleanse" crap but there are still a few people who believe it.

I have IBD - I've had barium enemas, magnesium citrate, GoLytely laxatives, etc etc. For one thing you don't have any more than a couple of pounds of feces in your intestine (lol @ 25 lbs). Boy, colon cleanses sure sound like a magic cureall for IBD right? - so why don't I use it? Because it's a joke. It doesn't work. All it does, if it even is a decent laxative, is build up magnesium to flush out your intestine - taking away all of the necessary nutrients from the food you ate that would have been absorbed by your intestine. Yeah, great idea. Continued use of laxatives and enemas is strongly discouraged by GI's because eventually your body grows accustomed to their use and your muscles won't properly expell feces on their own. Oh and whenever someone mentions "colon cleansing" on IBD forums they are immediately banned. For good reason.
 
I find it slightly amusing that the trendy medical breakthrough in the colon area was for people to eat a lot of fiber in order to maintain health down there. And since the only food that contains fiber is vegetation, it's a roundabout way of saying "anything but animal products" will keep your colon in good shape. But then it was basically proven that fiber doesn't mean much at all, and vegetation is the real colon protector. Duh.

I also find the "detox" diets funny. "All fruits, vegetables, legumes, and fibrous plants, no meat or cheese". No shit. :p
 
^^You'd be surprised how that kind of diet apparently works very well for a lot of people, and not quite with others. I reiterate again that everybody is different , and being a meat eater myself through and through, I've recently come to a greater understanding and appreciation of going "meatless" for a few days a week, but thats for another thread altogether. I suppose personal opinions are okay, but I do not agree with most of the generalizations expressed in recent posts. :\ Lets keep the discussion friendly and open minded guys.
 
But then it was basically proven that fiber doesn't mean much at all, and vegetation is the real colon protector. Duh.
Actually fiber is, by definition, indigestible cellulose, which is what plants are made of. Fiber = vegetation.

The point of eating fiber is that you are basically sweeping out your GI tract with little strings of cellulose that don't get broken down. They "push" everything out like a broom, because they don't get digested.
 
Define "putrifying"?
Where exactly is the feces impacting?
What is preventing the body from reabsorbing the old epithelial cells?
What is preventing the body from expelling the feces?
Is this a medically recognized disorder that I don't know about?
How common is this condition?
What role does diet play in the impaction process?
Is there a correlation with shape of the colon?
Correlation with fluid intake?


I don't suspect I'll get an answer to any of these questions from anybody trying to sell me on colon-cleansing. I will, however, hear a lot of talk about rotting feces and how gross it is, and how badly I need to buy their product.

Asking a bunch of trite medical questions in an attempt to argue Socratically isn't working for you. You can read all about fecal impaction here:
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000230.htm

..and I'm not trying to sell you anything. In fact I mentioned that there are more important ways to keep a clean colon.

As for western medicine? The US is only one of two nations left on the planet that have a privatized health care system. You know what they means? Money provides the drive behind the trends. Health care in the US is set up to treat disease. Why? There is more money to be made in treatment than cure. I've taken 2 delivery of health care systems classes and 1 HMO financial structure class and whether you like it or not, that's the true state of our health care system here. There's a fine balance between profit and quality of care in privatization and when push comes to shove, the money will always win.

Oh YEA, breast cancer, AIDS, prostate cancer, MS, and Alzheimers are all pushing colon-cleansing to the back burner. Those crazy doctors just don't want people to find out about colon-cleansing. Yah, OK.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=priority

Doctor-bashing in the "Healthy Living" forum? If you knew anything about medical school curriculum, you would not have made that comment.

I went to med school with 2 of my close friends and they're doctors now. BOTH are now pawns of the drug companies and in an indirect way, they both admit to it. They get bonuses, all-expense paid vacations, and other kickbacks and rewards for using a particular drug. You're going to tell me there is no bias in that? I didn't want to fall into that situation so I switched to health education and prevention. Just because you're a doctor doesn't mean you're the ultimate source of nutritional education. Unless you have a very light patient load, you barely have time for routine con ed and board recertifications, let alone attend every nutrition and preventative medicine seminar.
 
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I've taken 2 delivery of health care systems classes and 1 HMO financial structure class and whether you like it or not, that's the true state of our health care system here.
I disagree that "western" healthcare is too focused on treatment of disease. Treatment of disease is the basis of all healthcare, whether "western" or not.

There's a fine balance between profit and quality of care in privatization and when push comes to shove, the money will always win.
There is a lot of quality care in the United States, even for those unable to pay for it. The U.S may have an inefficient healthcare system, but a lot of medical procedures and technologies originate in the U.S. You can't just come out and accuse the U.S healthcare system of being bad just because it is a free-market system.

I see you have linked me to a dictionary definition of priority. I know the definition of priority, thank you very much. You seemed to be implying that colon-cleansing was somehow being shunned because the profit-minded western capitalists didn't want prevention to be practiced. Well you are wrong (and biased).

I went to med school with 2 of my close friends and they're doctors now. BOTH are now pawns of the drug companies and in an indirect way, they both admit to it.
We all have choices to make. It looks like they chose to be pawns of drug companies. Nobody pointed a gun to their heads.

I was just pointing out that bashing western medicine has become trendy lately...and most people just go on about how western medicine is a capitalist conspiracy. Instead of actually doing something about it, like maybe completing medical school and starting up an alternative integrative care clinic...they just rant.
 
IMHO, ..the "basis" of healthcare should start with prevention.

Western medicine thrives off the treatments...
an awful lot more than the prevention side of healthcare.
Just my two cents on "how the West was won" with politics.
 
You can't mix health care and free-market. There's a reason why only 2 nations left in the world have a privatized health care system - US and South Africa. Two nations that are riddled with segregation, and capitalism in the health care market just intensifies the problems. It comes down to human rights and how we must take care of one another. We're not ants. We don't just keep going and continue to work over those who are injured and in need of care. Decisions must be ethical and must not be influenced by the prospect of a Hawaii vacation offered up by Pfizer.

I'm only making an honest observation on western medicine, I could care less about trends and bandwagons. Trends are just politically correct "mob mentality" if you ask me. And I am doing something about it. I've turned to preventative medicine and education.
 
I'm only making an honest observation on western medicine, I could care less about trends and bandwagons. Trends are just politically correct "mob mentality" if you ask me. And I am doing something about it. I've turned to preventative medicine and education.

I agree with most everything you've said too djdannyuhoh and EsourceR.... this topic (on Western medicine, et al) comes up a lot when I am with my doctor friends who've had good educations in prestigious medical schools here and abroad (I'm in Asia) but who also choose to complement it with alternative/preventative methods. It's not one or the other, its combining the best of both worlds for the good of all.
 
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Have read this thread with great interest, seeing as i want to submit myself to a course of colonics (after getting over the tube-in-ass self-respect problem).

The skeptics have, I think, raised valid points about scientific rigour etc etc peer-reviewed research etc. That however needs to be balanced against the equally valid points of big pharma being more interested in long-term treatments rather than once-off cures (or a holistic approach to health).

In the end, it all comes down to this article:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,3605,663391,00.html

ITS ALL ABOUT THE MARBLE PEOPLE!!
 
Instead of getting a bum flush, wouldn't it be easier and cheaper to go on a simple high-fibre diet for a week - like water, milk, fruit and veg ?
 
everyone loves to be right on these issues, it makes me skeptical about doing anything, and on the other hand it makes me afraid of doing nothing
 
"Now then, I have a personal opinion on the colon cleanse matter. Sure, I bet people who have the procedure done say they feel great. John Wayne died with what, 40 lbs of crap in his intestines?"

Errr, this kind of invalidates a lot of what you say. This is an urban legend. Linky with sources: http://www.snopes.com/horrors/gruesome/fecalcolon.asp

Colon cleanses are bullshit, they don't work, and any real doctor will laugh in your face if you mention the myth that they "rid you of your toxins"

The Doctor I asked (with over 10 years of experience) told me the colon is nothing more than skin and irrigating it does NOTHING for your overall health.

I will concede that colon cleanses have the same exact benefits of a simple, cheap enema you can give yourself.
 
I will concede that colon cleanses have the same exact benefits of a simple, cheap enema you can give yourself.
Just a word of caution - it can be dangerous to put any kinds of fluids into your colon. Don't do it.
 
DJDannyUhOh said:
You can't mix health care and free-market. There's a reason why only 2 nations left in the world have a privatized health care system - US and South Africa. Two nations that are riddled with segregation, and capitalism in the health care market just intensifies the problems. It comes down to human rights and how we must take care of one another. We're not ants. We don't just keep going and continue to work over those who are injured and in need of care. Decisions must be ethical and must not be influenced by the prospect of a Hawaii vacation offered up by Pfizer.

I'm only making an honest observation on western medicine, I could care less about trends and bandwagons. Trends are just politically correct "mob mentality" if you ask me. And I am doing something about it. I've turned to preventative medicine and education.

True.

I disagree that all medicine is aimed towards treatment of disease.

If it indeed has become "trendy" to bash Western medicine, that is a good development. The system's as fucked as can be.

DJDanny is right-- it is tainted by free market economics, aside from being materialist in focus, and having an aversion towards integration with other areas of human operation (i.e., taking "specialization" to the max). It's right up there with "Things That Are Dangerous To Commodify".
 
Colon cleanses are bullshit, they don't work, and any real doctor will laugh in your face if you mention the myth that they "rid you of your toxins"

The Doctor I asked (with over 10 years of experience) told me the colon is nothing more than skin and irrigating it does NOTHING for your overall health.

I will concede that colon cleanses have the same exact benefits of a simple, cheap enema you can give yourself.

It's understandable most of you think this way.
The very sound of the word "colon" promps embarassment these days. Suggest that someone run 5 gallons of warm water through it and embarassment turns to suspicion or sheer panic. American doctors are reluctant even to discuss the matter, and they flatly refuse to administer colonic irrigations to patients on request. They believe, as one New York physician put it, that colonics "went out with the horse-and-buggy" a century ago. American doctors also reject nutritional therapy, herbal remedies, fasting, therapeutic breathing, meditation and other "outdated" methods that they no longer understand. In the Soviet Union, however, it remains standard procedure in all hospitals and clinics to administer a thorough colonic cleansing to all patients, regardless of their ailments immediately upon entering any hospital. Soviet physicians realize that no cure for any ailment can be properly assimilated to a filthy, highly toxic body, which simply cannot assimilate and utilize medications. Nor does a body devitalized by chronic toxemia have sufficient strength and dnergy to fully recover from such radical procedures as anaesthesia, surgery and chemical therapy.

As a case in point for colonics , take pneumonia. At the turn of the century before cancer and heart disease replaced it, pneumnia was the biggest killer in America. Back then Dr. J.H.Tilden of Denver, Colorado who specialized in pneumonia and treated more patients for this disease than any other physician on record, never lost a single patient to this dreaded ailment. He achieved remarkable record by relying entirely on fasting and colonic irrigations, followed by strict diets of raw natural foods. Today, pneumonia still takes a heavy toll among the elderly and weak, despite all the modern drugs used to treat it.

Even the United States Health Service, in a rare display of candor, admitted several years ago that over 90% of Americans are walking around with clogged colons. What goes in must come out....eventually. In the meantime it can fester for years , cripple or even kill you.

Toxemia is the real culprit in almost all degenerative diseases and degenerative conditions. It explains, for example, why under precisely the same conditions of exposure some people catch colds and other contagious diseases while others remain completely immune. IT is not the germs that are fault, as Louis Pasteur clamed, for germs of all sorts float constantly on the air and entire our food and water at all times. It is the lack of normal resistance due to auto intoxication of the bloodstream that opens a window of vulnerability in body and permits germs to invade.

Anyone who consistently breaks the laws of nature will ultimately be sentenced to chronic disease and early death by mother nature. No type or quantity of drugs, surgery or other remedial medical care can save y ou from the well imposed death sentence of auto intoxication.

However it is an illusion to believe that you clear out these fetid obstructions and purge the imbedded toxins from your colon simply by eating bran, raw vegetables, and other fibrous foods. Bran and raw vegetables are so rich in fibrous bulk that they cannot get through the tiny holes remaining for passage of feces in most colons. Instead they back up, fester, and contribute further to the problem. It is pointless to embark on a major new dietary program until you have first flushed all the accumulated, impacted debris and poisonous residues from your former dietary habits out of your digestive tract. There is only one way to do this and that is by fasting and by initially flushing out your colon with colonic irrigations. When you put new oil into your car engine, you don't just pour it on top of the old filthy oil but first drain the old stuff out. The least you could do is give your own body the same respect and care you give to your car.

From the Tao of Healthy , Sex and Longevity by Daniel Reid.

Nobody is forcing you to undergo this procedure (lol) based on some of the more passionate angry responses in this thread. It's already expected that a lot of people (particularly in the States) are going to brand this as a ton of bullshit(no pun intended), a waste of time, utter nonsense, etc etc etc. That is your opinion and it is valid but one of the good things about discussing such matters in this forum is that open mindedness and tactfulness still prevail .

I speak from experience regarding this matter as well....I have been a heavy HEAVY meat eater for the last 20 years of my life and many factors (diet, drugs, bad lifestyle, vices etc) contributed to the decline of my health and well being . After going sober last year, quitting cigarettes and slowly eliminating meat from my diet (not too much! i eat much less now)....I still did not feel healthy despite a good diet full of vegetables and fiber and regular exercise. My weight was at a plateau, and I just felt sluggish and dirty.

I had my first of a number of colonic irrigations last April from Chi-Med (thanks Dtergent! ;)) and the difference in myself is astounding. I have since lost 15 pounds, my gut is gone, I am even more determined to eat healthy (and I already was), and my body is just functioning at its peak. (of course I also exercise daily!) If I hadn't had it done I would probably have quit exercising and just gone back to my old ways due to sheer fatigue and helplessness.

That is my little story and I definitely DEFINITELY am not forcing this down people's throats , no way. Everybody is entitled to do what is best for their own bodies. I'd just like people who are quick to judge or call bullshit (lol! no pun intended) to have a more open mind and see how it has helped people such as myself (and many others I know of). If you are mainly healthy, fit and robust person do you need to have it done at all? Possibly not , as like I said, everybody has different needs. I needed it at this point in my life as I was making a huge change in lifestyle and needed some help. I don't think that is "a waste of time" or a bunch of "utter nonsense" if you ask me.

It is also a good chance to show that in the other side of the world (Asia, Europe) people still believe that: Purging the bowels eliminates the source of poison, thereby permitting blood and energy to regenerate naturally. By cleansing the bowels we repair the body.

Is it not a surprise that most of us are very healthy and less prone to disease?
 
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I'm a meat eater and always will be.But i'm seriously considering having this done just because I do believe that it works.Here's my concerns though. What is the experience like?Does it hurt? What is the level of humiliation?(cause there has to be some)How many treatments does it take to "irrigate" your colon?
 
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