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cognitive difficulties permanent?

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jayjay77

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Apr 19, 2010
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After 6 months of abstinence, I have really begun to notice some slight cognitive difficulties quite probably resulting from my experimental ecstasy use. Issues after use (9 pills over 1 year--2 of those pills taken in one week period, rest spaced out) have been mainly with verbalization. I have more difficulty expressing complex thoughts clearly in words, sometime stumbling through sentences or stuttering. My critical thinking abilities haven't diminished, rather my ability (capacity?) to express those thoughts clearly and efficiently. I'm wondering whether anyone else has had similar problems with equivalent usage patterns?

I've searched the web a bit and read some articles and it seems my particular issue is somewhat common. I also have a slight reduction in verbal memory (and learning?--hard to gauge). Am I dealing with a permanent impairment or has anyone else had luck remediating this condition with a sustained therapy regimen, e.g., physical exercise, mental stimulation, diet, nootropics?...
 
Also, I wonder if in my case I especially notice the apparent cognitive side effects since I put my brain through tremendous strain while at school (university graduate student). I've read that the brain insult is primarily a 'diffuse axonal injury', meaning that the axons connecting brain neurons are disrupted/dennervated. Even after a comprehensive healing process, the brain works less efficiently with these new axonal connections as they are not as strong/functional as the previous, uninjured ones. Is there anyway to attenuate the damage? Fully functionally recover? Personal experiences...
 
jayjay77 said:
I've searched the web a bit and read some articles and it seems my particular issue is somewhat common.
Click to expand...

Really?

I find it a bit hard to believe that you have even made a correlation between your perceived brain problems and the fact you last used mdma 6 months ago.

Dont you think you might have noticed it at least 6 months ago?


I have noticed over the years that a lot of people who make these claims have anxiety problems and they talk themselves into believing they have a problem thats not really there at all.


I suggest that if you really believe you have a problem, that you see a doctor asap.

Irrelevant of whether its caused by your total of 9 pills and the last one used 6 months ago or if its something else thats causing it, including an overactive brain..............getting it checked out is the first step to getting it fixed.
 
Yeah man,

I took me about a year of eating MDMA every weekend before I noticed anything was going south. I don't think 9 pills is going to do it. Not saying that it isn't possible...just very unlikely.
 
Noticed some difficulties 6 months ago, but was still using pot then--thus they were masked to a certain extent. It was only when I was wholly-abstinent that I noticed a marked reduction in by verbalization abilities. As for anxiety, not so much a factor in my life. In addition, I was checked out by a neuropsychologist a few months back (given the full IQ test, subsequent memory testing). She reported that "although I fall within the normal range on all cognitive testing measures, she could not completely rule out the effect of prior substance use on cognitive functioning." And so that brings me to phenomenological comparisons--myself now v. myself 3 years ago. There seems to be a difference, just wondering if anyone has had similar experiences/attenuated those experiences with some particularly effective regimen.
 
I really don't think the MDMA caused. I can really see this being a placebo effect. About a month ago for no apparent reason I started to be under the impression that my thinking was REALLY cloudy. Like what you said, I couldn't form sentences from my thoughts and didn't want to. Sometimes I would be trying to explain something and I would just give up half sentence because I couldn't find the vocabulary. I REALLY don't think it's because of MDMA. I think it's common for anybody. I've never done ecstasy (yeah yeah big surprise). So I can totally see how if I DID do it, and someone was like "yo ecstasy makes it harder to concentrate/whateverwhatever" I would undoubtly blame it on that.... I think it's placebo.
 
It can only take one pill in some people to cause some serious damage. I have experienced most of what your talking about and it does go away somewhat, but ive been clean three years and noticed a 25% improvement.

Dont listen to all these idiots who tell you MDMA is safe and that its all in your head, it isnt.

Some people suffer no ill effects from MDMA even after long term abuse so its easy for them to claim its safe. Its really a genetic thing IMO, but your not crazy thinking it impaired you some.

We could debate the safety of MDMA all day long, but its really pointless. What you did cant be taken back so just adjust.
 
ive probably taken about 200 pills since 2008 (you do the math) and i have taken a small couple months off and didnt notice any of those issues. I will say tho that i do notice that effect the day after i thizz and maybe the day after. But i noticed that after about 2 and a half maybe 3 weeks later i feel like i never even popped. Im not saying that bad side effects are reversible im just saying that i havent noticed any with my use. But then again they say that once these side effects kick in and are un reverseable, that the person it is happening to cant even tell that it has happend.. this is a good thread , can someone drop some feed back to my last sentence , would love to see what people beleive as far as that..
 
that last sentence is more or less accurate. The user cant gauge what he has lost mentally and usually blames it on something else not the ecstasy. The effects are largely permanent (speaking from experience).
 
bben---was your 25% improvement assisted by any therapy regimens or exclusively time? I'd be willing to put in the work if I could guarantee a greater result (I mean in terms of cognitive exercises specifically targeting problem areas, i.e., verbal memory, verbal fluency).
 
bben said:
It can only take one pill in some people to cause some serious damage.
Click to expand...

Ben do have a source to support your argument? Or is it just dribble?

I dont see anyone in this thread claiming that mdma is safe. Not a single one.

Its important for people to look at all the possibilities instead of jumping to crazy conclusions.

All to often people come in here claiming this and claiming that about what mdma has done to them. Thats all well and good but as appears fairly obvious to me in this case, a person has provided a trigger I was checked out by a neuropsychologist a few months back (given the full IQ test, subsequent memory testing). She reported that "although I fall within the normal range on all cognitive testing measures, she could not completely rule out the effect of prior substance use on cognitive functioning." and that trigger has led to spending umpteen hours reading about what they believe has caused a problem (a problem mind you that the specialist says is not even there) and in doing so only confirmed even further for themselves that this is there problem.

I have a headache.
"Maz, did you know you can get a headache from having to much sex?"
Wow really?
Maz searches high and low on internet and finds some people support this theory.
Shit it must be true.
Maz starts thread in SLR asking for others anecdotes and find some agree further promoting the concept that its accurate and Im on the right track.
Maz in his silliness and desperation to have a reason for his headaches completely overlooks the fact he hasnt had sex for 2 years.
He also fails to realise that there are a bazillion other possible causes.


Do you see my point Ben?

Nobody is saying its not possible................just that its extremely unlikely and to only follow that line of thinking would be a huge mistake.
Apart from that the entire problem may be imagined.


In many ways, for hypocondriacs and those with anxietal problems the internet has been a terrible thing.
 
Getting older will do this too. So will not getting enough sleep, or too much, or many other normal things.

Recently, I started noticing that I was forgetting things a lot. I thought to myself, "Have I always been this forgetful? I can't remember. I'm forgetting if I always forgot stuff!" Then, for about a day, I blamed it on my ecstasy use. Then I mentioned this to a friend who reminded me that I've always been this forgetful and that, as I get older, I will probably get more and more forgetful. It's just how it goes.
 
To be fair, the psychological effect on cognitive functioning cannot be understated. Whether this is representative of my particular case remains unclear. I will agree that the possibility of permanent brain injury resulting in functional compromise is daunting, to say the least. However, the apparent trigger, I was checked out by a neuropsychologist a few months back (given the full IQ test, subsequent memory testing). She reported that "although I fall within the normal range on all cognitive testing measures, she could not completely rule out the effect of prior substance use on cognitive functioning.", does not obviously signify an absence of mdma-related impairment. It could very well be the case that an internal anxiety exacerbates the slight impairment, making such a dysfunction all the more noticeable. It could also be case that the extent of a possible injury is limited to high-functioning circumstances, such as the analysis and internalization of dense philosophical works.

As many members on bluelight may recognize the amount of pills consumed as an unlikely culprit for the full force of my impairment, the question remains of whether any members have exhaustively utilized their brain's cognitive/emotional resources and found evidence for/against a change in functioning. It is important to note that although the neuropsychologist did report normal functioning on all measures of cognitive functioning, verbal memory (specifically category but not letter fluency--a test of semantic but not phonemic fluency) was significantly lower than verbal reasoning abilities (but still within normal range). This is consistent with studies showing a compromise of semantic encoding and fluency functioning, but not phonemic fluency or verbal reasoning, in abstinent users (V Raj, 2010).

Given this, I'm curious whether any other abstinent ecstasy users have experienced impaired functioning perhaps isolated to more extreme measures of cognitive/emotional utilization and efficiency, and if so, a potential remediation of this dysfunction including but not limited to exercise regimens, relaxation techniques, cognitive exercises specific to perceived impairment, medical therapies like neurofeedback or acupuncture, nootropics...
 
I HAVE SAID THIS SO MANY TIMES., 9 times is not going to cause any cognitive issues .

now for others who have a 200 + pill count its a different story

only those who have abused get to see the side effects
 
How do you know 9 pills wont cause any cognitive issues, it actually could but only slightly. I think the point people in this thread are trying to get across is your use is pretty minimal and 9 pills in a year is probably not going to cause any cognitive issues. But i wouldn't doubt that nothing at all happened to your cognitive function, probably so minimal it wouldn't even be noticeable of course if were talking about your cognitive function within a weeks time of your last roll thats another story.
 
have you used any other drugs besides the 9 beans? are you on any scripts?

like most everyone else said i'd have to agree that 9 pills is hardly enough to cause any serious damage. do you know if they were good beans or what they were cut with? might have gotten some horrible pills- unlikely but they do exist.

other than the obvious- staying clean, eating healthy and exercising there isn't much you can do about it. im sure reading, writing, and other mental exercises will help improve your cognitive ability, but even if the damage isnt completely imagined, your going to have to live with it. constant worry and thought about the damage wont do much good.
 
Well to the original poster, I know what you're going through. I'm stumbling through sentences and sometimes have to take a pause, apologize or laugh it off (depending on if it's my friend or someone more important that I'm speaking with) and then continue my sentences. This can be embarassing, especially if you work in a professional or office setting.

I also have more trouble with working memory and remember what someone has just said to me. No, I don't have a learning disability, this has just started since I've started rolling...

...Unfortunately, I like rolling too much so I will simply space out my sessions more and have committed to doing it less frequently.
 
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