Cocaine, alchool, heart toxicity - is BP and HR what does it? Doubt it

[soulwentmia]

So I've been just reading the cocaethylene thread in another forum and I quote "cocaethylene seems much more potent and much more cardiotoxic due to larger increases in HR and BP". Not an exact quote but the gist of it. From that phrase I understand that if I control HR and BP and ensure them to be in healthy limits with heart meds, does this mean toxicity falls greatly? I seriously doubt it as I remember reading the toxicity comes from how the substance acts at potassium channels. High BP and HR are just contributing factors. Can someone more educated chime in? How much safer is cocaine or even cocaethylene if I manage to maintain HR and BP in normal ish ranges?

 

[CFC]

You're right, both cocaine and cocaethylene act in a variety of ways that can be harmful to cardiomyocytes (heart muscle cells) and the nodes that maintain a healthy contractile rhythm, and not just from downstream effects like increased BP and HR, with the latter chemical generally considered more harmful. Unfortunately I can't give you a "how much safer" estimate though. And cocaine is harmful, particularly if you have an underlying vulnerability (often one you were unaware of) to changes in electrical conduction, since it can trigger life-threatening arrhythmias (eg SADS). Also, bear in mind that most of the drugs that'll keep your BP and HR in healthy ranges will likely block (some) of the effects you desire from the cocaine, since they're all targeting similar systems.

 

[SpiralusSancti]

You’re right it’s far more complex than simply BP and HR. Amphetamines can influence BP and HR just as much and are still, usually, far less cardiotoxic.

Fun fact about cocaethylene is that if you would get pure cocaethylene and ingest it, it would be far less cardiotoxic than cocaethylene + cocaine (and that’s what you get when drinking on coke).

 

[soulwentmia]

You're right, both cocaine and cocaethylene act in a variety of ways that can be harmful to cardiomyocytes (heart muscle cells) and the nodes that maintain a healthy contractile rhythm, and not just from downstream effects like increased BP and HR, with the latter chemical generally considered more harmful. Unfortunately I can't give you a "how much safer" estimate though. And cocaine is harmful, particularly if you have an underlying vulnerability (often one you were unaware of) to changes in electrical conduction, since it can trigger life-threatening arrhythmias (eg SADS). Also, bear in mind that most of the drugs that'll keep your BP and HR in healthy ranges will likely block (some) of the effects you desire from the cocaine, since they're all targeting similar systems.

I remember from my early twenties when i used to snort inhumane amounts of coke (like 3g alone in less than 12h) and then proceed to pace around, masturbate vigurously and binge read drug related materials that cocaine has this "special" property of actively trying to kill the muscles of the heart, possibly due to it's local anesthetic action if i'm not mistaken. So probably reducing aggravating factors like skyrocketed bp and hr would make it SLIGHTLY healthier

BUT


What about amphetamines? Or phenmetrazine analogues?