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Opioids Cheating Bupe withdrawal

M

MaddTime

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
51
Let me begin by saying: I began taking suboxone for treatment of PT addiction but the main reason I began the Bupe maintenance program is because I read that Suboxone withdrawals would be minimal compared to full-agonists opioids. It was only later that I read that this is only the case when bupe is used for rapid detox, not when used as maintenance. Then a crazy idea popped into my mind: what if, in order to be able to do a rapid detox, you switch back to your opiate of choice for about three weeks (long enough for the buprenorphine to get out of your system, and then begin the suboxone week-long detox the W/D's of which should be very tolerable (according to some reports). For people with experience with bupe, what do you think of this plan? Would it work? Is there any way to improve it?

also: quick questions about buprenorphine withdrawal:
1. Would antidepressants help when in opiate withdrawal to relieve some of the depression, lethargy, and anxiety?
2. Is it better to have a job and be working when in bupe withdrawal, or would it be better to just stay at home and have nothing to do?
 
Woah I'm having deja vu - I swear I saw this thread at an earlier date... Okay anyway... I can't see why doing a quick detox with bupe is any better than a quick detox with any other opiate. The only benefit that I can think of is that it is long acting which makes tapering a little more reliable and the fact that it has antidepressant effects, but they won't help much after you finish the week long detox.

I'm a PT addict myself and I think that a week long taper with poppy tea wouldn't be any more difficult than a week long taper with bupe. That's just my opinion though. I just don't see why a week long detox using bupe would be any easier than using any other long acting opiate.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
This could fit pretty well into the thread called "buprenorphine withdrawals?".
Click to expand...

Lol, yeah, I PM'd you about this but apparently you didn't receive it. The version that was merged got very few replies and very few exposure. If you feel the need to merge this, would you kindly give it a little more time so I can get some advice before it is merged into obscurity? Pleease :!
 
QuasiStoned said:
I'm a PT addict myself and I think that a week long taper with poppy tea wouldn't be any more difficult than a week long taper with bupe. That's just my opinion though. I just don't see why a week long detox using bupe would be any easier than using any other long acting opiate.
Click to expand...

Well supposedly after you finish the quick taper, the WD aren't nearly as bad, plus i find it easier to taper with an exact measurement rather than pods which, as you know, vary in potency and alkaloid composition. Just out of curiosity, have you had any problems with acquiring them? One of the reasons I quit was because I feared that there was going to be a web-wide crackdown on them, and that I would no longer be able to get them
 
an answer to your 1st question.. a trycyclic antidepressant may help amitriptyline (sp?)would help you sleep and help calm you down therefore reducing anxiety,
Question 2.. i prefer to stay busy during w/d's to keep my mind off of it instead of sitting at home thinking about being sick.. BUT its personal preference.
hope i helped a little.. good luck :)
 
MaddTime said:
Well supposedly after you finish the quick taper, the WD aren't nearly as bad, plus i find it easier to taper with an exact measurement rather than pods which, as you know, vary in potency and alkaloid composition. Just out of curiosity, have you had any problems with acquiring them? One of the reasons I quit was because I feared that there was going to be a web-wide crackdown on them, and that I would no longer be able to get them
Click to expand...

Yeah I could see exact dosages being preferable for tapering purposes but really tapering with pods is easy as hell. The hard part is sticking to it. When I taper, I just endure the withdrawals as long as I can. Then I'll make up say a 5 pod brew of tea (10 - 12 being my "get high" dose) and drink a few sips and see how I feel 30 minutes later. It doesn't take much to mantain and you can get by on 2 very tiny doses per day (or alternatively you could probably get by on one slightly larger dose per day). While tapering it seems that a dose of PPT will hold me comfortable for about 8 - 12 hours, and then the rest of the day is spent in minor withdrawals. There may not be any concrete dosages but you can definitely "feel it out," finding your necessary dosage and titrating from there.

As far as the web wide crackdown, I was actually detoxing from pods when it looked like that was going to happen (I had lost my job and needed to pass a drug test so I saw no other choice but to quit). Sure enough after I got a new job they were still there waiting for me :p There still just as widely available as ever. If they did crack down on pods, it would be a good thing for me. It would force me into sobriety, I have no other connects for opiates and would be resigned to leading a (better) life without them.
 
I am about to jump down to 2mg from 4 in a couple days.....I have also been contemplating withdrawing from another opiate, such as hydrocodone when I am ready to get off..... hear hat while it may be a little more intense than bupe withdrawal, it will be much shorter and the withdrawal won't even be that entirely bad cause I'm talking about withdrawing from like only 10mg of hydro, or whatever amount is the bare minimum I need to stabilize myself after transitioning from bupe, which would obviously be a walk in the park compared to withdrawing off doses when you were actively using.
 
doing that now

I'm actually doing that now. I was on subutex for 2 years.. Tried to quit... Withdrawals were fucking horrible. So I purposely got addicted to heroin again (imagine that... Purposely get addicted) and now I'm back on subutex for this week. I only dose when I. Withdrawing. And I noticed its much more bearable. I'm on day 3 of subutex. I will post with the results.

Oh.. And of you have been on bupe... Don't expect vicodon to even touch you. Bupe is an extremely potent opiod. Cross tolerance comes into play.
 
It does not work. I have tried this once already. I was on suboxone for about 6 months at 8mg a day. I knew i had to get off of it so i stopped taking it at 8mg and just substituted it with dope for about a month. Well when i finally kicked all the shit the withdrawal was worse, with the intensity of the dope withdrawal, and the length if suboxone. Needles to say it sufk
 
How I got off:
Dope for 8 months -->sub for 8 months w/ last weeks 2-4mg, -->tramadol 200mg per day for 10 days --> valium/ambien/other benzos for the minimal RLS and insomnia

This was a cake walk compared to any other w/d I've had. I tried stopping dope...yeah right, got to like day 2 and decided copping is better than suicide. The bupe w/d was also too shitty to handle. Long with horrible, horrible RLS. But for some reason after the 10 days on tramadol it was not bad at all. I had slight w/d during the time I was on tramadol itself but I was pretty well held by the tramadol after the bupe. Tramadol doesn't work after dope thou. FOr some reason tramadol held me well after I was on bupe, but when I tried it during dope w/d it did nothing.
 
On paper, it seems as if it would be best to be ''hooked'' on a very short acting opioid (IE Dilaudid). Upon discontinuation of the Dilaudid (just used in this example) a short term (less than 7 days) Suboxone taper would probably be of great use to you. The accute withdrawal phase of the short acting opioid will be over within the seven days on Suboxone, and from there, you need only come off of a partial agonist.

Now one must be careful not to stay on the Suboxone too long or, from what I hear, one is stuck with week+ long withdrawals that can rival in intesity to those of heroin and other common recreational opioids.

The key, really, is ''to keep moving.'' Never let your body get completely accustomed to one dose of Suboxone, during the seven days, constantly keep decreasing your dose. On day six and seven you should be taking well less than 1mg/daily of the buprenorphine.

Hope this was of some use,
Cy
 
This is tricky. But im an expert at least id like to think so when it comes to w/d. check it out. let yourself get a little sick go back to your original drug. if you think you can handle it.. DO NOT GO BACK TO SQUARE ONE FIGHTING AN ADDICTION. That is if you are fighting an addiction. If not then do what you do. after you feel the bupe is out of your system. start rapid detox at low level of bupe and decrease and progress comfortably.. This is if you insist doing it this way....

I WOULD TAPER DOWN OFF THE BUPE TO SUCH A LOW LEVEL THAT W/D WOULD BE ABSOLUTELY MINIMAL AND THAT CAN BE ACHIEVED W/O GOING THROUGH THAT WHOLE PROCESS. LOL BUT ITS UP TO YOU YOU HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE SO DO AS YOU PLEASE
 
I tapered down to 0.25 mg of Suboxone after being on it for over 3 years. The withdrawal is relatively mild so far but you still feel quite shitty. I'd much rather be getting off higher doses of Vicodin or another fairly weak opiate, yes it would be worse symptomatically but you know it's going to be over in about a week...I'd rather feel bad for a week than be feel bad for a month. Plus you can use benzos for 1 week without getting an addiction, but not 4.

On the other hand, taking any full agonist for that month after Suboxone would be hard to do without escalating the dose.
 
Fuck .25mg was still a bitch huh? I tried to pop off at 1.25mg back in the day after about a 18 day taper from 16mg down (way too high to start) and it was unbearable. EDIT: After a 1+ year bupe habit at 16mg/day followed by a 3 week or so binge on hardcore narcs with no ceiling to dosage then onto the taper.
 
doctors fuck their patients giving them way too much bupe. some just want your money every month/week most dont giv a fuck whether u get off bupe. when its ur time
 
DopaMan said:
Fuck .25mg was still a bitch huh?
Click to expand...

I feel better the last 2 days actually, it might not be that bad. Physically its very mild, except for AWFUL restless legs syndrome which exacerbates the insomnia. I really need stronger sleeping pills. I'm fairly devoid of energy, motivation, achy, cold...BUT its a hell of a lot better than kicking off 1 mg of Suboxone. Anyone wanting to kick Suboxone properly, I can't recommend tapering down very low enough...
 
alright i am new to this site, but would love some input, here's my story.....
I have been on suboxone for 2 years at 8mg, for the last month i was down to 2mg a day, then my last week on subs i was at 1mg a day, im not gonna lie I pretty much have been snorting them the whole time too, so i dont know if that means it'll be out of my system quicker, but i would think so. so last friday i toke my last dose, went about 30 hours with nothing and caved and did a oc 30, then the next day another oc30, and so on, it's Wednesday now and since friday i did one oc 30 everyday, i figured if anything it will help because it will be like skipping over the worst parts, and i really havent done enough of the oc's to detox from those, catch my drift....what do you think???
 
^You still very easily could have the entire withdrawal ahead of you. The benefit that may have happened is that you have replaced bupe addiction with oxy addiction, which for the purposes of coming clean, is not bad. Oxy is much weaker and shorter-acting than bupe and so it is certainly more ideal than bupe. I'd say you will probably still have to taper and go through a few days of pain, but you can avoid the weeks of drawn out bupe withdrawal possibly by continuing this switch to oxycodone...
 
thank you so much for the quick reply!! and in your opinion, how much longer do u think i should do a oc 30? i was gonna do one today n one tomorrow then be done, to get through the harder parts of bup w/d's n trust me i know i'll still have some bad parts just not as bad, n plus i did snort the bup the whole time which could be an advantage cuz it'll get outta my system quicker you know? n when will i start getting sick from oc's i mean im really not doing that much a oc 30 a day is not much, and i will for sure not do it past tomorrow.
 
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