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Opioids Can i plug this DHC?

R

Razu_

Greenlighter
Joined
Sep 6, 2018
Messages
20
Hey there i got some DHC pills 60 MG ( extended release ):
  • 1 tablet contains 60 mg of dihydrocodeinhydrogen tartrate. -The other ingredients are: tablet core: hypromellose, microcrystalline cellulose, fumed silica, magnesium stearate tablet film: Macrogol 6000, hypromellose, titanium dioxide (E 171), talc, Eudragit NE, food color "green lacquer" (quinoline yellow (E 104), indigotine (E. 132), aluminum hydroxide, water), food colorant "indigotine lake" (indigotine (E 132), aluminum hydroxide, water
  • Can i plug this safely? will it even work to plug Extendend releases since asses dont have stomeache acid to dissolve the slow release DHC-part of it? will i waste some of it?
Already crushed some up and they are fine white powder ( no wax when crushing ), however after mixing with Water some parts of the powder swims on top like Oil/gum? mixture, atleast some of it seems slimy
 
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You can, but there's no discernable benefit to not just taking it orally.

The slimy stuff is the plastic from the smashed up extended release membrane.
 
sekio said:
You can, but there's no discernable benefit to not just taking it orally.

The slimy stuff is the plastic from the smashed up extended release membrane.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply, i thought plugging increases the Bio Availability since Orally it is only 30% compared to Plugged 60%?~ atleast people say so. It wont make that much of a difference? (When i plugged the first time ive tested 30 mg but it felt like 60-90 MG orally to be honest ) but also kind of dont want to plug :/
 
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Apparently you're right, the BA of dihydrocodeine is much lower, but that's due to its more extensive glucuronidation by liver enzymes and does not mean the drug is not absorbed orally. It just means more of it is converted to metabolites in the liver.

Codeine is the same, most of it is converted to the glucuronide once absorbed and very little is present in blood or excreted in urine. (Vree and Verway-van-Wissen, Pharmacokinetics and metabolism of codeine in humans, Biopharm Drug Dispos. 1992 Aug;13(6):445-60.)

The glucuronide metabolites are still active opioids, they actually have higher activity than the parent drugs! So while plugging codeine or DHC may mean slightly more codeine or DHC present, it doesn't make it beneficial IMO. DHC orally has a slightly stronger effect than codeine does, at least in my experience, and certainly doesn't require 5x the dose to produce a similar effect as the 20% BA might suggest.)
 
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Theirs a chance you could waste it to when i plugged dhc i hardly felt a thing which led me to beleive i was to backed up you need to be willing to clear yourself out with laxatives and enemas better off taken orally imo unless you know what your doing.if i had a decent source for codeine and dint have to shop pharmacy every day I'd be the happiest blogger in the world...
 
sekio said:
Apparently you're right, the BA of dihydrocodeine is much lower, but that's due to its more extensive glucuronidation by liver enzymes and does not mean the drug is not absorbed orally. It just means more of it is converted to metabolites in the liver.

Codeine is the same, most of it is converted to the glucuronide once absorbed and very little is present in blood or excreted in urine. (Vree and Verway-van-Wissen, Pharmacokinetics and metabolism of codeine in humans, Biopharm Drug Dispos. 1992 Aug;13(6):445-60.)

The glucuronide metabolites are still active opioids, they actually have higher activity than the parent drugs! So while plugging codeine or DHC may mean slightly more codeine or DHC present, it doesn't make it beneficial IMO. DHC orally has a slightly stronger effect than codeine does, at least in my experience, and certainly doesn't require 5x the dose to produce a similar effect as the 20% BA might suggest.)
Click to expand...
Wanted to ask you one more thing ! Can DHC be potentiated by blocking CYP3A4? so more DihydroCodeine gets converted to Morphine by CYP2D6 and less Norcodine by CYP3A4, i got some Trazodone i think it gets metabolized by CYP3A4. Also been taking some MagnesiumCitrate 300 MG 2-3 Hours before the Dihydrocodeine and it feels potentiated not sure why or im/was deficient in Magnesium. Thanks !
 
Razu_ said:
Wanted to ask you one more thing ! Can DHC be potentiated by blocking CYP3A4? so more DihydroCodeine gets converted to Morphine by CYP2D6 and less Norcodine by CYP3A4, i got some Trazodone i think it gets metabolized by CYP3A4. Also been taking some MagnesiumCitrate 300 MG 2-3 Hours before the Dihydrocodeine and it feels potentiated not sure why or im/was deficient in Magnesium. Thanks !
Click to expand...

While Trazadone is a substrate of CYP 3A4, it's not an inhibitor. You'll notice many of the drugs listed below aren't worth the side effects/ dangers for a small bump in DHC-->DHM.

  • Cytochrome P450 3A4 Interaction
The concomitant use of TREZIX™ with all cytochrome P450 3A4 inhibitors , such as macrolide antibiotics (e.g., erythromycin), azole-antifungal agents (e.g., ketoconazole), and protease inhibitors (e.g., ritonavir) or discontinuation of a cytochrome P450 3A4 inducer such as rifampin, carbamazepine, and phenytoin, may result in an increase in dihydrocodeine plasma concentrations with subsequently greater metabolism by cytochrome P450 2D6, resulting in greater morphine levels, which could increase or prolong adverse reactions and may cause potentially fatal respiratory depression.


The concomitant use of TREZIX™ with all cytochrome P450 3A4 inducers or discontinuation of a cytochrome P450 3A4 inhibitor may result in lower dihydrocodeine levels, greater norcodeine levels, and less metabolism via 2D6 with resultant lower morphine levels. This may be associated with a decrease in efficacy, and in some patients, may result in signs and symptoms of opioid withdrawal.
Click to expand...
 
Jekyl Anhydride said:
While Trazadone is a substrate of CYP 3A4, it's not an inhibitor. You'll notice many of the drugs listed below aren't worth the side effects/ dangers for a small bump in DHC-->DHM.
Click to expand...
Thanks for clearing that up didnt know it. Could i use anything to potentiate the DHC read' about Promethazine, Hydroxyzine) But theyre both harder to get than Diphenhydramine where i'm from. Thanks
 
Diphenhydramine is quite fine, any sedating 1st-generation antihistamine will work.
 
Jekyl Anhydride said:
While Trazadone is a substrate of CYP 3A4, it's not an inhibitor. You'll notice many of the drugs listed below aren't worth the side effects/ dangers for a small bump in DHC-->DHM.
Click to expand...
Hey sorry for a late message all of a sudden !, But i got a question since i remember you answering me here and you seem to know about CYP enzymes i hope !, Is there any SSRI that doesnt induce CYP2D6 ? that can be taken with Opioids without reducing their effects. Are substrates strong inhibitors of cyp2d6? Is there any ssri that doesnt inhibit cyp2d6 and can be taken with opioids?. At the moment im taking 30 MG Dxm 1 hr before Codeine and it works really really, well also lifts up my Mood by alot even during the day ! It might be because of my low weight that im feeling 30 mg of DXM pretty well. Now i was thinking what if i take an SSRI instead of 30 MG dxm? Will it be better or worse since SSRIS dont work immediately, and which ssri woukd work with opioids cause of cyp2d6. I hope you can help me with that one. Thanks ! edit: been googling alot ! Seems like every SSRI works on CYP2D6. Milnacipran gets metabolized by the Kidneys if i remember !
 
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Razu_ said:
Hey there i got some DHC pills 60 MG ( extended release ):
  • 1 tablet contains 60 mg of dihydrocodeinhydrogen tartrate. -The other ingredients are: tablet core: hypromellose, microcrystalline cellulose, fumed silica, magnesium stearate tablet film: Macrogol 6000, hypromellose, titanium dioxide (E 171), talc, Eudragit NE, food color "green lacquer" (quinoline yellow (E 104), indigotine (E. 132), aluminum hydroxide, water), food colorant "indigotine lake" (indigotine (E 132), aluminum hydroxide, water
  • Can i plug this safely? will it even work to plug Extendend releases since asses dont have stomeache acid to dissolve the slow release DHC-part of it? will i waste some of it?
Already crushed some up and they are fine white powder ( no wax when crushing ), however after mixing with Water some parts of the powder swims on top like Oil/gum? mixture, atleast some of it seems slimy
Click to expand...

Yes. Yes, you can (experience). But honestly, just chewing 'em works better.
 
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