• 🇬🇧󠁿 🇸🇪 🇿🇦 🇮🇪 🇬🇭 🇩🇪 🇪🇺
    European & African
    Drug Discussion

    Welcome Guest!
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

💂‍♂️ UK 💂‍♂️ British government considering raising ketamine classification to class A

Shinji Ikari

Shinji Ikari

Congratulations
Staff member
Joined
Aug 31, 2021
Messages
3,526
Location
The fringes of Human Instrumentality
Ketamine could be upgraded to a Class A drug as the government seeks expert advice on its classification, the Home Office has said.
Click to expand...
Illegal use of the drug has reached record levels in recent years, with an estimated 269,000 people aged 16-59 reporting ketamine use in the year ending March 2024.
Click to expand...
Increasing ketamine's classification would bring it in line with drugs including cocaine, heroin and ecstasy (MDMA) and mean up to life in prison for supply and production.
Click to expand...
The policing minister will ask the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs whether its classification should be changed and "carefully consider" its findings.
Click to expand...
The British government has a long and proud history of ignoring virtually every recommendation made by the ACMD so regardless of what they come back with I expect that this'll be happening sooner rather than later.
www.bbc.com

Ketamine could become Class A drug as ministers seek advice

Illegal use of the drug reached record levels last year, the Home Office said.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
So basically instead of helping people, they’re gonna make criminals out of them. Right. Guess we all know that always worked.

I’ll be honest I don’t even know the status of ketamine in the US. I know it is use for therapy and people get some stuff mailed them. However, I have the same attitude a lot of people here have as far as psychedelics or dissociative, causing any type of permanent healing. They can help. I can say opiates help depression for me. Should we have treatment for depression? (of course I say yes!)

I still think all drugs should be legal, and a choice between the person and the drug. Governments need to stay the hell out of this type stuff. But I do think the medical system can use them in a lot healthier ways.
 
Yeah - it's almost like every government has political motives for it's decisions on the legal controls of psychoactive drugs.

Since K is a class B controlled drug, I don't think changing it to class A will incur costs of any kind (be it financial, political, moral or otherwise).

It's also not going to make the slightest difference to price or availability. In essence, it's the least effort way of making it look like you are doing something.
 
It really doesn't matter. when I buy or import drugs class is irrelevant. You're very unlikely to get in much trouble for simple possession of even class A. Worst I've seem is a pig throwing a gram of coke in the gutter
 
GulpingBatteryLiquid said:
Also that chart David Nutt did a while back is dumb. it clearly doesn't tale the popularity of each drug into account

https://www.thelancet.com/cms/10.10...6ca-911b-3d22dadcfaeb/main.assets/gr2_lrg.jpg

Butane at the bottom, really? Benzos lower than GHB?
Click to expand...
It wasn't perfect but it was at least a solid stab at a data driven approach as opposed to the current classification system which is completely arbitrary. I'm guessing with the GHB they were going off hospital admissions and the association with date rape.

I haven't checked in for a couple of years but since getting booted from the ACMD David Nutt's been doing some pretty cool work with Drug Science and Project 21. I'm a bit of a fan.
GulpingBatteryLiquid said:
It really doesn't matter. when I buy or import drugs class is irrelevant. You're very unlikely to get in much trouble for simple possession of even class A. Worst I've seem is a pig throwing a gram of coke in the gutter
Click to expand...
3DQSAR said:
It's also not going to make the slightest difference to price or availability
Click to expand...
It'll mean longer prison sentences for dealers so more prison overcrowding and as dealers are going to be taking a bigger risk importing (maximum sentence 14 years class B and life for class A) it'll almost certainly result in the domestic price creeping up.

It sucks for the therapeutic side too, we've all heard how ketamine therapy is showing huge promise for treatment resistant depression and all the negative press is just going to result in more stigma making it harder for people to access.

It's all together, not great.
 
Coke and H are expensive because you need huge fields to grow them, other class As like MDMA are close enough to free

And class A drugs can be used for therapeutic reasons if needed, H is used for pain obviously, I THINK LSD is used in some private practices
 
GulpingBatteryLiquid said:
Coke and H are expensive because you need huge fields to grow them, other class As like MDMA are close enough to free

And class A drugs can be used for therapeutic reasons if needed, H is used for pain obviously, I THINK LSD is used in some private practices
Click to expand...
MDMA has always been a class A. Hypothetically, If it were a class B drug and then suddenly raised to class A do you not think it would affect the price? I can't see why it wouldn't personally but I suppose we'll see.

I'm not completely up to date with the current state of things but I wasn't aware of any regulated psychedelic therapy taking place in the UK outside of university studies/trials etc. I don't think the legal framework for it exists yet.

I guess it depends what you mean by private practitioner though, I know a private practitioner or two, if you catch my drift ;)
 
Shinji Ikari said:
MDMA has always been a class A. Hypothetically, If it were a class B drug and then suddenly raised to class A do you not think it would affect the price? I can't see why it wouldn't personally but I suppose we'll see.

I'm not completely up to date with the current state of things but I wasn't aware of any regulated psychedelic therapy taking place in the UK outside of university studies/trials etc. I don't think the legal framework for it exists yet.

I guess it depends what you mean by private practitioner though, I know a private practitioner or two, if you catch my drift ;)
Click to expand...

www.gov.uk

Psychoactive Substances Act 2016: guidance for researchers

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

Several compounds we developed were ultimately bought by Nutt's company as alcohol replacements. They work fine, but he discovered what we had found out namely that no mechanism exists for the sale of such compounds.

I'm pretty sure the patent has been accepted now. I didn't really concentrate on it since I was offered shares or cash and took the latter. But since then improved versions have been developed BUT are unlikely ever to be tasted by people seeking an alcohol alternative.
 
3DQSAR said:
www.gov.uk

Psychoactive Substances Act 2016: guidance for researchers

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

Several compounds we developed were ultimately bought by Nutt's company as alcohol replacements. They work fine, but he discovered what we had found out namely that no mechanism exists for the sale of such compounds.

I'm pretty sure the patent has been accepted now. I didn't really concentrate on it since I was offered shares or cash and took the latter. But since then improved versions have been developed BUT are unlikely ever to be tasted by people seeking an alcohol alternative.
Click to expand...
The 2016 PSA was a doozy alright.

Is this what you're talking about?

I remember hearing about something similar a while ago but I can't quite recall the details. It might have been one of those segments with Hamilton Morris, I think he was interviewing a research chemical manufacturer and they were talking about developing safer alternatives to ethanol but for the life of me I can't remember who it was. I'll see if I can find it later.
 
We specifically set out to produce something much less dangerous than alcohol. But even then, how on earth would one licence it's sale?

I actually pointed out that initially getting it accepted as a prescription medication to treat alcoholics would at least allow stage 4 trials (pharmacovigilance) and we could confirm that it had no nasty side-effects (in our human trials none came to light), but that would take roughly 13 years and THEN you would have to push for more general sales.

I figure Nutt wouldn't live to see it - but he's STILL happy to allow people to invest in spite of knowing the thing is doomed to fail.

He's not a bad guy - likes being famous too much IMO. I would rather people not know who I am and just have the money, thanks.
 
Last edited:
3DQSAR said:
We specifically set out to produce something much less dangerous than alcohol. But even then, how on earth would one licence it's sale?

I actually pointed out that initially getting it accepted as a prescription medication to treat alcoholics would at least allow stage 4 trials (pharmacovigilance) and we could confirm that it had no nasty side-effects (in our human trials none came to light), but that would take roughly 13 years and THEN you would have to push for more general sales.

I figure Nutt wouldn't live to see it - but he's STILL happy to allow people to invest in spite of knowing the thing is doomed to fail.

He's not a bad guy - like being famous too much IMO. I would rather people not know who I am and just have the money, thanks.
Click to expand...
That's all really cool. Did you ever have the chance and inclination to sample any of these creations yourself?

I suppose the tabloids didn't give Nutt very much choice on the fame with all those LSD headlines, he ended up on the front pages a couple of times didn't he? I've always immensely respected the work he does so it's nice to hear that he sounds like a mostly decent guy when he's not being quoted too.
 
Shinji Ikari said:
That's all really cool. Did you ever have the chance and inclination to sample any of these creations yourself?
Click to expand...

Yes - I tried them all. It's like alcohol, or rather, the SOUGHT effects of alcohol.

No amnesia, mood lability, nausea/emesis, hangover or, as far as we could tell, much physical dependence.

It's not a secret. All the sought effects of alcohol are mediated by the a5 subunit of the GABA receptor. All we did was engineered a drug with similar duration of action to alcohol.

So it was a benzodiazepine - although an unusual one.
 
GHB/GBL are pretty close to alcohol with less of the negative effects, still very addictive though

I doubt anything very similar to alcohol would ever come without consequences, what goes up must come down
 
THECATINTHEHAT said:
If you’re going to make drugs illegal and have the current A, B and C system then ketamine should clearly be A
Click to expand...
It won't make it any safer or harder to access though. It'll just mean people go to prison for longer and vets therapists and researchers etc will have more paperwork to do.

But yeah, ketamine can fuck up your life as hard as any class A drug, but then so can many class B and C drugs :shruggies:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top