Opioids Breaking my contract with my methadone clinic and get on opiate from my neurologist

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Alright, I never wanted to get to shoot dilaudid. I got into doing that because I couldn't find anything else and eating dilaudid never did anything, even as hydromorph contins 18/24/30mg gelcaps.

So I ended up being on methadone. All of this is due to a very painful neurological condition. That took a lot of time to get a real diagnostic, i'm talking almost a decade now of suffering before they found what the hell was going on. Should I tell my neurologists who always just scripted me nothing too exciting except rivotril (clonazepam) 1mg bid ? He always just got me on topamax and I didn't see him in a long time and he said back then if this doesn't work we might have to get the big guns, meaning opiates. But since then (3 years or so), I have been scripted by my regular doctor and pain clinic. Much before I started to buy dilaudid from someone else.

My regular family doctor scripted me : MS IR 30mg, 30mg instant release morphine as needed. So i would get around 20 a month. But after 3 months he decided to send me to a pain clinic before further re-scripting me. I was furious and in a small withdrawal compared to what I have come to know later. At the pain clinic they scripted me oxycontins 50mg (yeah those came up here in canada, as well as other even numbers of mg) a day + those MS IR 30mg's in case of flare ups in pain. I lived some years with that and was okay with it. But then oxycontin was removed, then replaced 2 months later by OxyNeo, which was shit. I end up going to Methadone treatment due to oxycontin withdrawal and I couldn't get a quick appointment at the pain clinic and I met this guy selling dilaudid 4 and 8mg for VERY cheap.

Let' s say for 6 months I shot a lot of dilaudid, ended up on methadone which had me cancel my script to oxycontin even if i didnt use it (cos it was oxyneos) and obviously also cancelled my MS IR 30mg. I want off the methadone as quick as possible. I meet my neurologist feb 4th,would it be a good idea to tell him all what happened since I met him? I'll skip the part about shooting dilaudid, just that the removal of oxycontin and the carelessness of the pain clinic to give me something to replace it quickly ended up with me being really sick for months with Paws from hell etc. and since generic oxycontins are out here in canada if he could at least just rescript me generic oxycontin 50 or 60mg ? I won't even ask for the MS IR 30mg for breakthru pain, my family doc will do that once i'm off methadone and that a specialist has taken care of me he says.

I take 60mg of methadone daily ? Would taking 60mg of old school oxycontin (generic OC in canada can just be chewed like the real thing) be enough to not feel sick from getting off the methadone? Or i would need the MS IR also ?

I need a very educated guess

 

[rhun]

Oh man... you're in for disappointment. I'm on 60mg methadone and IVing 2gs of heroin produces no noticeable effects other than making me mildly sleepy. 400mg of morphine orally is just a waste of money, same with 160mg Oxy.

That's just me though, I have a tolerance and the methadone has just made it way way worse. 60mg barely holds me, if I don't go in to the clinic first thing in the morning I get sick.

If I were you I would just use the search engine and find the conversion from methadone to oxycodone. There's no reason to "guess."

Edit: Quick two second search and I found this: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/...atio-Thread-(-Links-amp-Personal-Experiences)

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Yeah, but what I was thinking was tapering down the methadone first man. Taper down to around 30mg and then switch to the official pain meds.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

There is a good converter that can convert chronic dosage of methadone to chronic dosage of other opioids...let me look this up..

Based on your selections above, here is the result:
Equivalent dose for opiate selected in Step 4 above: 150.00 mg
Reduction for incomplete cross tolerance: 0 %

Chronic oral morphine equivalent dose is: 225.00 mg

They say if you download their software results are even more precise. I will try that later. But to me 50mg oxycontin x2 + MS IR 30mg X 3-4 a day should cover my ass ? Or maybe not ? :S

As for how 60mg holds me, I am fine for around 30h-32 hours. So I can skip the really fucking cold mornings we have lately and go start my car at a bit less ridiculous temperatures to go get it at the pharmacy.

Oh yeah fuck yes! Btw, tomorrow is my first day where I can bring takehomes! Two! I take one dose there and bring home 2!!! Finally.

 

[walterdini]

-Rhun,

Are you shooting the dope ontop of the methadone? Because not getting high from the doses oof oxy, H and morphine you llisted makes sense if taken WHILE ALSO ON methadone. But if your off of methadone, a reassonable dose of oxy will keep w/d away.

OP, if ur just worried about not getting w/d from methadone and not being in pain, once u stop the methadone, a properly calibrated dose of oxy WILL WORK for you. Now IME, you will need more than 50-60mg of oxy per day to keep you well if your switching from 60mg methadone per day. I don't think you'll need 100's of mg's per dose, but you will definately need more than 1 dose per day, at least at the start. And Especially if you are planning to defeat the ER mechanism by chewing.

I'd say, hat 50mg ER twice daily will keep you good, with an extra 20-30mg IR to take as needed for pain and/or w/d. The real issue will be that the methadone is so long lasting and builds up so much, that unless you keep aa relatively high level of oxy in ur system all day, you might feel some mild withdrawl for a few hours every day btwn doses. Now with 120-130mgs of oxy in u, you won't be in aweful w/d, but u might feel some unpleasantness, but that will go away in a week or two and u will stabalize on the oxy. And IMO, ur better off in the long run redcing ur dose and being a little uncomfortable for a few days, than you are taking 200-300mgs of oxy a day and upping your tolerance.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

-Rhun,

Are you shooting the dope ontop of the methadone? Because not getting high from the doses oof oxy, H and morphine you llisted makes sense if taken WHILE ALSO ON methadone.

Yeah I was finding his comment strange too. I wouldn't be taking methadone anymore so surely a strong opiate in its stead would work too. 60mg isnt even a blocking dose yet for most people. I've only had a relapse once where i shooted 6mg of dilaudid and i did sure feel it. But the NMDA part of methadone kind of not make me want to fiend over the thought of doing it again I think.

And yes, my plan is to take 2 50mg oxycodone ER a day and 30mg morphine instant release x 3 or 4 times a day. The question is, should I bring all of this up to my neurologist ? I'm not sure how he would feel about me and him breaking my methadone maintenance contract (if i get opiates for pain other than methadone, i'm out of the program).

 

[crzydiamond]

^i would not.

Simply because, quite honestly, there is no way you could say it all that doesn't come off making you look bad. No offense. And if you tell all that, you are much less likely to get the stuff that you need, even if you truly need it

If I understand right, you want to switch from the methadone to other opiates that the neurologist will give you? I guess if he would understand that I would explain that (but not explain the contract that forbids him to give you opiates, or you may have him not give you them until you r off clinic). Just say you want to get off the methadone due to its difficult wd

And if he isn't understanding, do it on your own

Just my opinion.

 

[thelastclubkid]

if you come off of the methadone its likely 60mg oxycodone isnt going to to enough... equivalence is like 200 mg oxy = 30 mg methadone (give or take... there are some cross tolerance issues that make this varied...)

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Just said I would take 100-120 mg of generic oxycontin and between 90 to 120mg of morphine IR. My old pain regimen was that but using lower dosed oxycontin, before the removal from the market. It just was not scripted by this neurologist who I have not see since a long time. I've been to pain clinics and my regular doc a lot for the pain since I last saw him. God why do I have to re-explain this, it's like in real life where I need to re-explain everything I say after the first time and it's a pretty long thing to re-tell but not that long to get all at once..

And to the mouth breaking monkey who re-calculated the dosage. I have software here that can convert a chronic methadone dose to a chornic X opiate dosage : It said that 60mg of methadone a day = 150mg of oxy a day. A number I will not reach but be close to, with the help of my old friends MS IR 30mg, I will highly surpass.


So yeah maybe I should skip the MMT part and just say I am on methadone for pain right now and that I do not enjoy it at all / would rather have my pain regimen back and getting an appointment to his neurology cabinet was a much less long of a wait than going to the pain clinic. He is the one i initially saw when I started having pain/muscle stiffness in the neck problems.

Or maybe I can just have him rescript me my Clonazepam script that the methadone clinic removed, 2mg a day of clonaz right now would be swell. WARNING, I WAS A HARD BENZ HEAD EVEN BEFORE I TOOK OPIATES FOR FUN.

 

[rhun]

I'm a girl y'all. Says so on my profile and my avatar is a chick so don't just assume.

No, I was not talking about taking methadone or heroin on top of my methadone. Methadone has blocking effects at high doses, everyone knows that.
That was my tolerance before, and when I switched to methadone it took 80mg to hold me without WDs. I've since tapered to 60mg. I've gone a couple days without methadone and tried to shoot 2-3gs of dope but wasn't expecting much, it takes months to lower your tolerance after methadone.

My point to the OP was that methadone severely rises your tolerance. Yes, you would definitely need to taper. But just tapering won't reduce tolerance, it will take time. I really doubt they will be able to go back to their previous dose after 60mg methadone.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

I'll let you guys know what happens after my visit to the so seldom seen neurologist on feb 4th. I have my plan all setup correctly.

 

[tricomb]

I have no idea what kind of answers your looking for but this thread is like, the definition of speculation.

1) I'm not even sure what the question here is

2) I don't see any harm reduction value

3) You seem to be asking what prescriptions are best to ask for, and this varies individual by individual, highly dependent on so many factors, even factors we don't even know about or understand yet.

God why do I have to re-explain this, it's like in real life where I need to re-explain everything I say after the first time and it's a pretty long thing to re-tell but not that long to get all at once..

We aren't healthcare professionals, we don't know your medical history or ANYTHING about you at all, not even your pain condition, yet you seem to be looking for help ensuring you get prescribed what you want.

No offense, but your posting is incoherent at times, to put it lightly, and you contradict yourself multiple times throughout this thread. Begin in speculation so lets end with speculation.... Could your Neurologist prescribe you full agonists after your long history of IV drug abuse, now that you have been on methadone maintenance? I don't know. Here in the USA, you'd have a very hard time finding a legitimate doctor that would, <edit> at least not since the statewide prescription monitoring systems have been imposed. </edit> I have heard reports of people getting rx'd full agonists after being on maintenance drugs. I think that the chances are about as good as winning the lottery, but hey every now and then life throws you surprises.