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Billion + believe in Satan. Should all schools be mandated to teach Creationism?

J
methamaniac said:
lol
First,
(ironically) they needed the intelligence God gave them to make XNA
2) These XNA provide information (which may or may not contain meaning), but not specified information( which must have meaning). DNA that we find in any organism today contains specified information.
3) There is no proposed selection and reproduction mechanism for the XNA and how they ultimately get "selected for"
Lastly, these XNA do not encode for information, let alone fit into the DNA-RNA-Protein triangle relationship.
Points for trying tho
In short, you aint close to explaining away DNA
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Please, my parents explained the large pile of toys under my Xmas tree as coming from some fat bloke who magically squeezed down my chimney.

You need more than a hardcover of fairy tales to sedate the questions of science
 
Nice rebuttal.....

Im afraid you need a rather large plump of fairy dust to believe in spontaneous generous.
I put a little extra in you stocking so you can magically make codes go away.
I'm hoping a teaspoon of observation wont effect the medicine going down.
 
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One Thousand Words said:
http://www.news.com.au/technology/s...ifes-first-spark/story-fn5fsgyc-1227149429932

Observation is the essence of science
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Tell me about it....

Observation:
- codes only come from intelligent thought
-DNA is a code
-Life cant be made without DNA
Conclusion:
You dont get life without the code of DNA created by intelligent thought
See, this isnt hard

That wasnt a nice fairy tale on how Blind Chance creatd life. Need to sprinkle a lot more imagination if you want someone to believe in your cooked up
psedoscience.
But who knows,
Keep the faith alive. Fairy tales can possibly be true. Blind Chance could exist right betwen Slim
and None.
http://darwinismrefuted.com/molecular_biology_15.html
Read this whenever you to decide to come out of never-never land.
 
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Gnostic Bishop said:
Perhaps not but it would give a good feeling to taxpayers who do not believe yet have to contribute to churches who only lie to their sheeple.

As it is, non-believing taxpayers help pay for lies.

Regards
DL
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Not paying taxes is not the same thing as receiving government subsidies, dude. If you're claiming that religious institutions receive regular cash from their national, state, or local governments, I'd like to see some references to back that up.

As far as I've always heard (though I'm willing to admit I could be wrong, if someone will provide the evidence), the coffers of religious congregations are filled entirely from the pockets of congregants, in the form of tithes, membership dues, offerings, and donations. These are given willingly by congregants, as a way to chip in for all that their congregation does. In every religious community I've ever encountered personally, there was an appeal process for members in good standing who can't afford the amount requested, often leading to a reduced rate and/or a non-monetary way to pitch in to help the community. There is typically also a standard procedure for lodging a grievance with the administrative board if a congregant feels his contributions are not being allocated in accordance with the congregation's stated principles or what is being reported. In all but the most controversial and fringy of cults, a congregant is always free to leave the community and take his money, presence, and voice elsewhere.

All of what I've just outlined is exactly how most secular civil society institutions, who hold land and bank accounts, operate. In addition, never forget that all human institutions will always, eventually, have some degree of corruption.
 
One Thousand Words said:
Crystal formation could be argued as a form of coding, or logical pattern yet I doubt anyone would consider salt intelligent
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No, salt isnt intelligent. I dont think anyone doubts that except maybe you.
Again crystals arent coded.
A fully formed crystal doesnt instruct anything.
Maybe this will help,
An alphabet can be constructed with symmetric letters.
But the letters being symmetric doesnt do anything to help a spontaneous language form.
To form a language it takes my/your intelligence.
Is this really that hard to understand?
Seems very elementary my dear Watson.
Structure doesnt code. Crystal formation such as snowflakes just follow the laws of the universe we live in. A snowflake just follows the structure of the molecules/atoms they are made up of. The more symmetrical, the more stable the snowflake/crystal.
Thats it.
 
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MyDoorsAreOpen said:
Not paying taxes is not the same thing as receiving government subsidies, dude. If you're claiming that religious institutions receive regular cash from their national, state, or local governments, I'd like to see some references to back that up.

As far as I've always heard (though I'm willing to admit I could be wrong, if someone will provide the evidence), the coffers of religious congregations are filled entirely from the pockets of congregants, in the form of tithes, membership dues, offerings, and donations. These are given willingly by congregants, as a way to chip in for all that their congregation does. In every religious community I've ever encountered personally, there was an appeal process for members in good standing who can't afford the amount requested, often leading to a reduced rate and/or a non-monetary way to pitch in to help the community. There is typically also a standard procedure for lodging a grievance with the administrative board if a congregant feels his contributions are not being allocated in accordance with the congregation's stated principles or what is being reported. In all but the most controversial and fringy of cults, a congregant is always free to leave the community and take his money, presence, and voice elsewhere.

All of what I've just outlined is exactly how most secular civil society institutions, who hold land and bank accounts, operate. In addition, never forget that all human institutions will always, eventually, have some degree of corruption.
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A church can recieve federal funding but not for religious activities. Just for charitable purposes.
But this is very rare.
Another stretch of the truth by GB.
But whats new?
 
MyDoorsAreOpen said:
Not paying taxes is not the same thing as receiving government subsidies, dude. If you're claiming that religious institutions receive regular cash from their national, state, or local governments, I'd like to see some references to back that up.

As far as I've always heard (though I'm willing to admit I could be wrong, if someone will provide the evidence), the coffers of religious congregations are filled entirely from the pockets of congregants, in the form of tithes, membership dues, offerings, and donations. These are given willingly by congregants, as a way to chip in for all that their congregation does. In every religious community I've ever encountered personally, there was an appeal process for members in good standing who can't afford the amount requested, often leading to a reduced rate and/or a non-monetary way to pitch in to help the community. There is typically also a standard procedure for lodging a grievance with the administrative board if a congregant feels his contributions are not being allocated in accordance with the congregation's stated principles or what is being reported. In all but the most controversial and fringy of cults, a congregant is always free to leave the community and take his money, presence, and voice elsewhere.

All of what I've just outlined is exactly how most secular civil society institutions, who hold land and bank accounts, operate. In addition, never forget that all human institutions will always, eventually, have some degree of corruption.
Click to expand...

I am not going to go deeply into this as I am more concerned with churches lying to people more than the money. Do not ask for evidence because you will not get it on the tax issue. I am looking at the big picture.

If tax exemption were not profitable for churches they would not seek them or use them. Every penny that they do not pay has to be underwritten from the taxpayer be that taxpayer a believer or not. We can split hairs and talk about the snow plow that the church does not pay for and other such things but as I said, I am not going to bother with all the details.

To say they are non-profit while jetting around in their Lear jets should be telling us what we need to know. Lying is quite profitable and our own governments collude in those lies by giving churches credibility through the tax system.

Regards
DL
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
I am not going to go deeply into this as I am more concerned with churches lying to people more than the money. Do not ask for evidence because you will not get it on the tax issue. I am looking at the big picture.
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Then this is as far as this conversation goes, at least from my end. Even looking past your provocations, discussions with you get frustrating, because you bait and switch. My parting words to you in this discussion: I do agree that anyone who gives their time, money, and other resources to any nonprofit institution ought to be wary and ask plenty of questions about exactly what these resources are going towards. As you correctly imply, those at the top of any institution are human and fallible, and the temptations to misuse common resources are many and strong.

This is an entirely different issue from whether the doctrines religious communities ask their congregants to take on faith have any merit. If that's what you're really driving at, I'll ask you to start a different thread.
 
MyDoorsAreOpen said:
Then this is as far as this conversation goes, at least from my end. Even looking past your provocations, discussions with you get frustrating, because you bait and switch. My parting words to you in this discussion: I do agree that anyone who gives their time, money, and other resources to any nonprofit institution ought to be wary and ask plenty of questions about exactly what these resources are going towards. As you correctly imply, those at the top of any institution are human and fallible, and the temptations to misuse common resources are many and strong.

This is an entirely different issue from whether the doctrines religious communities ask their congregants to take on faith have any merit. If that's what you're really driving at, I'll ask you to start a different thread.
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Thanks for this.

I already know that the mainstream religions are basically all misogynous and immoral as they do not promote equality.

Starting an O.P. on merit would only have theists saying yes, then running away without speaking to the immorality of their creeds.

Perhaps someone else has the time but I cannot spare it at the moment.

Regards
DL
 
methamaniac said:
I take it by that comment you now understand what a code is.
I expected once you got it you may not take it very well. :)
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I have long stopped worrying about the afterlife and eternal damnation. I prefer to concentrate on the now and the physical (and quantum) world around me. It makes life far more interesting discovering how the universe works rather than listening to religious folk tell me that man can speak to God.

I wouldn't be surprised if some governing force is not pulling the strings of the universe, but I'll never accept that Jesus, Mohammed or Kayne have direct access to such an energy. My own definition of God is so far removed from a bearded women in a cloud that I wouldn't even call it a religion.

The universe is too vast and too unwieldy to need to worry if I am following the correct rules of engagement.
 
^
Hey, as long as you realize we had to be created
my point is made.
Everything aside, you have to be in complete denial not to see that.
Past that, you're free to believe what you want.
My personal belief in God doesnt stop me at all from discovering how the universe works.
I read about quantum physics daily.
It reminds me there is a whole lot more to life than the physical.
 
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