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Benzos Benzos & their different uses

M

millenialperson

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Joined
Aug 1, 2018
Messages
1
This is my first post.

I was wondering which benzos you guys prefer, and why.
I know some are used mostly as hypnotics (for sleep) and some as anti-anxiety and some for muscle pain.

But out of all research chemical benzos/thienoz and presciption benzos/thienzos, which do you guys prefer? And why?

Also if possible could you guys list all the benzos you've tried and give them a rating for their ability to help:
- insomnia
- anxiety
- depression
- pain

Thanks a lot!
 
Clonazepam, and Clonazolam, overall (and by far)

Whats YOUR need, though, aside from curiosity or a secret BL thesis to dethrone me?

I'll try to break it down later, however check the benzo sticky and the many posts of mine for all the info you could, aside from maybe the extremely specific or absurd, and certain figures

Loots of benzo threads - Oh La La! If o let they knew... ;)
 
Clonazepam is the best for short-term general anxiety, especially sublingually. However I switched to diazepam because I felt terrible interdose withdrawal in the morning. Xanax is best for panic attacks but it's very short lasting and messes with coordination more than any other benzo I've had. Xanax ER sucked in my experience. Lorazepam is better than nothing but not by much.

I don't find any benzo, even temazepam, to be very helpful with sleep in any reasonable quantity. ChlorazePATE is generally terrible but felt a bit sleepy maybe. Diclazepam made me the most tired. Rohypnal is supposed to be useful but not available in the US due to moral panic.

Diazepam is best for pain because it has significant muscle relaxant qualities and lasts all day. I could even skip a few days without dealing with withdrawal. Glad I'm off it but probably the best choice if you need to take something for over a month.

Every benzo will make depression worse. Alprazolam is supposed to have some small antidepressant effect but I don't really see it. (Even if it did, talk about a terrible idea). Although technically not a benzodiazepine, etizolam feels the most emotionally positive for what it's worth.
 
^ Wow

Xanax = no AD properties; if interdose wd was a problem with a long lasting, highly potent benzodiazepine, then surprised you didn't wake up in the middle of the night, in a panic, on Valium, fast acting Bzd

Valium is rx'ed qid for a reason; it doesn't "last that long " ("") and is mostly bow acutely used or for specific purposes, AFAIK

CLORAZEPATE is the *amazing metabolite that people go on about, and why they think dzp/Valium is supposed to be long lasting; yet Clorazepate is an intermediate acting benzodiazepine, for the most part; like dzp, nordazepam's t1/2 doesn't co-relate well with its actual duration, especially "Primary Duration of Action ", although valium is generally relaxing if you don't have a habit or dependency, so that part checks

Anyway, just correcting.... forget it - really not a prick though - seriously

Clonazepam has mild serotonergic properties, albeit antagonistic (?) OP just refuses to cone back or acknowledge us. Likely would make off a list if they did, though maybe not. A bit longer, at least - Lorne, the (magnificently) ????
 
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/3281931/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/3316312/

"These results suggest that ALP alone is as effective as a standard tricyclic for the acute treatment of patients with major depressive disorder and that significant improvement may occur within the first week of medication."

Valium has a long elimination half-life and is highly lipophilic, I don't think that's controversial...

Both Chlorazepate and diazepam are metabolized into nordiazepam among other things, but diazepam is not metabolized into chlorazepate as far as I know. Have you been prescribed chlorazepate? I mean to each their own but I've never heard of anybody being impressed with it.
 
I use Xanax for IBS-D. It was a last resort med but works perfectly and only very little tolerance has built up to the calming effects for my gut. Alprazolam also has CCK activity (antagonistic) which might aid in treating INS. I don't know very much about CCK though so if someone more knowledge able could enlighten me?
 
Transcendence said:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/3281931/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/3316312/

"These results suggest that ALP alone is as effective as a standard tricyclic for the acute treatment of patients with major depressive disorder and that significant improvement may occur within the first week of medication."

Valium has a long elimination half-life and is highly lipophilic, I don't think that's controversial...

Both Chlorazepate and diazepam are metabolized into nordiazepam among other things, but diazepam is not metabolized into chlorazepate as far as I know. Have you been prescribed chlorazepate? I mean to each their own but I've never heard of anybody being impressed with it.
Click to expand...

.. Yes, and wasn't impressed. That was the point

And Clorazepate, aka Tranxene, is COMPLETELY, 100 % converted to nordazepam in the stomach, before ever even reaching your liver

Bottom Line: Clorazepate and Nordazepam are the same medication, effects, duration, indistinguishable. Yet it is a partial agonist, and valiums (dzp) only active metabolite,, and its terrible! According to many, I like you, was simply unimpressed (holds longer than our lipophillic friend, valium

And, uh, lipophillicity results in typically a fast (er) onset, and rapid penetration into the CNS; Unfortunately, it rapidly exits the Cns in return, and in the case of valium, it is redistributed to various tissues, where it slowly seeps out into the liver to be destroyed/metabolized

They RX Valium 3-4x per day for a reason, more rarely 5x(don't even remember the abbreviation for 5x dosing, it's qid for "quad " or 4x" )

Valium is rapidly absorbed into the circulation and CNS, yielding fast onset, short - intermediate duration. Check yourself mm

And appreciate the link and am aware of that, however a LOT of unhappy people are going to recieve a "benefit " from a powerful, fast acting Triazolobenzodiazepine like Alprazolam, it would s neither shocking nor convincing, as alprazolam is reinforcing, and wears off rapidly enough to cause rebound symptoms

Again, remember, in general, (with bzd's especially) lower lipophillicity results in a longer duration of action, and T1/2 is almost irrelevant; they use Lorazepam standard now, in part because it's anticonvulsant effects last longer and are otherwise superior to dzp

And both Dzp and Clonazepam have t1/2's that average 30-40 hours, high variability; yet Clonazepam (like lorazepam) has fairly poor solubility

Just a thing or two to consider, your willing to reference, then put duration of " dzp and compare it to nordazepam(Clorazepate/Tranxene) or Clonazepam

Excuse my, uh, mini rant

Nice evening, all, - Lorne
 
Lorne, I have read many of your posts and you seem pretty knowledgeable about benzos. Would you happen to know why alprazolam has gastrointestinal effects such as stopping diarrhea and stomach cramps and pain?

I know that stress can cause GI issues and Xanax helps to relieve the stress, but there is some chronic illness in my GI tract that causes me to go to the bathroom 12+ times a day unless the alprazolam is there to help me. No other benzos (I've tried non-benzo meds as well with no success) I have taken have worked for this issue (clonazepam, chlordiazepoxide, lorazepam, temazepam, and diazepam).
 
Well, actually, there is a benzodiazepine practically Taylor made for your problem; Cannot recall the name, however it is used specifically for IBS and similar GI problems, to my understanding. You could get this, maybe cut the xanax dose in half (if you want)

Gotta check someone, family member in hospital, he should be fine though, anyway, will you be on/checking? I can check it out and dissect the alprazolam issue hopefully a little later

Have to go for now, shall, God willing return
 
All I could find on the topic said that gaba receptors located in the intestines are activated by the benzodiazepines causing depressed gastrointestinal movement (constipation), in addition to the stress/anxiety component. The two recommended benzos were Chlordiazepoxide and Alprazolam.
 
The chlordiazepoxide was actually the most beneficial compared to the the rest of the benzos sans the alprazolam. I swear it works like a charm. If I don't take it I will have to go to the bathroom over 10 times a day and it's just burning liquid and mucous, sometimes a blood (coagulated and dark like coffee grounds)!. When I take the Xanax I don't have the debilitating pain or need to go so many times. I maybe go 3x a day now (HUGE improvement). But I also take kratom which helps with it as well, but even without the kratom I still don't have to go nearly as often. It's seriously a miracle drug for me regarding IBS-D.
 
^ Dextofisopam, dextro enantiomer of tofisopam, an atypical benzodiazepine with a secondary MOA (of unknown significance) and little anticonvulsant properties on its own, apparently, although they are developing the dextofisopam (dextro version) for sale in the US for IBS

Not sure how far along they are, just thought it was interesting you mentioned that, and apparently at least since last year (?), they have been developing a benzodiazepine for that specific purpose (of IBS, and-d in particular AFAIK) not sure if any are Fda approved, though this demonstrates they clearly think it could be (or is, more likely)

Funny chlordiapoxide(Cdp?) was mentioned, as it is primarily a prodrug for nordazepam, and is less potent than tranxene/nordazepam itself, and valium, which is generally 1.5-2 x more potent than nordazepam and tranxene(Clorazepate, which again, is a carrier fornordazepam, and they are more or less equipotent(SDU 10-20mg/15mg avg, vs apparently 10-25 mg Librium, 20 standard? )

Anyway, I can think of reasons or theories why some may work better than others; if it isn't as well absorbed, for example, although I don't think it's like opioids(opiates), where there are plenty of opioid and Mu receptors in the GI tract, which is why loperamide, which normally has an absurdly low BA% of <2%, is useful for stomach complaints and PNS qgonism, and a similar mechanism for S4 atypical opioids

Whatever OP wanted, they are getting, certainly some info! ;)
 
I am diagnosed with inflammatory bowel disease but not a specific type like chron's or UC yet. I've been taking prescribed diazepam or clonazepam for many years. My psychiatrist prescribes them (one or the other; switch occasionally) for chronic anxiety and dysthymic disorder technically but always states that there is further justification in their use to aid in the pain and chronic diahrrea associated with IBD.

Lorne - very interesting to know there is a possible bzd treatment for ibs-d being developed. They absolutely help slow down my GI emptying and reduce cramping.
 
^ Yes, it's great to utilize them in different ways - it is used, in the racemic form, in other countries, so apparently it is relatively safe and effective (not sure if dextofisopam is simply the active enantiomomer (sic) of tofisopam, or if the effects are slightly different))

However, imagine taking opioids, for many years, with occasional benzodiazepine use (always preferred Clonazepam over xanax, even in good health) and then,(now, that is) you start taking benzodiazepines pretty much daily, and become dependent, and on high doses - opioids delay gastric emptying, and slow the GI tract, and as you mentioned, benzodiazepines calm/slow down things in that area, and together they both slow down the GI tract, and enchance each other to some degree - so imagine, both combined, and, don't have IBS-D, although do have stomach problems, and a LOT of nausea

Just saying, it can lock you up, and normally, wouldn't mention what can be TMI if not stated medically or or for a purpose; it would be terrifying to think of some of the symptoms associated with serious problems like that

Enough derailing the thread again, though I need, while there is any chance, to update the Benzo sticky, among other things - ????
(Lorne)!!!
 
Yes a thread or sticky discussing benzos and the enteric nervous system should be made! I would love it.
 
ya, things can get blocked up really quickly...

I use kratom daily and used to take prescribed hydrocodone and lomotil in conservative doses for treatment alongside benzos. I've had to do an enema or two in my day. No fun at all.
 
I also use kratom (about 10-14g dried leaf powder) daily. No problem with constipation though. The kratom and Xanax synergize nicely to help my GI tract. Although I have very severe IBS-D. I would go #2 about 12-14 times average a day.
 
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