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Ayahuasca retreats

Then bring some harmala extract and ask for just chakruna without the caapi. Of course, it's not "the same" without this symbolic purging ritual, and/or the caapi vine's role in the experience, according to tradition.

8) I'm not saying these methods are useless, but you can easily modify or recreate the experience being sold for thousands in your own home/country for a few bucks, and to the par you wish it. But then it wouldn't be "authentic", eh?
 
I've hurt myself with psychs before. I'd rather have someone ultra experienced sitting/guiding for me.

Besides, as wood mentioned, there's much to see in peru outside these retreats.
 
how is the p.v. supposed to work without the maoi/harmine/harmaline in the caapi, stagnant? dmt is not orally active, you know that i am sure. so, why would i request to do it without it??

you really are wasting your time posting your rolly eyes faces, and questioning the desire to spend a grand to travel to another country (a beautiful one with incredible people)
set and setting.
it is the setting i and others prefer, you don't, so bugger off. you weren't invited anyway ;)


edit. i only just saw that you said to bring the harmala extract. totally missed that, sorry :)
 
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I understand the motive for people wanting to experience this, but I still find it distasteful. I think there's something to be said for having some cultural sensitivity in acknowledging what the historical context of ayahuasca is, and that context is far outside of our lifestyle. Paying to go down to Latin America to have a shaman, legitimate or no, guide you through an ancient ritual just strikes me as off-color.

The vine doesn't care who she talks to, because 'she' doesn't exist. Money does talk however, and does so to everyone.
 
it is allegorical. I am an agnostic, I have no beliefs. here is an idea, no more discussing the validity of shamanism in this thread, unless you are going to be constructive. i created this for information pertaining to how to prepare for and what to expect with this experience. the set I choose is to be with people who have spent their life preparing for this the setting is the amazon, you want to smoke dmt, or drink your own brew in your bedroom, more power to you. I don't criticize your choice, and i don't give a flying dmt elf what you think about mine
K? thnks.
 
Intoxo said:
purging is the best part
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certainly will be if there is validity to is being a spiritual and physical cleansing. :\

I eat badly, I smoke too much, i drink too much.....8(
 
no no, i didn't mean to sound bitchy. I am not a believer of anything, i like to experience everything though, and i just didn't want the thread riddled with skepticity, interesting topics always get so boring with it :)

But why would you think this is disrespectful? I spent two months living with a indigenous indian family in quito, ecuador. we learned so much, from each other, and it was an eye opening experience. there was no judgement, and more than a lot of respect. our children were the same age, couldn't speak the same language, and they bonded even more than we adults did. I have nothing but respect and a healthy curiosity for other cultures.

It is true, aya tourism, in it's worst incarnation is a bad thing, but i find nothing wrong, as a matter of fact, everything right, with someone who wants to experience something such as this for pure reasons.

there is an article i read at MAPS of a mans experiences with peruvian shamans, and the aya, and he said that they seemed surprised at the americans inquiries into "their spiritual growth" because the locals usually only care about love, money or job opportunities. sounds to me like we americans are probably possibly getting a bad rap from ourselves as kooky depressed new agers who just want to feel whole in some way, but i like to think that there are many that just realize that there is more to life than what most of us experience daily, and we are lucky we have access to a tribal community that places so much importance on spirit and welcomes us to share in it
 
I think the best and only way to prepare would be to start taking a long, hard look in the mirror. Thats what the trip is gonna amount to, and the more of it you get started with the better your results will be. If you can make yourself cry then you're completely ready.


Edit: This part is sort of useless /, I started typing before your last reply, but I'm gonna leave it in.

Also, realize that you're leaving the world you know in a very real way by taking a trip to a developing country to completely incapacitate yourself on drugs. No one is prepared for that, except maybe someone who has spent many years homeless or in the military. Most of the people won't even be able to understand why you'd do that, I mean, the folk that are dosing you probably understand there are many reasons and don't question it, but people living on a subsistence level see things completely differently than you or I. It's the real world out there, and a far different real world than wherever you access the internet from.
 
DarthMom said:
they seemed surprised at the americans inquiries into "their spiritual growth" because the locals usually only care about love, money or job opportunities.
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This is the point I was trying to get at. Its not only that the locals just care about the three things you listed, but thats all a lot of people can even understand caring about. Then, the fact that you spent thousands of american dollars to do something like ayahuasca just makes their minds recoil.

And I can understand where they're coming from. After countless psychedelic spiritual journies I finally smacked my head and was like "money and personal relationships? Damn! Could it have been so simple?!?!?" and, of course, it is =D
 
Creakle said:
I have a feeling like everyone on this thread has been saying the exact same thing, over and over again. Sorry, but this is an extremely redundant thread.
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Yes, it is, because everyone keeps hijacking Darthmom's thread to tell everyone how dumb they are or disrespectful they are to the ayahuasca "spirit" by doing these retreats. How about this, if youhave a problem with the redundancy of this thread, stop contributing worthlessness to it.

The OP's original question was "I was wondering if any bl'ers had any first hand accounts with these." If you don't have anything meaningful to contribute, leave.

Creakle said:
I don't get why the mods close threads 100 times more relevant than this...
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Your judgement of whether or not this thread is relevant matters not to us. Don't take it personally, though.

Darthmom, if you want me to send this to SO, pm me and let me know. Maybe there will be more intelligent discussion there, although I originally did think we would have it here...

:|
 
How about we rent a hotel room I'll cook up some aya and then we'll vomit and shit everywhere and leave =D

But in all seriousness I think a retreat would be awesome but I'd rather be at a place where I can sit on the toilet with a bucket in peace without some old dude sitting right next to me while projectile shit flys out my ass at the speed of light
 
Yeah, church, I was hoping we would here too.....I don't spend a lot of time in this section.....usually I am floored with respect at the knowledge i read, or floored with disgust at the immaturity showed, but i don't spend a lot of time here, so wasn't sure what to expect in large doses. I will go over to ayahuasca.com for more responses, already been there, but preferred to stay in a community where I have been for a long time. I see now, being new is better than this. I really do want sincerity ffs.

thanks though, guess the lounge really is the sum of it all here, huh? :D

edit, there hasn't been a lot of drama, no worries. creakle was the only annoyance, really.
leave it open, no worries, if anything good comes of it wonderful, if not, we ignore it....
 
The only thing you're getting at is tedium.
 
[sigh]

I like to think I'm pretty fair. I just dont want people derailing threads here, that's all. What's wrong with that?

Okay, guys, back on topic again...
 
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My new inlaws in china were having difficulty remembering my western name so they gave me a chinese one: Ai Hua

how funny is that!
 
There IS a vast difference between a brew made by someone with 10-60 years experience in brewing and giving people ayahuasca, who may have grown the plants themselves and is perhaps using 4-5 other plant admixtures, most of them not known about by any official literature in the west or that we have any idea about what they do and how they work.

And the brew of someone who buys some Syrian Rue and does and extract and chugs down some Mimosa Hostilis Root Bark brew.... who just followed a recipe they got from the web.

Anyone who says otherwise just doesn´t know have the experience to know what they are talking about.

There is no accounting for the effects that people report from Ayahuasca : period. It is not chemically explainable by the presence of the beta carbolines or tryptamines...

Ayahuasca vine itself is a whole big rabbit hole...

I am writing this in Iquitos, and I have been here 5 weeks and 4 weeks last year so I have some idea of what is going on in this area....

Blue Morpho could be a bit "big" at this point and a bit too much of a comfort zone for Americans who read National Geographic... small is beautiful in this field. But, I have always heard good things about them...

There are lots of well known curanderos here in Iquitos who offer sessions, you can pay up to $100 U.S., but more like $50 is a standard price for the more famous well known curanderos... these people know what they are doing and know how to handle all the different types of gringos and what energies they come in with.

Some of them have beautiful, but not pretentious compounds, the people who rock up to these places are all different and are usually pretty cool...

These are the people who operate in the 50 kilometres outside of Iquitos.

All the curanderos mentioned on the conference web site are pretty tried and tested!

http://soga-del-alma.org/ConferenceSite/

I would also mention "sachamama ethnobotical garden" if you really want to go all the way... there brews are the strongest...no doubt the more serious crew in the area. For the average bluelighter, wanting the full dose all the way and back - look no further....

Most all of the motorcycle taxi drivers know where all these people are...

My recommendation, drink with a few of these types of people... that may be enough for one trip, in a couple of weeks...

I´ve been out for a week deep in the jungle on a "dieta" with a 75 year old ayahusacaro who is a master of the admixtures... we paid $35US a day for our guide, the services of the shaman and all food and so on.

You really should know spanish, or it is a bit tricky out here... but one could probably make do... if you are not recommended a shaman, or ayahuascaro, it may be tricky...

There are some very powerful and old ayahuascaros in town who would only charge $7 U.S. for a session...teachers of teachers... and there are such people here who I don´t feel ready to drink with yet!

BUT, just arriving from the plane and finding the right ayahuascaro who lives out in the middle of nowhere in the jungle is tough... you really need to find out what you are looking for... there are a lot who practise black magic and are so caught up in bullshit they can´t see the forrest through the trees.

My advice for this kind of travel, find guides who are independant, cool, non pushy, and ask a lot of different ones who they recommend for drinking ayahuasca way out in the jungle... and just local people in general who they think is good.

The people you are looking for are salt of the earth, look very humble, these are the people who are connected to the true power of the plants...

Watch out! Its a jungle out there!

Also, Alan Shoemaker is a cool guy, he is on Morona 531 in Iquitos, where you can find his wifes travel agency, (she speaks english) and he can give some very clear and steady guidance if he is around.

Around Iquitos, the curandero I would recommend most is Percy Garcia.

He is a young guy, 32 years old, and is a true vegetalista, in that he is a healer with plants for his village...he can give you little bottles of plants for body healing he freshly extracts just for you for $10US.

He runs sessions 50 kilometres out of town and I have travelled deeper with Percy with other curanderos because he has the least ego out of these guys...he is not the slightest into black magic.

his email is: [email protected]

address Putamayo #1710

Percy is the cutting edge I reckon... his brews are the clearest I have ever had, not heavy fine, and pure tryptamine clarity and depth.

He is totally unpretentious, has a wife and a few kids and is one of the hippest dresses I have seen in Iquitos!

Also, Norma Panduro is worth checking out.

Norma is very free and easy about things... she is accused by a lot of others as being into black magic and being too into money...don´t believe it. She is a very cool woman... her brews are very vine heavy... you will need 2-3 cups to get visionary, but the effects the brew can be very blissful and healing in deep ways. She encourages people to sing and express themselves.

Again, I believe Norma is also on the cutting edge of evolution in this area.

Guillermo Arévalo is reknowned for his full power brews and curandismo powers... his compound is fantastic and he has become a bit of a star for good reason, and has been in a french big budger psychedelic western called "blueberry" as the shaman and also Jan Kounen´s doco "other worlds", which should be on DVD soon.

http://otherworlds.jankounen.com/eng/lefilm/partie_dossierpresse.html

Also, if you are in Cuzco, (where Macchu Picchu is near), check out a youngish american fellow called Kevin Furnas, he holds some of the best groups i have ever been to and he doesn´t charge anything, only by donation, but unless if you are not a tight arsed moron, you should give him at least $20 U.S.!

[email protected]

Again, Kevin is on the cutting edge of this work and is a profound spiritual healer in sessions...

Even though these people are well known, you won´t be finding crowds of people lining up to be drinking ayahuasca with these people... it would probably be less than half a dozen people drinking...it could be just you or you and your friend....

On the other hand, I believe that one can likely go the most deeply into this by learning to brew up at home with ayahuasca and psychotria viridis... but if you are really serious about this... it would be foolish to ignore what many different and varied people have been doing in the amazon... which is a huge place, and often difficult to acccess. The peruvian amazon is a good place to start I would say...and Iquitios and also Pucallpa are the most common gateway towns from which to explore it.


Julian.
 
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