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Australians on Drugs doco

Yup, that was me and drplatypus. Any thoughts from you all about the doco?

It was a tough gig in terms of the format, trying to get a word in, and there were definitely times where I wanted to contribute but couldn't jump in. I was probably a bit too polite!
 
I feel like this was a step in the right direction, and it was nice to see a diverse range of opinions represented.

It does kind of annoy me to see Tony Wood anywhere near this debate in 2015. I understand why he has the views he does, but he is not open to reason, and is not an otherwise informed individual on this issue. I really don't see how losing a daughter 20 years ago should make him some kind of authority on drugs policy, especially when he seems absolutely unwilling to concede that the prohibition of drugs could have been a factor in his daughters death. I also find it pretty disingenuous for him to present the fact what Anna took was pure MDMA, without mention of the fact that what actually killed her was water intoxication.

I am always a little bit disappointed by the attitudes of the drug users they manage to get on to these programs. I wish I could honestly say I felt this was bias from the media, but to be honest it does tend to reflect a lot of the attitudes you encounter out there. I just think it is unfortunate that these drug users only seem to know how to talk about their own anecdotal experiences, and believe that amounts to a compelling pro drug argument. It would be much better if they were equipped with some facts and statistics so they could mount an effective argument, because as it stands I think some of them are reinforcing negative stereotypes in a lot of peoples minds. That chick boasting about making money off selling pills was definitely not a good look.

Tronica it is no surprise you struggled to get a word in. It irritated me that when the host finally invited you to give an opinion, he ended up cutting you off halfway through what you were saying to ask that idiot politician his opinion. The format was pretty erratic, I noticed a couple times the host would try and go to a particular person for their opinion, and someone else would just cut right in instead. The host was not very assertive about maintaining order, which at times I think prevented some relevant points getting made.

Nonetheless, you and Dr Platypus were both great. I am glad that we have intelligent people who are willing to go out in the mainstream and represent the voice of reason on this issue. :)
 
Thanks drug_mentor.

One of the obvious problems with this kind of thing is that the type of person willing to put themselves on camera and talk about their drug use does not represent the full spectrum of people who use drugs, especially since the folks who work in professions where outing themselves as recreational drug users isn't viable just won't be agreeing to do something like this.

I got to have chats before and after with some of the 'drug users' and most actually seemed articulate and thoughtful, if not a bit immature, but I think that was more their age than anything else.

The sense of injustice about the world and the notion of doing drugs because they are 'naughty' - both of these rationales/motivations are more common among 'emerging adults' who want to say 'F you' to the system and to authority. Yet by focusing on that, I noticed in the Twitter feed that a lot of people saw this reasoning as 'privileged' like these kids didn't know how good they had it, and they should get over themselves. Yet I remember distinctly feeling like this as a 20-something too. You want to branch out and do something for yourself, and the allure of something that the adults say is off limits, well, that is appealing!

Hopefully we can at least keep a conversation going about drugs in Australia... with medicinal cannabis issues seeming to be breaking through in NSW and Vic, and UNGASS in 2016, there may be a window from drug policy reform opening.
 
I have mixed feelings about Tom Tilly and his approach to the issue or maybe its his handlers/writers points coming through. The ABC is an arm of the government after all. The attitudes of the police rep and the member of Parliament were predictably disappointing. Also the editors could definitely have left out the tactical chunder references (Personally I've only ever heard this used in alcohol culture never with regard to MDMA)

Its good that it's being talked about and that a few sane contributors like Monica and David were challenging the current paradigm.

Personally I would have loved to have seen some successful recreational drug users represented but apart from artists and musicians it seems that the stigma probably would keep some away. Or maybe they just wanted to perpetuate the dichotomy that drugs are a thing for the young and reckless and will end in ruin. I think they had one older raver in the intro part with the iphone framing.
 
I enjoyed this live, the inexperience of some of the "drug users" represented really......annoyed me lol,

-bl4ckc0de
 
Ten years ago, we - as in Bluelight Australian Drug Discussion - produced an anonymised written piece as a submission to an inquiry about drug use in Australia. I collated the stories of people who posted them in a Bluelight thread. The 17 stories represented the kinds of people that weren't on the program this week. But they could do so because of anonymity.

Until we are at a point where the anonymity is not required, we can't present those stories well for TV.

Interestingly, there is this organisation from US called Green Flower who are doing just that but only for cannabis. I guess this fits with the changing status of cannabis in some parts of the the US. People are making videos of themselves and talking about their pot use, the good and the bad, but mainly the good! They are 'coming out'.

Maybe one day we can all 'come out' without fear of persecution, and I think that action will go along way to changing the climate of stigma, misunderstanding, judgement, etc.

Check this out: http://greenflowermedia.com/
 
I felt quite frustrated watching that group of kids racking up lines of ecstasy, and then trying to correlate this with our frustration with the incumbent government. As a representative of the Gen Y, i really cringed because supporting harm reduction, regulation etc.. this is the worst way for a catalyst to a deeper, more serious discussion of a regulation model.

The 'fuck the system' approach doesn't work, we need to show that the average joe, yes, middle class, not counter culture, are caught up in this typhoon of drug legislation. Everyone is the loser.

However, i like the discussion of alternatives like meditation, hiking etc that do inherently alter your consciousness. In a sense, saying that you can get high on life too.

Also, bringing up the social exclusion of non drinkers is a serious one in australia.
 
I used to know the Woods when I was a teenager - Anna was a good friend of my ex. I saw them speak at an event a few years after Anna's death and I was disgusted. They branded her close friends as 'bad influence junkies' who all but forced their innocent daughter to take evil drugs. No mention of the fact that harm reduction services at underage dance parties had recently been shut down due to political pressure.
 
smokedup said:
The 'fuck the system' approach doesn't work, we need to show that the average joe, yes, middle class, not counter culture, are caught up in this typhoon of drug legislation. Everyone is the loser.
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True - everyone loses; except the forces of repression (law enforcement, fear mongers, conservative political interests [mainstream media included])

smokedup said:
Also, bringing up the social exclusion of non drinkers is a serious one in australia.
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This is such an important point. Alcohol is one of the most damaging drugs in society. But how many advertisements do you see for alcohol and the people who sell it everywhere you look - from sports games to the 6pm news to every daily fucking rag newspaper in the country?!
Alcoholism is deadly and extremely endemic - but money is power in politics media and advocacy.

I admit that i havent watched this program yet - but hearing that you were involved, tronica - i must check it out.
You do great work - so many people here do - but regarding HR message, it has dawned on me recently how far we have to go here in australia. Or perhaps, how far we (collectively) have slipped from promising beginnings 20+ years ago, when australia led the way in implementing needle exchange programs and such.
 
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yeah, alcohol seems to have its own gravitational pull socially here in oz.

Ive been sucked into it a little unfortunately. Binge drinking tons on weekends as a teenager has left me with a massive urge to drink when i knock off, and an urge to smash tons.

Aside from lifestyle factors, i think the fact i never progressed to spirits and only drank half decent beer/wine, has minimised the impact on my health, to a degree. My Czech side always told us that beer and wine is considered 'food', and therefore is taxed less because of this interpretation. You can drink it at 16, while hard liquor is 18.

They laugh and take pity on our handling of alcohol. When i was there, you can ride the train and openly drink pretty much, walking to and from events, festivals etc. I was actually surprised. Even the train stations had liquor, and gyms, as well as cigarette machines.

sadly,I believe the issue is that the drink isnt for us. We cant competently regulate and consume alcohol like the developed nations of europe can. Basically, they can handle their piss better than us. This is coming from all aspects: economic/social/moral.

This is why Im jumpin up and down, screaming from my sofa, for cannabis reform here! Bring the love back to Aussie streets, for goodness sake. show whats good for them, void of one punch assaults and pathetic domestic violence cases. we are a diverse island, The good sun is rich and pure. Ozone free;) Harness this great brown lands gifts.

My vision of future aus would be:Go solar, cut ties with oil/gas/coal tycoons from middle east/africa. Use that power grow and Legalise pot. Cut ties with tobacco/alcohol lobbyists,marketing. Cheapen price of beer/wine, with hard liquor being classed entirely differently in the alcohol code, to beer/wine. Offer subsidised counselling to problem drinkers/smoker/other.
 
Tronica said:
Ten years ago, we - as in Bluelight Australian Drug Discussion - produced an anonymised written piece as a submission to an inquiry about drug use in Australia. I collated the stories of people who posted them in a Bluelight thread. The 17 stories represented the kinds of people that weren't on the program this week. But they could do so because of anonymity.
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This is ringing some bells for me do you have a link or a copy? Would love to read it!

Sorry you didn't get much of a chance to voice your opinion what I heard from you sounded legit but it seemed like they had other agendas. I might have to watch it again when I get a chance.
 
I think the program achieved it's mission statement - get a variety of perspectives on the topic.

Of course, these things never seem long enough, but at least they're happening! More!
 
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Without knowing who was who in this debate, the most interesting an articulate speaker was David and it frustrated me that he was constantly spoken over.. I then realised this was you Tronica. Thanks for appearing on the debate, it was cringe-worthy to listen to some opinions here.. as you said in regards to the 'drug users' their views were perhaps more reflective of their age.

Im quite happy that Portugal was brought up, i've traveled there a couple of times in the last five years and although i can't compare it to where it was pre-2001 as i hadn't visited at that time i have been able to witness something unique in one of the festivals that is held near Lake Idanha-a-nova; attending last year were up to 50,000 people over the span of 7 days.. during this there was no police presence, there was of course security but with the decriminalization of drug use there was a very open acceptance of drug use which also aligned with the principle of the festival. People were not afraid to openly use drugs and this created an entirely different atmosphere, it completely eliminated the paranoia associated with drug use and as a result, there were no incidents involving people taking too much or arrests, violence. And this was 50,000 people in one space over one week.. to be fair the festival itself attracted a particular type of individual and drug use, but to me it still stood as an example.

The only part of the debate i wish had been brought up was psychedelic drug use and the actual documented benefits of those substances. However i understand that the host wanted the emphasis to be focused on 'party drugs' and in particular Cannabis and MDMA.
 
Tronica said:
Thanks drug_mentor.

One of the obvious problems with this kind of thing is that the type of person willing to put themselves on camera and talk about their drug use does not represent the full spectrum of people who use drugs, especially since the folks who work in professions where outing themselves as recreational drug users isn't viable just won't be agreeing to do something like this.
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Yep, I found that to be one of the biggest problems with the program and I think it would alienate any of the 'older' or more conservative viewers from taking the side of the drug users. I think about my own social circle, all in their late 20's and early 30's. Most of them still use drugs. All of us have degrees and decent professional jobs. However, for any of us to ever go on TV and to speak about our drug use would mean we would probably get fired or at least it would be quite detrimental to our careers. That is really unfortunate, as then we really only get the young uni student types or those involved in counter cultures which blends more into some of the more negative stereotypes. The recovering meth addict guy I found to be pretty obnoxious. I think he could have made much better points but he seemed to get carried away with just attacking his opponents. All in all, it would have been nicer to see some more informed, mature and articulate people represent those who use drugs. However, as I said, those types of people are far less likely to come forward as they have a lot more to lose.

Monica and David I thought both of you did excellent jobs in speaking in a persuasive and informed manner. It was disappointing to that both of you were often cut off when you were making salient points. The Liberal Gov mouthpiece was particularly obnoxious but as sad as it is, he said and behaved exactly as one would expect. I thought the drug squad detective was a bit better and more reasonable. However, obviously he is going to tow the line of the police and the government. It would be interesting to know what his personal thoughts were on the matter. Surely he must see the damage caused by prohibition and the futility of it.

As for Tony Wood, yes his inclusion was unfortunate. I can completely understand why he holds the views that he does and I do think that he was pretty respectful to all those involved.
 
god damn that fucking annoying. That pollie and that stupid cop. The amount of bullshit facts and stats they spewed out was disgusting.
 
SuperHans68 said:
god damn that fucking annoying. That pollie and that stupid cop. The amount of bullshit facts and stats they spewed out was disgusting.
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yeah, such smug expressions as well!!

Otherwise, I enjoyed the documentary.

Dr Caldicott was great, as were the other health professionals.

It IS a shame that the 'users' on the show were your sort of stereotypical party going drug takers, as I feel this is not an accurate representation. I know a lot of high functioning takers.. but as others have mentioned.. it's not something people can/are willing to expose

I agree with what one of the health professionals was saying about the supportive attitude of party goers.

I've been to many doofs and festivals, and the people there do have your back.
I'm not just talking my own mates, but random crews, people you meet, they look our for you.
And it's not just when it comes to substances (e.g., if someone had a bad trip/mixed downers/was sick etc), it's people's attitude in general towards fostering a supportive environment.
I've locked my keys in my car, had a flat car battery, got my car bogged.. and i was blown away by the number of randoms who offered help and assistance (even though the people who were helping to try to break into my car were probably ex crims haha)..
But yeah, I've never known anyone to be in a difficult situation, where friends would just abandon them, as Anna's father was pushing for people to believe... you know, that ancient mentality that all drug takers are just high mofo's with no ability/care to help a friend in need..

aneeway... good work generating discussion
 
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