Amphetamine - Retrospective - Price of the Blast

[Snowy_Hell]

First off, this could be a trip report but is also a bit of a rant, so beware.
Here's some relevant musical background available:


So In the past, I was doing massive amounts of amphetamines, including MDMA, and was taking it relatively well physically, but not at all psychically. Regardless, compulsive devil inside me found a way to justify every binge with noble causes like, getting a job, and working for a single day carrying building site's waste. But every noble start ended up with debauchery to say the least, and it would go on for a week, and back then, I could actually sleep about 4 hours at the end of the week, then next day, I could sleep for longer until some 3rd or 4th day I'd sleep for 16 or recently, 27 hours though that was after 3 days of wanking and workouts, 400mg Promazine, 60mg Flurazepam, 10mg Zyprexa, 1 daily dose of B-vitamin complex, 3mg melatonin and a ton of fat weed with a big, 2.5 dL ceramic mug of red wine sweetened with a teaspoon of sugar. So i could both take it, and enjoy it more than anything I can today, two years later. Years that seem to have passed as quickly as days would. Whenever I'd experience the slow-down, the depressive parts of my schizoaffective disorder, there would be a noble cause involving speed. Then binging, and good parts of experience on speed quickly vanished, leaving me just with ability to wank for a week. But that was enough to trick my reason from recognising catastrophic realities of my past and present life, with terror of the future as only available feeling, if you can call it that, because it is just a hole where hope should be. So, dangers of neurotoxicity and pains of acute withdrawal weren't of the issue. I once got carried away by a dog porn (that's where hypersexuality led me) that I've snorted 5g in 8 hours, making my gingiva white, and dick microscopic. I'd wear away my lips with toothpicks. Waxy-white skin with red spots and acne, around crazed eyes, deep in the craters of black under-eyes. Oily sweat like thousand diamonds on my face.
However, I've taxed my brain to the max, having about an hour ago, a "slip of the reality" as I'll explain onward. So I've fucked my brain enough for it to lose the grip over elementary impulses. Fear is the most powerful, anger follows. I just have to do entheogens instead, for a year, at least. Eat some fine Russian nootropics. I think that I'am finally in a phase where I cannot do more speed and not go schizophrenic permanently. Today, I've intra-nasally done about 250mg of speed in the noon, then got wasted on weird weed, then did another 300mg of speed, then reality became elusive the way thoughts can wonder off. I got lost in perception, fighting my way through darker areas of streets like through a maze, as every darker visual area became said maze of all remembered sensations, reassembled as fear and lust commanded them to do. Very tempting and attention-stealing. Also, easily horrifying, making me tune up the music from presented links, for its focusing properties. Now that I stare at the bright screen, I can focus. Anyway, good bye, speed. It's been nice, but this is the end of the line, lights are turning off, music stops, everyone is gone. Expensive party, but what a ride!
Thanks for your time.

Tagged by Xorkoth
substancecode_amphetamine
substancecode_amphetamines
substancecode_stimulants
explevel_experienced
explevel_retrospective
exptype_negative
exptype_healthissues
exptype_addiction
roacode_nasal

 

[KS78]

What you experienced could be caused solely by the music that you listen to.

I once got carried away by a dog porn (that's where hypersexuality led me)

I think this is quite different than the hypersexuality that many of us experienced.

 

[Snowy_Hell]

What you experienced could be caused solely by the music that you listen to.


I think this is quite different than the hypersexuality that many of us experienced.

:D good one about the music, sped-up Lebanese turbo-folk isn't the healthiest musical diet for sure. About hypersexuality, I've just got jaded, looking for ever weirder shit to get me off while high on speed.

 

[Xorkoth]

I think this qualifies enough as trip report so I'll change the title and tag it and keep it.

I k now the feeling about justifying stim use (drug use in general but stims are the one that I have the hardest time with justifying ever since I got off opiates, which were worse). I just try not to keep them around, I only rarely let myself buy them. But propylhexedrine is available at the grocery store I like it pretty well so I end up doing it more than I should, but I am able to prevent myself from doing it binge-style.

The thing about stimulants is that there is a really bad cost that they extract from you, health-wise, both physically and mentally. It's really not good at all to binge on them. But hard to resist at the same time.

 

[Snowy_Hell]

I think this qualifies enough as trip report so I'll change the title and tag it and keep it.
The thing about stimulants is that there is a really bad cost that they extract from you, health-wise, both physically and mentally. It's really not good at all to binge on them. But hard to resist at the same time.

Totally agree.

 

[Zonxx]

I think this qualifies enough as trip report so I'll change the title and tag it and keep it.

I k now the feeling about justifying stim use (drug use in general but stims are the one that I have the hardest time with justifying ever since I got off opiates, which were worse). I just try not to keep them around, I only rarely let myself buy them. But propylhexedrine is available at the grocery store I like it pretty well so I end up doing it more than I should, but I am able to prevent myself from doing it binge-style.

The thing about stimulants is that there is a really bad cost that they extract from you, health-wise, both physically and mentally. It's really not good at all to binge on them. But hard to resist at the same time.

the key is to take care of the soul and body while indulging, atleast that's my key, and to never overlook how powerful stimulants are, ofcourse i have opiates that allow me to push further than i would be able to without but, even then amphetamines in my opinion, being a heavy user of them aswell as rock cocaine, are the worse devil are easier to binge on, because they'll release dopamine until you're completely out of it and can go until you physically can't handle more especially with meth, having such a great feel to it, i almost say i can prefer meth to crack, but then again the long-drawn out comedowns without somthing else to bring you down is just rough, where i have not a single problem coming down from crack just issues sleeping after a binge which i'll always use a benzo for but people think less of amphetamine just because its prescribed, it shouldn't be regarded as lesser to crack or meth, afterall, meth turns right into normal d-amp pretty quickly after it crosses the BBB just alittle better and quicker, one needs to be mindful of what one consumes and aware of oneself especially binging on stims.

 

[Xorkoth]

afterall, meth turns right into normal d-amp pretty quickly after it crosses the BBB just alittle better and quicker

I don't think this is true, as meth has serotonergic effects that d-amp does not have. Unless it metabolizes to d-amp eventually, after producing its own unique effects.

 

[Zonxx]

I don't think this is true, as meth has serotonergic effects that d-amp does not have. Unless it metabolizes to d-amp eventually, after producing its own unique effects.

addy has serotoninergic effects aswell, but the effects as far as ive experienced (half grams+/day for several day benders) isn't all too much, perhaps alittle more with meth than addy aswell as the effects would be more pronounced as the only difference between amphetamine and methamp is that the small chemical addition of the methyl carbon allows it to cross the BBB much quicker than amphetamine, where amphetamine no matter the dose you take only so much can cross at once (this does not go to say that 240mg won't hit you harder than 120 because it certainly will but it wouldn't be comparable to the equivilent of meth) the only negative serotonin experience i've ever had was from tramadol albeit i took a hefty dose of it thinking fuck it because they were leftover painkillers that my doc rx'd to me to give to my dog who was having rear leg issues which inturn is how i ended up with chronic pain because i was carrying my 120lb dog up and down 4 flights of stairs 3 times a day but id do it again

Unless it metabolizes to d-amp eventually,

D-amp is d-amp, vyvsanse metabolises into it, methamphetamine as soon as it crosses the BBB is extroardinarily quickly metabolized by the body into d-amp, and then you have active d-amp to begin with which after everything i've tried is the most consistent substance to start with, slightly less recreational or euphoric than meth but is much more sustainable than its counterpart (even if 25% of what the amps i'm consuming on a regular basis is racemic l-amp, d-amp is the majority of my experience) but i've been told dexedrine is a much cleaner buzz but lacks the kick that one would take amphetamines for so there's that, suppose some racemic component is needed for a solid recreational experience with amps

 

[Zonxx]

you have to know that its not so much the use or binging of the drug that would have a negative impact, its the amount of redoses aswell as how close together they are that have the most profound impact on an amphetamine experience, i've perfected this timing down to about every 1hr30-3hrs depending on the initial dose (but, as a rule and perhaps this is what differs in my amp usage is that, after my initial dose be it 120, 240, whatever is nessesary on that particular day, the redoses are to maintain the initial effects and i never need to take the same initial dose for atleast a minimum of 12-24hours usually after a days past, the 60mg redoses tend not to do it and thats when i know its fine for myself to take a larger kick otherwise its best to play it safe, ive said it once before that with amphetamine having such a long duration of action, you have to be extremely mindful that each dose will last 6-8 hours (usually at full strength for 2-4 hours before winding down) which is why compulsive redosing typically ends with a negative experience or hard comedowns, dehydration or overdose, i've had a few actual amphetamine overdoses which i wasn't aware i was having at the time which i always dealt with by using other substances to counter the amphetamines, typically opiates or a gabapentinoid (the speedball danger is entirely a myth or id be dead right now, but i have a cardinal rule when it comes to uppers and downers is that, the downer should not be taken too close to the upper and vice versa because its this that plays games with the sympathetic nervous system and leads it not knowing how to react resulting in stroke, cardiac arrest etc.
i know sometimes drugs are fun n games, but i've always explained that anyone taking somthing should know the game theyre playing and the rules before they jump in for a full deck instead of a handful of cards

 

[Xorkoth]

According to the wiki on methamphetamine:

Following oral administration, methamphetamine is well-absorbed into the bloodstream, with peak plasma methamphetamine concentrations achieved in approximately 3.13–6.3 hours post ingestion.[113] Methamphetamine is also well absorbed following inhalation and following intranasal administration.[8] Due to the high lipophilicity of methamphetamine, it can readily move through the blood–brain barrier faster than other stimulants, where it is more resistant to degradation by monoamine oxidase.[8][113] The amphetamine metabolite peaks at 10–24 hours.[8] Methamphetamine is excreted by the kidneys, with the rate of excretion into the urine heavily influenced by urinary pH.[23][113] When taken orally, 30–54% of the dose is excreted in urine as methamphetamine and 10–23% as amphetamine.[113] Following IV doses, about 45% is excreted as methamphetamine and 7% as amphetamine.[113] The half-life of methamphetamine is variable with a range of 5–30 hours.[8]

It appears only some of it is converted into amphetamine, and even then it doesn't specify d-amp. Pure d-amp is almost purely dopaminergic in effects, though racemic (Adderall) has some additional active sites.

Here is what methamphetamine does in your brain:

Methamphetamine has been identified as a potent full agonist of trace amine-associated receptor 1 (TAAR1), a G protein-coupled receptor (GPCR) that regulates brain catecholamine systems.[97][98] Activation of TAAR1 increases cyclic adenosine monophosphate (cAMP) production and either completely inhibits or reverses the transport direction of the dopamine transporter (DAT), norepinephrine transporter (NET), and serotonin transporter (SERT).[97][99] When methamphetamine binds to TAAR1, it triggers transporter phosphorylation via protein kinase A (PKA) and protein kinase C (PKC) signaling, ultimately resulting in the internalization or reverse function of monoamine transporters.[97][100] Methamphetamine is also known to increase intracellular calcium, an effect which is associated with DAT phosphorylation through a Ca2+/calmodulin-dependent protein kinase (CAMK)-dependent signaling pathway, in turn producing dopamine efflux.[101][102][103] TAAR1 also has been shown to reduce the firing rate of neurons through direct activation of G protein-coupled inwardly-rectifying potassium channels.[104][105][106] TAAR1 activation by methamphetamine in astrocytes appears to negatively modulate the membrane expression and function of EAAT2, a type of glutamate transporter.[41]

Whereas here is what amphetamine does in your brain:

Amphetamine and its enantiomers have been identified as potent full agonists of trace amine-associated receptor 1 (TAAR1), a GPCR, discovered in 2001, that is important for regulation of monoaminergic systems in the brain.[145][146] Activation of TAAR1 increases cAMP production via adenylyl cyclase activation and inhibits the function of the dopamine transporter, norepinephrine transporter, and serotonin transporter, as well as inducing the release of these monoamine neurotransmitters (effluxion).[20][145][147] Amphetamine enantiomers are also substrates for a specific neuronal synaptic vesicle uptake transporter called VMAT2.[21] When amphetamine is taken up by VMAT2, the vesicle releases (effluxes) dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin, among other monoamines, into the cytosol in exchange.[21]

Dextroamphetamine (the dextrorotary enantiomer) and levoamphetamine (the levorotary enantiomer) have identical pharmacodynamics, but their binding affinities to their biomolecular targets vary.[146][148] Dextroamphetamine is a more potent agonist of TAAR1 than levoamphetamine.[146] Consequently, dextroamphetamine produces roughly three to four times more central nervous system (CNS) stimulation than levoamphetamine;[146][148] however, levoamphetamine has slightly greater cardiovascular and peripheral effects.[148]

So a lot of the same stuff but meth has some significant differences, and is a much stronger serotonin ligand. But the main point of this post is to show you that methamphetamine does not, in fact, convert to d-amp almost immediately upon crossing the BBB. It is a completely different drug that is mostly excreted unchanged in the urine, with a modest percentage converted into regular amphetamine over time.

 

[Zonxx]

According to the wiki on methamphetamine:



It appears only some of it is converted into amphetamine, and even then it doesn't specify d-amp. Pure d-amp is almost purely dopaminergic in effects, though racemic (Adderall) has some additional active sites.

Here is what methamphetamine does in your brain:



Whereas here is what amphetamine does in your brain:



So a lot of the same stuff but meth has some significant differences, and is a much stronger serotonin ligand. But the main point of this post is to show you that methamphetamine does not, in fact, convert to d-amp almost immediately upon crossing the BBB. It is a completely different drug that is mostly excreted unchanged in the urine, with a modest percentage converted into regular amphetamine over time.

im going to tell you somthing you probably aren't aware of m8, there are also two types of methamphetamine. L and D respectively the exact same as the two of amphetamine. most meth sold is D-amph while the shittier batches can contain a percentage of a racemic l-methylamphetamine but for the most part what you want with meth is d, and the reason that d-meth is so effective on its own is not due to the dextroamphetamine anantiomer, but more related to its ability to traverse the blood brain barrier much more effective aswell at a much higher rate than that of amphetamine. wiki doesn't teach you everything and i can tell you i have considerable experience aswell as deep-knowledge from extensive research on the topic, mainly because i wanted to learn about what i was heavily ingesting and because amphetamines ofcourse provided the motivation to learn about said topic.

Meth is exactly as amphetamine is, l and d, while crystal is the most preffered form of it, i prefer the hydrochloride form because i just prefer sublingually /orally administering amphetamines, on the plus the down isn't nearly as bad if you don't smoke it which should be a given but i infact wouldn't put a smoked meth comedown in the same game as taking it SL or snorting it or simply popping em'

 

[Zonxx]

also upon ingestion of methamphetamine, it quickly reverts to its un methylated form, 85-90% of the time being D-amp. i'm not trying to prove i know more but i'm trying to enlighten you pertaining to amphetamines because you clearly don't have the same experience i do with the drug which is not boasting but just a fact, and even if i'm incorrect, my facts are still valid, go ahead and ask Nicomorphinist if you will, i'm sure he'll confirm my statements

 

[Xorkoth]

I know about meth having both entaniomers. But I have never seen anything to suggest that 85-90% of methamphetamine demethylates upon ingestion. Wiki says otherwise as does anything else I've ever read about it.

The crystal form IS hydrochloride, it's just hydrochloride that's been crystallized.

In America pretty much all the meth is pure D-meth because of the synthesis routes used over here, D-meth is the only form that will result (impurities from a bad synth would include other substances or leftover reagents, not L-meth).

Here's a research paper stating that only 5-7% is demethylated and that 30-40% of MA is excreted at he end of its entire length of action unchanged:

Experiments on the disposition and fate of AM (amphetamine) and MA (methamphetamine) in the body verifies that 30–40% of the ingested dose is excreted unchanged in the urine (9, 10). Other studies show that approximately 5–7% of MA undergoes N-demethylation to AM as the primary metabolite

Concentration Ratios of Methamphetamine to Amphetamine in Blood Can Help to Distinguish Use of Methamphetamine from Various Mixtures of the Two Stimulants

Abstract. Using a forensic toxicology database, the authors investigated cases of driving under the influence of drugs (DUID) if methamphetamine (MA) was i

academic.oup.com

I'm not trying to argue about it either but I just like to get to the bottom of things and make sure people are reading correct information.

 

[Nicomorphinist]

By the terms amphetamine and methamphetamine, the racaemic salts mixture is meant, correct? Therefore, dextroamphetamine and dextromethamphetamine will be formed proportion to the enantiomer ratio in the drug taken -- 100 per cent in Shabu, 50 percent with variability in Bennies, and 0 per cent in Vicks inhalers. I believe nearly all enantiomer separation is done with solvent extractions, acid-base reactions, and the like. Enantiomer manufacturing is done in most of all cases by starting with dextro or levo forms and it carries through the process and I don't think I have heard of a dextro drug being made into a levo one in vivo or in vitro. The process would be incredibly difficult I would think.

There are I believe at least four metabolic paths involved here in addition to unchanged Crank being excreted. turning it into amphetamine, ephedrine, phenylacetone, benzoic acid . . . Crank is d,l-amphetamine, and the enantiomer ratio will govern how much. Shabu is pure dextromethamphetamine and is metabolised to dextroamphetamine, of course, and Bennies will be 50 per cent or whatever the ratio was in the orignal drug. A measure of the difference in the enantiomers is comparing Vicks inhalers, available OTC in many places with Shabu, which is apparently more reinforcing than anything else in animal tests and is considerably more The dextro isomers have different and more prominent effects, as has been said above. If I am not mistaken, amphetamines, substituted amphetamines like MDA, methylphenidate, cathinone all exhibit this kind of optical isomerism.

About 6-9 per cent of Crank is excreted as amphetamine v 35-50+ per cent as unchanged drug.

Like methadone, the excretion of the amphetamines is influenced by urinary pH, so lemon juice down the hatch to get rid of it, sodium bicarbonate to slow it down.