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US Events Actor Jussie Smollett faces new disorderly conduct charges in alleged fake attack

So we need zero evidence to believe him, but how much evidence do you need to accept that this is a hoax? Does anyone here still believe him?

he forgot about it also demonizing white trump supporters and making them appear as violent racists...
So you agree with my point re: Smollett then? That's good.
I wouldn't try to be smart with me it never works (what Roseanne said wasn't even racist - there you go again completely ignoring intent, context and nuance in order to push your agenda/narrative. Also Roseanne is Jewish not white).

It was interesting/alarming to see the instant polarization along idealogical lines before anything was known, however. People were like "it's obviously a fake, fuck that guy", or "it's obviously a hate crime, fuck you for jumping to conclusions" (that was me).
The stereotypical details and ridiculousness of the attack made me doubt it the instant I heard it. Nothing to do with ideology, just common sense and I guess my BS-detector is finely-tuned.

TheLoveBandit said:
First, how many have been falsely raised as of late?
To answer your question, yes Smollett should face the same punishment as his alleged "attackers" would have. Throwing the book at him will also deter future race-baiters. I remember some Libs saying that whoever perpetrated this attack against Smollett should receive the maximum punishment under the law. Give them what they want.

A short history of super racist and violent Trump supporters:

-Right after Donald Trump?s election, the SPLC really stoked panic. A pro-gay Episcopal church in Indiana was vandalized w/?Heil Trump,? a swastika, & an anti-gay slur. Turns out it was the gay organ player who did it. He was only charged w/a misdemeanor.

-Days after the Pittsburgh massacre, Trump supporters were blamed for Nazi vandalism at a Brooklyn synagogue & fires in a Jewish community. Turns out the perpetrator was a gay black man who had worked with city council on an initiative to fight hate crimes.

-One week before the presidential election, a black church in Mississippi was burned in an arson attack. ?Vote Trump? was written on the building. After much panic, an investigation revealed that the man responsible was a church member.

-In Nov 2016 a Muslim student at the University of Louisiana said two white racist Trump supporters brutally assaulted her, ripped off her hijab, & robbed her. The story went viral. It was a lie. Media never identified her by name after hoax was revealed.

-I remember that Trump & his supporters were blamed for a spate of anti-Semitic, KKK & Nazi graffiti on the campus of Nassau Community College in Long Island in late 2016. The student responsible was Jasskirat Saini

-In Dec 2016 a Muslim woman said she was attacked by 3 white Trump supporters in NYC on the subway. She said they tried to rip off her hijab. Yasmin Seweid lied. CAIR said Muslims are under tremendous ?stress & pressure? resulting in incidents like this.

-In Sep. 2018 a black woman in Long Island said Trump supporters confronted her & told her ?she didn?t belong here.? Her car tire was slashed the next day & a hateful note was left behind saying ?go home.? Adwoa Lewis made up the whole story

-In Nov 2018 students at Goucher College demanded social justice training & safe spaces after racist, Nazi, & KKK graffiti was found on campus. Someone even wrote the names of black students. Trump was blamed. Fynn Arthur, a black student, was responsible.

-In 2017 @StOlaf College was roiled by mass protests in response to anti-black notes found across campus. Class was cancelled & admin caved to demands. An investigation found that Samantha Wells, a black victim of one of the notes, fabricated the incident.

-In Nov 2016 a Philadelphia neighborhood was rattled when property was vandalized with pro-Trump and anti-black messages. William Tucker was identified as the vandal through CCTV footage.

-In Nov 2016 a black female student at @VillanovaU in PA said a group of white men yelling "Trump!" knocked her to the ground on campus. However a police & university investigation was halted because the student didn't want to pursue the matter.

-In Nov 2017 near @KState University, a black man's car was vandalized with racist messages. Class was cancelled & students held demonstrations. Dauntarius Williams later admitted to police that he did it himself. Police did not charge him.

-In autumn 2018 at @KState U, a note was left on an apartment that read "Beware n***ers live here! Knock at your own risk." The "victim" admitted to police that s/he did it himself. This was the 2nd time s/he had fabricated a hate incident in 2 years.

-Miss. black church fire was called a hate crime. Now parishioner has been arrested for it.
 
I don't believe in putting non violent offenders in prison as a general principle. So if this is indeed a hoax, I'm not gonna support any punishment beyond a fine or community service.

If you ask me, violent people should get sent to jail, nobody else.

So we need zero evidence to believe him, but how much evidence do you need to accept that this is a hoax? Does anyone here still believe him?

Correct. I'll believe it with no solid evidence.

But yes, I am starting to have serious doubts in light of more recent revelations.
 
I think there's a difference between being open to what someone is saying and treating it fairly/investigating it objectively - as opposed to completely believing someone because it adheres to one's ideology.

Tim Pool - Jussie Smollet and The Rise of HOAX Hate Crimes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2eBSiv3UB4
 
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Also Roseanne is Jewish not white).


Are Jews White?

lead_720_405.jpg


Trump's election has reopened questions that have long seemed settled in America?including the acceptability of open discrimination against minority groups.

...no matter how much prestige Jews may amass, their status is always ambiguous. ?White? is not a skin color, but a category marking power. American Jews do have power, but they are also often viewed with suspicion; and having power is no assurance of protection. According to the FBI?s hate-crime statistics, a majority of religiously motivated hate-crime offenses are committed against Jews each year. This has been the case every year since the FBI first began reporting hate-crime statistics in 1995, when more than 80 percent of religiously motivated crimes were against Jews. These days, that percentage is closer to 50 percent?a sign not that Jews are safer, but that other groups have been increasingly targeted.


?It?s not that unprecedented that groups of disillusioned, disaffected populations of workers ? lash out and use Jews as a scapegoat for problems that are really caused by a quickly changing society,? said Goldstein. ?It is instructive to know that Jews have been in situations in which they were integrated and had status, and that hasn?t necessarily protected them. Sometimes, it makes them vulnerable.?


?Are Jews white?? is another way of asking, ?Are Jews safe, in this unknown future that is to come?? To some, it seems unthinkable that they would not be. To others, it seems unthinkable that they would.


tl;dr yes they are

Edit: My tl;dr was somewhat tongue in cheek, which was clearly a mistake.

This article is very nuanced and puts forward the idea that some do not consider Jews to be white -- or certain Jews to be white -- points which this article addresses, as shown in the excerpt I selected.

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When I first posted this article, I thought it wouldn't get a single reply. You never know!

I wonder what really happened and why?
 
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I think there's a difference between being open to what someone is saying and treating it fairly/investigating it objectively - as opposed to completely believing someone because it adheres to one's ideology.

Tim Pool - Jussie Smollet and The Rise of HOAX Hate Crimes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2eBSiv3UB4

It's nothing to do with ideology. At least not the way I think you mean.

The political side of it isn't something I find particularly relevant. The point is that I am inclined to believe victims of abuse and assault until I see good cause not to.

Yes, everyone has a legal right to be innocent until proven guilty. But what's required in law and what's required in personal opinion don't have to be the same.

I'm simply not willing to risk the emotional harm it would do not believing someone who's been a victim of this sort of crime when it's entirely possibly they're being truthful.
 
Are Jews White?

lead_720_405.jpg


Trump's election has reopened questions that have long seemed settled in America?including the acceptability of open discrimination against minority groups.




tl;dr yes they are

-----------------

When I first posted this article, I thought it wouldn't get a single reply. You never know!

I wonder what really happened and why?
Many Jews are white or European in their heritage. However there are Jews of all races including Asian, Latino, Arabic or Semitic, and Black Jews.

Despite how many European Jews falsely claim they are genetically related to Arabic or Semitic Jews, this is not true, and there are no genetic differences between Arabs or Palestinians and Israeli or Semitic Jews.

https://www.livescience.com/40247-ashkenazi-jews-have-european-genes.html
 
I guess we disagree as to what constitutes suspicious details.

www.fakehatecrimes.org

349 instances of hoax hate crimes.

I am highly skeptical that there's any epidemic of fake hate crimes. They do happen, it's not unheard of. But I don't think it's super common.

That said, and I suspect this may be one of those rare instances of agreement between us. I'm not wild about the idea of hate crimes in general. I don't think a racist motivation should make much difference in classifying and sentencing criminal acts.
 
tl;dr yes they are

Your comment was off-topic.

I'm Jewish I can tell you that Jews do not consider themselves white, they routinely look down on goyim and will separate themselves from white people unless it serves them. For example people think that white people are disproportionately accepted into Ivy League schools but white people are actually marginalized if we were to separate "white" and "jewish" - however for the statistics the two are often conflated, leading to people thinking that there is some kind of white supremacy.

If Jews started walking around assaulting other colored minorities, would you say that there's a problem with violent white supremacists? No
 
I am highly skeptical that there's any epidemic of fake hate crimes. They do happen, it's not unheard of. But I don't think it's super common.
What you think is irrelevant. What to do here is compare the number of hoax hate crimes with the number of actual hate crimes. If the hoax hate crimes are higher or comparable, and someone states that there's a rise in hate crimes (like WashPo), then the fact is that fake hate crimes are also on the rise (and there has been a rise in hoaxes since Trump imo).

I don't think a racist motivation should make much difference in classifying and sentencing criminal acts.
Yeah I'm not going to get all hysterical if 2 different races have an altercation. There's far more black on white crime than white on black crime for eg but I care more about whether a crime is random and unprovoked, and if so should be judged harshly.
 
What you think is irrelevant. What to do here is compare the number of hoax hate crimes with the number of actual hate crimes. If the hoax hate crimes are higher or comparable, and someone states that there's a rise in hate crimes (like WashPo), then the fact is that fake hate crimes are also on the rise (and there has been a rise in hoaxes since Trump imo).


Yeah I'm not going to get all hysterical if 2 different races have an altercation. There's far more black on white crime than white on black crime for eg but I care more about whether a crime is random and unprovoked, and if so should be judged harshly.

Yeaaaaaaah, problem is, I suspect if I asked you for stats on hoax hate crimes, if I dig into them I'll find many of them are totally unverified. And I suspect if I go looking on my own, I'll find that there aren't any authoritive sources tracking hoax hate crimes. Probably all that's tracked is how many prosecutions and how many convictions. Which wouldn't be helpful.

Which means I'd just have to go with my instincts. And my instinct for humans is that I doubt that many of them plot fake hate crimes. Cause I suspect most people who'd be politically inclined towards wanting to raise awareness for hate crimes likely believe there are plenty of hate crimes without needing to fake them.
 
The timing of this attack plus this law is also a bit strange. This wouldn't have been orchestrated by interests above Smollett for political expediency?

theroot.com said:
On Thursday, the U.S. Senate passed a bill that would make lynching a federal crime.

The bill, which was introduced in June by Sens. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.), Cory Booker (D-N.J.) and Tim Scott (R-S.C.), had previously passed in the Senate in December, but did not pass in the GOP-majority House before the end of the 115th Congress. The Hill reports that the bill passed Thursday with a voice vote.

While discussing the bill, Booker cited the recent reported attack in Chicago against actor Jussie Smollett of Empire fame and said that "lynching is not a relic of the past."

"Justice for the victims of lynching has been too long denied, and as we look forward we must collectively in this body make a strong, unequivocal statement," he added.

Harris called lynching a part of the country's "uncomfortable history" that she said has never been "truly acknowledged" or "reconciled."
"We must confront hate in our country. ... We are now making clear there will be serious, swift and severe consequences," Harris said.


52136192_10156740394040520_177755433522429952_n.jpg
 
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Yeaaaaaaah, problem is, I suspect if I asked you for stats on hoax hate crimes, if I dig into them I'll find many of them are totally unverified. And I suspect if I go looking on my own, I'll find that there aren't any authoritive sources tracking hoax hate crimes. Probably all that's tracked is how many prosecutions and how many convictions. Which wouldn't be helpful.

Which means I'd just have to go with my instincts. And my instinct for humans is that I doubt that many of them plot fake hate crimes. Cause I suspect most people who'd be politically inclined towards wanting to raise awareness for hate crimes likely believe there are plenty of hate crimes without needing to fake them.

A hoax hoax? lol that's a new one..

You're also wrong here and you're blatantly denying provable evidence. There's no need for your suspicions or assumptions. I linked you to that site. You can easily do a search for any one of those crimes and read the corroborating media article. Many of them are not prosecuted for lying to police or wasting taxpayer resources. It's always better to analyze evidence and not rely on speculation or "instincts".
 
Normally I don't click on sites that have names like that, but at your suggestion I took a quick look.

I'll look more into it later, but one of the first things I noticed is that they seem to be including as hoaxes any news articles that suggest a possible hate crime that latter turns out not to be the case.

Sooo, by a large number of hoax hate crimes. Do you mean people faking hate crimes? Or does even so much as the media jumping the gun and reporting it as a possible hate crime, such as by saying the police are investigating the possibility it was a hate crime, count as a hoax?

Cause if so that's a terrible way to determine anything. You can't compare actual verified hate crimes with bullshit the media comes up with and then suggest that people are faking hate crimes.

This isn't an observation, you're more familiar with the site, I'm asking you if this is something they do. I'm asking how this data is categorized and defined.
 
I just found that site as it was linked by Leftwing blogger Tim Pool in a video. But I've been following the hoax hate crimes for a while now - Mark Dice lists a whole bunch of them in his book 'The True Story of Fake News'.

You can choose to come to your own conclusions regarding this, but I know that there is a large swath of the country that wants to be convinced that there is a serious problem with hate crimes in the US (more serious than before Trump's election at least).

I'm open to that being true, but I've seen time and time again how dishonest the media is with reporting on these stories, and especially after the crime has been exposed as a hoax.
 
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Megyn Kelly said:
J. Smollett case had plenty of red flags, but media was too attached to storyline (and victimhood) to see/admit them. Once again, journos dedicated more to proving *themselves* virtuous than to reporting facts botch the story. It's tiresome and won't change..

Adam Schiff said:
I met Jussie Smollett at the Pride Parade in Los Angeles, and I've seen the passion and moral clarity of his activism first hand. This week he was the victim of an horrific attack. We pray for your speedy recovery, Jussie, and reject this act of hatred and bigotry.

^America can rest easy knowing that a guy who was too stupid to sniff out the most obvious hoax ever runs the House Intelligence Committee.
 
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Well for what it's worth. I'm kinda skeptical of there being an epidemic of actual hate crimes either.

I tend to think both stances are exaggerated.
 
There definitely seems to a be a pattern of random and unprovoked attacks against Trump supporters, but it's not politically correct to point that out.
 
Are Jews White?

...

tl;dr yes they are

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When I first posted this article, I thought it wouldn't get a single reply. You never know!

I wonder what really happened and why?

I missed when you posted that earlier...and I'm struggling with it now to find the relationship to this thread beyond hate crimes exist (your link doesn't appear to speak to fake hate crimes). I hesitate to respond, as my words would likely tackle the my view of Jews and skin color, and miss the point of hate crimes altogether - effectively grabbing a tangent and going for a ride.
 
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