About to kick.... questions

[infraredz]

I have an amount of chronic anxiety (which is being treated with gabapentin and a benzo). I usually only can tolerate half a cup of coffee and that's enough stimulation for me.
I have been taking * for pain and am getting ready to kick and am looking into this (either DPA or DLPA) as maybe being something to help.

I've read anecdotal reports (I can cite if you want, but a quick google will show you) of this helping * maintenance users and some 'normal joes' with chronic pain and 'mood lift' and keeping an 'elevated mood'. Here is some info for people not familiar with DPA and DLPA:
"D and DL--Phenylalanine (but not L-Phenylalanine) inhibit several enzymes which are responsible for the destruction of the body's pain-killing hormones, including Carboxypeptidase A and "enkephalinase" en-zymes. With these enzymes inhibited, the brain's own naturally-produced endorphins enjoy a longer life span, and are thus able to exert their powerful pain-relieving actions for long periods of time."

Now, here are my main questions:

1. L-Phenylalanine (LPA) is converted into L-tyrosine. L-tyrosine in turn is converted into L-DOPA, which is further converted into dopamine, norepinephrine (noradrenaline), and epinephrine (adrenaline) all stimulatory neurotransmitters which, I obviously don't want being in withdrawal and also as an anxious person. However, does the presence of LPA in dLpa actually contribute to a psychological response?
2. "Also, as DL-phenylalanine inhibits endorphin degradation, this leads to an inhibition of GABA release in the ventral tegmental neurons (in the midbrain), which results in greater dopamine release. This can explain the analgesic effects following ingestion." Dopamine, and correct me if I'm wrong, is stimulatory in nature. However, for someone in withdrawal, the 'feel good chemical' may be helpful it seems...?
3. As referenced above, I think an inihibition of GABA is again, not the best for someone with anxiety/withdrawal. Would anyone privy to pharmacological/neurobiology care to comment?\
4. Are there any herbal remedy type things to help the kick other than the common ones (I've kicked hard use before, much worse than this so I know the deal: tylenol, anti-nausea [hydroxyzine], immodium for diarrhea, etc)?

Thanks.

 

[sekio]

While phenylalanine is eventually converted into dopamine in your body, there are a multitude of regulatory systems that mean that acute administration of e.g. tyraosine or phenylalanine does not result in an increase in dopamine/norepinephrine levels. Do recall that amino acids are naturally present in the diet in the first place. Noirmally people do not become hyperstimulated after eating cheese or wine.

The statement that D,L-phenylalanine "increases opioid peptide levels" has never been confirmed in humans. As far as the literature goes, there is no evidence at all to suggest that pheylalanine will help at all in opioid withdrawal. The statement that "D-phenylalanine is an enkephalinase inhibitor" has never held water.

No evidence aside from anecdote has proven that DL-phenylalnine has either a useful analgesic effect in humans or a use in migitating opioid withdrawal symptoms. Save your money and time.

Try not to worry about brain chemistry. Worry more on treating your body well during withdrawal.

 

[Vaya]

Hey infraredz,

While I understand entirely why you placed your thread under Recovery Support, I do believe this particular type of question is vastly better suited for the Advanced Drug Discussion forum; I am going to move it on over there for you.

I hope your withdrawals go as smoothly as possible. No beans about it, it will be rough. I'm glad to get the sincere feeling that you know this well enough already, though! I would really listen to sekio's advice - He really knows the intricacies of human psychopharmacology and physioology better than most. I especially agree with his statement quoted below:

Try not to worry about brain chemistry. Worry more on treating your body well during withdrawal.

Take care of yourself, and get better soon!!
All the best,
~ Vaya

 

[Ninae]

No, huge amounts of Loperamide (like 100 grams +) or a combintion of L-theanine, Magnesium, or a sedative herb like Valerian, Hops, or Kava is your best bet if you can't do a gradual taper with what you've got. I would go for the latter as it's more healthy for your body and not actually another drug.

Also, the best nutrition and a many detoxiants as you can get. Don't fall for the temptation to sustain yourself on crisps, chocklate, and coke. Opt for raw fruits and vegetables (freshly squeezed juice is wonderful), eggs, honey, nuts, seeds, and grains instead. And a minimum of 10 grams of Vitamin-C or Ascorbic Acid a day (removes water-based toxins). And also Vitamin E as it removes fat-based toxins.

 

[sekio]

huge amounts of Loperamide (like 100 grams +) [..] is your best bet

100 grams of loperamide would be a guaranteed lethal dose. While some people do find loperamide provides relief, it can still be toxic in overdose, and several BL'ers have died from abusing it before.
Start at perhaps 10 milligrams, and work your way up from there.

sedative herb like Valerian, Hops, or Kava is your best bet [...] as it's more healthy for your body and not actually another drug.

Pretty sure that all 3 of those could be classed as drugs, mild as they may be. Kava in particular can have a pretty serious pharmacological effect as a relaxant/intoxicant.

All the other advice is excellent, though. A balanced and mostly naturally-sourced diet, & proper nutrition, will not hurt in the slightest.

 

[Ninae]

I meant 100 mgs. And at least herbs like Hops and Valerian are very mild compared to synthetic drugs and I've never heard of them having any harmful effect. At least when used for a temporary period to aid withdrawal. Not that you should be on them for a whole lifetime but they just aren't that strong.