Misc 7OH Potentiation

[Kingoffrogs]

I have been using 7OH as a sleep aid for a few months now, particularly on nights where my lower back is sore. It has worked great for me so far, but is quite expensive. Has anyone here had experience with 7OH potentiators? I have tried taking 200mg cimetidine 30 minutes prior to ingesting 15mg 7OH, but it does not potentiate the effects. If anyone has experience with potentiating 7OH I would like to hear what worked for you and what didn't.

 

[Esperighanto]

Mixing it with straight kratom leaf dramatically increases the duration and body high for me, and mixing it with carisoprodol amplifies everything about it. I've also mixed a ton of different benzodiazepines with it, flualprazolam worked well with it, bromonordiazepam didn't have a synergy neccessarily but wasn't terrible alongside it. Etizolam when vaped or taken as a sublingual liquid/blotter works really well, but normally orally administered it was tough to line up the timelines, as oral tiz takes a minute to kick in and 7-OH is brief as can be, maybe 3-4 hours at the longest in my experience.

Cannabis/alternative cannabinoids synergize well, as does hydroxyzine, and I haven't tested it yet but I'm sure that promethazine would too.

 

[negrogesic]

In theory, cimetidine could increase (potentiate) the effects of oral 7-hydroxymitragynine by inhibiting its metabolism, but in practice, I doubt it will have any noticeable effects.

Nothing will significantly increase the effects. At least to the extent that I know you are looking for. As mentioned above, taking plain kratom may increase the effects. But 7-hydroxymitragynine raises one tolerance tremendously, so if you are taking say 5 smokeshop sourced Hydroxie brand 15mg 7-hydroxymitragynine -- a total of 75mg of 7-hydroxymitragynine-- then there is nothing that will potentiate it to the extent that I imagine you want. You can take things that have additive effects, like Black Seed oil (get the capsules, they sell it on amazon (i like this brand: https://a.co/d/4vccyUe), which can help increase the duration between doses (i.e., the amount of time before you feel like you need another dose).

But unfortunately there is nothing that will do what I know you're hoping for.

Also, like other partial agonists, I feel like 7-hydroxymitragynine has a ceiling dose (i.e., a high enough dose after which point it doesn't seem to do more). Not sure where that point is exactly, but I feel like it's fairly low, like around 100mg-150mg or so. Doses above, for arguements sake, say, 150mg, do last longer, and cause more side-effects, but they don't really get you higher. And the tolerance builds super fast.

For example, after getting some high strength 7-OH powder (like 80%+ 7-hydroxymitragynine powder) I've taken 150mg-200mg for my first dose and it got me quite high, even nodding a bit, but additional doses begin to fail to produce the same effect, even if they are larger. After using large doses for a day or two, I've taken single doses as large as 500mg, maybe more, which were surprisingly underwhelming and got me less high than that initial 150mg-200mg dose, while causing more side-effects.

In an event, there definitely seems to be a dose above which there is no additional high. And tolerance to the effects grows very fast. The only way to appreciate the effects of 7-OH is to take breaks.

 

[AngelsandFairiesarereal]

Mixing it with straight kratom leaf dramatically increases the duration and body high for me, and mixing it with carisoprodol amplifies everything about it. I've also mixed a ton of different benzodiazepines with it, flualprazolam worked well with it, bromonordiazepam didn't have a synergy neccessarily but wasn't terrible alongside it. Etizolam when vaped or taken as a sublingual liquid/blotter works really well, but normally orally administered it was tough to line up the timelines, as oral tiz takes a minute to kick in and 7-OH is brief as can be, maybe 3-4 hours at the longest in my experience.

Cannabis/alternative cannabinoids synergize well, as does hydroxyzine, and I haven't tested it yet but I'm sure that promethazine would too.

Hmm … I have a bunch of hydroxyzine lying around, maybe I’ll give the combo a try

 

[Esperighanto]

Hmm … I have a bunch of hydroxyzine lying around, maybe I’ll give the combo a try

I was actually going to try that today but just proposed to my fiancee so he and I are going to roll later, and I don't want to possibly dampen the molly with hydroxyzine. Let me know how the hydroxyzine goes! I also want to try 7-OH with promethazine to compare to carisoprodol and hydroxyzine at some point.

 

[Kingoffrogs]

Mixing it with straight kratom leaf dramatically increases the duration and body high for me, and mixing it with carisoprodol amplifies everything about it. I've also mixed a ton of different benzodiazepines with it, flualprazolam worked well with it, bromonordiazepam didn't have a synergy neccessarily but wasn't terrible alongside it. Etizolam when vaped or taken as a sublingual liquid/blotter works really well, but normally orally administered it was tough to line up the timelines, as oral tiz takes a minute to kick in and 7-OH is brief as can be, maybe 3-4 hours at the longest in my experience.

Cannabis/alternative cannabinoids synergize well, as does hydroxyzine, and I haven't tested it yet but I'm sure that promethazine would too.

Alright, thanks. I won't be using Benzos to aid in sleep anytime soon, perhaps Phenibut would be better for falling asleep than 7OH and would actually improve my quality of sleep, but that is a different discussion altogether. I might try out taking 15 mg of 7OH with a gram or 2 of red vein then, we will see how it works.

The only way to appreciate the effects of 7-OH is to take breaks.

I don't use 7OH nearly enough to need to take breaks, I suppose they are intrinsically a part of my dosing frequency. The main reason I'm looking to potentiate 7OH is to make it stretch out longer, it is pretty pricey, and unfortunately most nights Ibuprofen doesn't do the trick.

 

[negrogesic]

Alright, thanks. I won't be using Benzos to aid in sleep anytime soon, perhaps Phenibut would be better for falling asleep than 7OH and would actually improve my quality of sleep, but that is a different discussion altogether. I might try out taking 15 mg of 7OH with a gram or 2 of red vein then, we will see how it works.



I don't use 7OH nearly enough to need to take breaks, I suppose they are intrinsically a part of my dosing frequency. The main reason I'm looking to potentiate 7OH is to make it stretch out longer, it is pretty pricey, and unfortunately most nights Ibuprofen doesn't do the trick.

I'd try black seed oil. Get capsules (like the kind I linked in my first post). Might help you go longer between doses?

How many mg of 7-OH do you take per day?

 

[AngelsandFairiesarereal]

I was actually going to try that today but just proposed to my fiancee

Congratulations on your engagement

Let me know how the hydroxyzine goes!

Will do (haven’t yet as I was taking clonazepam instead)

 

[Esperighanto]

Congratulations on your engagement

Thank you! I don't think I've ever been more excited about anything tbh.

Alright, thanks. I won't be using Benzos to aid in sleep anytime soon, perhaps Phenibut would be better for falling asleep than 7OH and would actually improve my quality of sleep, but that is a different discussion altogether. I might try out taking 15 mg of 7OH with a gram or 2 of red vein then, we will see how it works.

Phenibut has a very similar feel to some benzos imo, and if you're just using it for sleep I also would advise against benzos, sorry I thought we were just talking about recreational use of 7-OH.

 

[red22]

Nux-vomica felt like the body highs of LSD an an opioid. A Bluelighter who was a big fan of it says that "it works wonders as far as the potentiation of psychedelics"* and I suspect that it would potentiate opioids as well; there's even an article that suggests that it's 1,000 times more powerful than morphine, which is absurd, but I know that it does have a hint of an opioid feel and it is traditionally considered to be an analgesic. More info: post-16183583


*post-11973074

 

[red22]

Oh my god, look what I just came across. Says Strychnos nux-vomica (along with "other plants") helps to reduce opioid withdrawal and has depressant and painkilling effects!

A Unani drug combination (containing SNV with other plants) was tested on the opiate abstinence syndrome in moderately and severely morphine-dependent rats. Results showed that the drug combination markedly suppressed the opiate abstinence syndrome, and possessed central depressant and analgesic activity.(35)

35. Shahana Y, Zafar KMY, Zillur RS. Elaboration of the pharmacodynamics of some indigenous drugs claimed to have de-addictive effects. Ethnobiology in human welfare: abstracts of the fourth international congress of ethnobiology, Lucknow, Uttar Pradesh, India;1994:298.

A review on medicinal uses, analytical techniques and pharmacological activities of Strychnos nux-vomica Linn.: A concise report. 2017. Patel, K., Laloo, D., Singh, G. K., Gadewar, M., & Patel, D. K. Chinese Journal of Integrative Medicine. Advance online publication. DOI: 10.1007/s11655-016-2514-1 (Effects of SNV on Central Nervous System, pg. 4)

 

[Kingoffrogs]

I'd try black seed oil. Get capsules (like the kind I linked in my first post). Might help you go longer between doses?

How many mg of 7-OH do you take per day?

I dont use it daily, just 15-20mg when needed. maybe 4 or 5 times a month.

 

[red22]

Do you agree with the rumors that it's virtually equivalent to oxycodone?

 

[Kingoffrogs]

Do you agree with the rumors that it's virtually equivalent to oxycodone?

No, I think it's much closer to hydrocodone but doesn't last as long.

 

[Esperighanto]

@red22 I would consider it to be quite a potent, stimulating, pain relieving opioid, which is likely what garners its comparisons to oxycodone.

 

[red22]

@Kingoffrogs: Isn't that like saying low dose oxycodone? With only limited experience with the two, I've always wondered if there's an appreciable difference between them beyond dose range. And I remember reading a post on here by someone who said hydrocodone is his favorite, although that doesn't necessarily mean he even tried oxycodone. From what I can recall, hydrocodone has a warmer, softer feel than oxyocodone.

 

[Kingoffrogs]

@Kingoffrogs: Isn't that like saying low dose oxycodone? With only limited experience with the two, I've always wondered if there's an appreciable difference between them beyond dose range. And I remember reading a post on here by someone who said hydrocodone is his favorite, although that doesn't necessarily mean he even tried oxycodone. From what I can recall, hydrocodone has a warmer, softer feel than oxyocodone.

Yeah the dose range is a big difference between the 2, hydrocodone was actually not as warm as oxy for me.

 

[Esperighanto]

Oh my god, look what I just came across. Says Strychnos nux-vomica (along with "other plants") helps to reduce opioid withdrawal and has depressant and painkilling effects!

A Unani drug combination (containing SNV with other plants) was tested on the opiate abstinence syndrome in moderately and severely morphine-dependent rats. Results showed that the drug combination markedly suppressed the opiate abstinence syndrome, and possessed central depressant and analgesic activity.(35)

35. Shahana Y, Zafar KMY, Zillur RS. Elaboration of the pharmacodynamics of some indigenous drugs claimed to have de-addictive effects. Ethnobiology in human welfare: abstracts of the fourth international congress of ethnobiology, Lucknow, Uttar Pradesh, India;1994:298.

A review on medicinal uses, analytical techniques and pharmacological activities of Strychnos nux-vomica Linn.: A concise report. 2017. Patel, K., Laloo, D., Singh, G. K., Gadewar, M., & Patel, D. K. Chinese Journal of Integrative Medicine. Advance online publication. DOI: 10.1007/s11655-016-2514-1 (Effects of SNV on Central Nervous System, pg. 4)

Isn't touting that strychnine-rich plants feel amazing essentially the antithesis of harm reduction? Not trying to shit on your take here, but strychnine is profoundly dangerous, and talking a bout it feeling like 1000x the body high of LSD, while also being good for opioid withdrawls, may lead somebody who's not too prone to actually doing their own reading on things to acquire this, consume it, and die of strychnine poisoning I'd imagine.

 

[red22]

That's why I included this disclaimer in my linked post:

Strychnine was once extremely popular as a stimulant. If it wasn't so easy to OD on it, it would still be popular. The downside is its potency. It's just way too potent. You can feel 100 micrograms of it. It's nearly as potent as LSD is. It also has effects that are mind expanding, much like LSD has, but it's not hallucinogenic at all. It makes you see clearer, hear better, improves your sense of touch, things smell stronger. Sex is better. It makes you more aware of things around you. It improves your memory and concentration. It doesn't have the edginess of caffeine. It's one of the best stimulants there is, but also the most toxic. That's the downside.

If there was a stimulant as nice as strychnine is that was not as toxic, it would be SUPER POPULAR. The problem with strychnine is that a good dose is 500 micrograms. A large dose is 3 milligrams. A deadly dose is about 30 mg or so. 10 times more than a large dose and it can be fatal. That's a MAJOR problem. When it was popular, too many people would OD on it. As little as 5 mg can cause unpleasant effects. It's just too dangerous for the average person to buy at the local store. Too many people like to overdo drugs and not follow the directions on the box. With strychnine, you cannot take it like it's caffeine. You have to be very careful about taking accurate doses or you'll be in for it.

I think if people capped it at 1 mg, and never took more than 1 mg, it would still be available. Too many people abuse these kinds of things thinking things like, "if 1 pill is good 10 should give me much more energy!", so they would take ten 3 mg pills, and then die shortly after (or just have painful convulsions if they were lucky).

69Ron, Jan 31, 2010, https://drugs-forum.com/threads/nux-vomica-how-to-use.116031/#post-757000

 

[aftershocknrock]

I was actually going to try that today but just proposed to my fiancee so he and I are going to roll later, and I don't want to possibly dampen the molly with hydroxyzine. Let me know how the hydroxyzine goes! I also want to try 7-OH with promethazine to compare to carisoprodol and hydroxyzine at some point.

congrats spaghetio i trust il be getting an invite to the stag/hen party