2C-I - Experienced - Moments of humility

[Listening]

I've tried 2c-i about ten times now. Over in the Big & Dandy 2c-i thread I recently made a comment about it being purely recreational for me. Well, for whatever reason, this last trip threw me for a loop.

I dosed 26mg at around noon and went out for a walk, ending up in a big park. The comeup was more intense than my previous 2c-i trips and gave me a hint of what was to come. I was a little nauseous and uncomfortable but as long as I was moving I was distracted enough that it wasn't too annoying. At about an hour in, things were already getting funky with trees imposing their presence magnificently and their top branches dancing in unison to tickle sky. People-watching was fun (as it always is for me on psychedelics) as everyone becomes an caricatured version of themselves. Montreal is great for this as people already like to stand out with distinct statement-making styles. I had to prevent myself from bursting out with laughter at the sight of some of the blob people and stick people that I encountered.

At about the 2 hour mark I tried to sit on a bench and enjoy the view but, while walking was fine, I felt nauseated as soon as I sat down. The ground in front of me was churning and moving as if it was molten lava and I felt what I imagine was motion sickness. This was actually the first time I had worried that I might throw up on a psychedelic drug. I got up quickly and kept walking, deciding to head back home. The walk was beautiful and wacky. Brick building walls seemed to bubble in and out in impossible places. Cars were all dinky and silly looking (I always get this on psychedelics) with every ding and dent extremely exaggerated. The cars also had human characteristics to them, making the idea of a "sexy" car quite laughable; these were silly things. Overall at this point I was actually astonished at how similar some of the visuals were to 2c-e since my previous 2c-i trips didn't share as much in common.

When I got home I went to the bathroom to sit on the toilet. I get this on other phenethylamines too, but 2c-i seems a lot worse and I ended up spending a damn long time on the toilet; I could have got up, but I was most comfortable there. Nevertheless, this was the peak of my trip and this is where the magic began. A few interesting things took place:

I noticed "something" about my head space that reminded me of DMT. This is weird since DMT (an insane tryptamine) and 2c-i (an "easy" phenethylamine) seem about as far away from each other as you can get on the psychedelic spectrum. Nevertheless, I was certain that I kept "tickling" something in my mind that felt extremely DMT-like to me in some way that I couldn't quite grasp. I closed my eyes to try to explore and narrow down what it was I was feeling. I had intensely colorful and detailed CEVs: It looked like an all-encompassing psychedelic screen saver (the only other times I've had CEVs like that were with DMT). The patterns were fine and detailed. As I tried to study them and figure out what I was looking at I had to laugh: It looked like the logo of some old rock band with a script text similar to this but with more sharp swirls and such. I couldn't actually make out the text. The visuals were at once both beautiful but also extremely cheesy (which I find is true about a lot of the 2c-i visuals). I don't think it's a coincidence that I find the 2c-i visuals to be so light/funny/silly and that the 2c-i head space can often be described similarly.

As I was exploring the CEVs I was still trying to hone in on that DMT feeling. I have been experimenting with mindfulness lately (only just beginning after reading the book Confession of a Buddhist Atheist) and somehow I sensed that I could focus on this DMT feeling through mindfulness at that moment. What happened then was astonishing to me. As thoughts came to me, I let them go immediately, striving only to observe. Each time a thought was let go of, and before the next thought would come, there was an instant that was exactly the DMT feeling that I was trying to pinpoint. Immediately at that point I felt that I knew what it was: When I smoke DMT, I usually hear this sort of extreme/harsh digital stutter that I have found quite disconcerting on all my DMT trips so far. I have heard others describe this as "the sound of the reality being ripped away," or similar. I now feel that it is the "sound" of your ego (or something related) being ripped away and it was exactly this that I was experiencing (though only lasting for an instant at each encounter). The feeling that I was seeking seemed to be the "edge" of the pattern in time created by the conscious ego; hence the experience of ripping apart as you leave this world, pass through this edge, and enter DMT space. On 2c-i, the two or three instants when I was successfully able to grasp at that space resulted in an orgasmic euphoria that I had not previously experienced on any drug. However, the feeling wasn't just euphoric, it was also submerged in absolute humility. I was startled to say the least.

After that, I began to think about my anxiety issues. I used to be a pretty anxious person but have overcome a lot of it over the past years by self-imposed exposure. Even though I've worked through quite a lot of it, it's still a real issue in my life. Lately I have been trying to grasp the idea of experiencing suffering the world. I come from parents who couldn't ever admit that anything in life was a real problem and this seriously screwed me up. I've lived my life avoiding pain and suffering at all costs (almost entirely unconsciously). Even though I had been dealing with anxiety through exposure (knowing that I had to feel the anxiety to get over it) I still didn't totally understand the clincher: One must not simply expose themselves to anxiety-provoking situations but must also expose themselves internally to the core anxious feeling and cease blocking or avoiding it. Exposing yourself to an anxiety provoking situation isn't enough: you also have to allow yourself to feel that anxiety as fully as possible. Not only that, but you have to move towards the suffering at every opportunity for the anxiety is actually caused in a large part by avoiding the suffering to being with. I knew a lot of this intellectually but putting it into practice hadn't been entirely clear to me until this trip. All of a sudden, far from being scared of anxiety, I was excited to encounter an anxiety-provoking situation in order to fully experience it.

The trip was only a few days ago, so I would be very naive if I suggested that I was "cured" of my anxiety. I know that this cannot be the case and that I have a long road ahead. Nevertheless, I've encountered several situations since this trip where my response to pain/discomfort/anxiety/suffering were nothing like anything I can remember encountering thus far in my life. Where I might previously have become scared or sad or angry, or where I might have unconsciously ignored a real pain, I have instead been able to move towards the pain without fear and fully experience it. Amazingly (and just as I've read but not been able to put into practice) this true exposure is far from being painful compared to what happens when the pain is avoided or blocked in some unconscious way. Indeed it feels as though I now have a magic trick to improve myself: Mindfulness (to become aware of the pain before it has a chance of being blocked in some way) and true willful exposure (to be affected by the pain properly and thereby grow).

There were other revelations during the trip as well. I realized how much of my thoughts are taken up by thinking about past events and rehearsing future events; all for the sake of impression management. I like to think of myself as a transparent and honest person, but I now see that I have been fooling myself in many ways. I am excited deal with these things (and many others I'm sure) through mindfulness as well. I'm not sure why this 2c-i trip had such a useful headspace and why it was so clearheaded as well: My previous 2c-i trips (even at lower doses) had all seemed somewhat scatterbrained and impaired in some way. This one felt far more like a good 2c-e trip, albeit with a somewhat different feel.

I have a long way to go, but I'm happy that I have some sense of the path. Thanks for the help 2c-i.

 

[Delta-9-THC]

Nice report. Reminds me of the psilacetin trip I had earlier in the year which dealt with similar issues(anxiety).

It's amazing how psychedelics can force you to view yourself as you really are by tearing away all your internal defense mechanism and show you what you need to do to live a more fruitful life. Psychedelics can show you the way but it is up to you to integrate and follow through with what you've learned.

I also agree with your statement about how you can know something on an intellectual level and that psychedelics can help you integrate that on an emotional and behavioral level.

 

[bunkiie]

anxiety doesn't really exist, you dudes just haven't figured out what makes you anxious and solved it yet. Or at least worked on a sure fire way to. Thoughts-feelings-emotions. A lot of anxiety has to do with subconscious or unconscious issues being brought up that you have yet to deal with in your reality. Those do indeed come up especially well whilst tripping.

In the end no one can teach you to master your consciousness but YOU. No following or book will lead you to enlightenment, where you will look back and laugh at how awful your thought patterns were.

 

[Listening]

Reminds me of the psilacetin trip I had earlier in the year which dealt with similar issues(anxiety).

The above 2C-I trip was planned as my last attempt with this chemical before moving on (I like to explore the different substances somewhat systematically ). Psilacetin is actually next on my list to explore properly over the course of the summer. I've tried it once already but the dosage was a bit too low for my liking; only enough to know that I liked it. I'm particularly excited because my best trips so far have all been via mushrooms, so I'm curious to see what psilacetin has to offer.

 

[mr.mackey]

I think that Anxiety actually does exist, there is a huge difference between everyday worry and full blown Panic Disorder or Generalized Anxiety Disorder. Panic attacks are intense shit that you can't always talk somebody out of.....

Thanks for the report Listening, I thought it was interesting that you experienced the "dmt feeling" on 2C-I, because the last time I did mescaline I was struck with that exact feeling, that it is the same headspace or something, which is odd because mescaline is still extremely mild in comparison to DMT. how recently had you done dmt prior to this 2C-I trip?

 

[rincewindrocks]

Over in the Big & Dandy 2c-i thread I recently made a comment about it being purely recreational for me. Well, for whatever reason, this last trip threw me for a loop.

ive noticed 2ci can do that. just when you think you've got a handle on it, it smacks you across the face and calls you out.

good report, btw

 

[Listening]

I think that Anxiety actually does exist...

Yea, I don't think anyone who has experienced real anxiety (nor any psychologist) would suggest that it doesn't exist.

Thanks for the report Listening, I thought it was interesting that you experienced the "dmt feeling" on 2C-I, because the last time I did mescaline I was struck with that exact feeling, that it is the same headspace or something, which is odd because mescaline is still extremely mild in comparison to DMT. how recently had you done dmt prior to this 2C-I trip?

Hmf! Glad I'm not alone. My last DMT attempt was a few months ago, so it's long gone from my system. My DMT experiences were interesting, but I feel that I never got out of it what a lot of people describe (ex. no feelings of euphoria or love, mostly just "weirdness"). Now that I've had this latest experience, I have a strong feeling/intuition that my next DMT trip will get me past that. We shall see.

 

[construct]

Cool report! I found everything from the the silly observations to the well-articulated mindfulness theory really relateable.

I don't have too much experience with DMT (I find it a super difficult material), but I have definitely entered a trance-induced state more than once on it (I'm sure people with more experience with it would chime in and say that this is its defining characteristic). This state comes a little bit easier with DMT than most other psychedelics, and you really have to work to reach a trance with substances like 2C-I. I think a trance-state and ego-loss/softening you were describing are basically synonomous. Do you find this to be true?

 

[Listening]

I think a trance-state and ego-loss/softening you were describing are basically synonomous. Do you find this to be true?

I'm still relatively inexperienced with psychedelics compared to many (most) people here - have been experimenting for only 2 years so far - so maybe someone else could answer this... However, this at least jibes with my experience so far.

 

[eatcod]

Great report, thanks for writing this, rings a lot of bells.

This tempts me back to try 2c-i at a higher dose; I always found the 'scatterbrained, impaired' headspace and lack of visuals but tense bodyload at even low doses offputting.

The closest I've ever come to slipping into a 'white light euphoria' type moment was on 2c-i, but i found the twitchy muscle tension too much of a distraction to maintain it long. Keen to find out if that's anything like the DMT experience for me!

 

[RigaCrypto]

One must not simply expose themselves to anxiety-provoking situations but must also expose themselves internally to the core anxious feeling and cease blocking or avoiding it. Exposing yourself to an anxiety provoking situation isn't enough: you also have to allow yourself to feel that anxiety as fully as possible. Not only that, but you have to move towards the suffering at every opportunity for the anxiety is actually caused in a large part by avoiding the suffering to being with. I knew a lot of this intellectually but putting it into practice hadn't been entirely clear to me until this trip.

This is the same way of dealing with negative experiences I, and many others, have found. So I think there must be some truth to it. The way I see it, you can not refuse what your soul tells you. If you try to shut yourself away from it, it accumulates on you, like water behind a dam. And if you continue resisting, the pressure just keeps building up. But if you accept it, take it into you and let it pass through you, it goes behind you and you are free.

A more practical analogy that comes to my mind is when jumping into a pool from a height. The more you hesitate, the more afraid you become. If you just jump, the fear is all behind you.

It is a magic trick for me too, and it works. Not just with anxiety, but with hesitation, uncertainty, boredom - which I guess are all facets of the same phenomenon stemming from fear.

 

[Listening]

This is the same way of dealing with negative experiences I, and many others, have found. So I think there must be some truth to it. The way I see it, you can not refuse what your soul tells you. If you try to shut yourself away from it, it accumulates on you, like water behind a dam. And if you continue resisting, the pressure just keeps building up. But if you accept it, take it into you and let it pass through you, it goes behind you and you are free.

A more practical analogy that comes to my mind is when jumping into a pool from a height. The more you hesitate, the more afraid you become. If you just jump, the fear is all behind you.

It is a magic trick for me too, and it works. Not just with anxiety, but with hesitation, uncertainty, boredom - which I guess are all facets of the same phenomenon stemming from fear.

QFT in bold.

I love your diving analogy. And yea, I spoke of anxiety, but I've been applying it to all suffering (or "discomfort" if you prefer) and it's phenomenal how well it is working.

As you say, you can't deny your own soul. That's not to say that you have to "agree with" (or like) what your body is telling you, but you can't block the message, because it's there for some reason, even if you don't understand why. And if you do deny it, it'll come out in some much less obvious, and probably more destructive way.

 

[RigaCrypto]

QFT in bold.
As you say, you can't deny your own soul. That's not to say that you have to "agree with" (or like) what your body is telling you, but you can't block the message, because it's there for some reason, even if you don't understand why. And if you do deny it, it'll come out in some much less obvious, and probably more destructive way.

The way I find it, is that I somehow have to resolve the issue, in any way. I've acknowledged it, and this is what I'm going to do about it, and IT'LL BE OK. Or, I can safely ignore it, and IT'LL BE OK. Or even I'll think about it later, and for now IT'S OK. You just have to acknowledge it an honestly bring it to the best resolution you can at that moment, and accept that.

For me at least, the initial reluctance in facing an issue most often comes from the fear that I will not be able to resolve it in a satisfying manner, so I just end up blocking it and trying to ignore it (unsuccessfully). A sort of perfectionism if you will. But I found that it's not necessary to bring it to a perfect solution; if I just do what best I can in the circumstances and accept that, even if it's not ideal, I can live with it and the burden is off my chest. And the fear that had been preventing me from doing this was not the fear of the issue itself, but lack of confidence in myself and fear of failing to face the issue.

 

[Listening]

Bonus 2C-E Report, aka Being John Malkovich

(didn't think this deserved a thread of its own, so tacking it on here)

Yesterday at noon, I decided to dose 18mg of 2C-E. Since the above 2C-I experience was still fresh in my mind, I wanted to give 2C-E another try to get a better feel for their unique characteristics.

Unfortunately, I made a stupid mistake and took two Benadryls (diphenhydramine) with the 2C-E. I had read (in PD) that taking diphenhydramine can reduce the body load and the discomfort from the comeup. What I didn't expect was that it would also put me to sleep (almost)! Now, it's true that I sometimes make use of diphenhydramine to help me sleep, but the effect is subtle. I rationalized that 1) this was at noon, 2) I had plenty of sleep and wasn't tired and 3) 2C-E is pretty stiumulating. So I was quite shocked when, at the height of the comeup, I was having trouble keeping my eyes open! I rested for about 45 minutes (nearly falling asleep) and then said "fuck it," drank two coffees, and headed out into the world. I'm sure this affected the trip, but by how much I don't know.

It was a beautiful sunny Sunday and it seemed like the entire city was outside (confirmed by other non-high people later). This was my most visually impressive 2C-E trip to date, and it blew the 2C-I visuals out of the water (in terms of depth, detail and beauty). Colors were rich and vibrant with gradients running deep in all directions. I've previously described 2C-E as exposing the "fractal recursive nature of reality," and wow did it ever. Symmetries and connections popped up all over the place. When I saw a lesbian couple walking my way, all of a sudden I saw nothing but lesbian couples (walking in formation no less!). I'd see a car with a dent in its right fender and then realize that there were 4 cars in a row with such a dent. I saw a hippie with dreads and then couldn't find anyone but scraggly hippies in the 100s of people surrounding me. The brain is one hell of a pattern recognition machine.

I was heading towards the mountain to enjoy the tam-tams and suddently became aware of this boy in a striped shirt holding a book, walking in front of me. I had been behind him for a few minutes and felt a bit self concious that he thought I was following him. I was clear-minded enough to realize that this was all in my head, but I decided to walk on the other side of the street since it was dominating my thoughts. Two minutes later (I have no idea how) I found myself in back of him again. Somehow this balet repeated itself three times until finally arriving at the mountain. As usual on psychedlics, it's the trees that capture me. I can't get enough of the trees, and as luck would have it, they seemed to multiply quite a bit. I caught myself stairing into the beautifully detailed bark of many that I passed by. At one point, when walking through a woody area, I swear I could spot like 6 guys pissing beside trees simultaneously. At one point, the LARPers seemed to be everywhere around me, making me feel like I was caught in a medevil battle for a moment.

This trip was being Being John Malkovich for me. It felt like I was projecting myself onto everyone and everything. If you know the movie, it felt a lot like that scene where John Malkovich tries it out for himself. Everything was, "malkovich malkovich malkovich malkovich malkovich..." Eerie but funny. More than anything, this was an ego-destroying trip (for its duration). I really felt silly and subdued being out there by myself (though I still had a great time). 2C-E didn't pull any punches in showing me how my brain can trick me into seeing my own manifestations "out there". A tough lesson that I'm trying to grapple with.

As I was leaving the mountain I walked by the kid in the striped shirt, sitting under a tree and reading his book. With the 1000s of people out there, I couldn't help but laugh as I walked by him.