gloggawogga
Bluelighter
In that sense sure. I just tend to think of 'hunger' in much broader context.
Indeed. http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=143809
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DPMC Moderators: tryptakid
‘drug addiction no worse than hunger pangs’
- Thread starter E-llusion
- Start date
In that sense sure. I just tend to think of 'hunger' in much broader context.
Indeed. http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=143809
Walkaway
Bluelighter
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Wow, I think Glog and I just agreed. "Oh frabjous day!"
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Namaste,
Cliff
Wow, I think Glog and I just agreed. "Oh frabjous day!"
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Namaste,
Cliff
Chuff
Bluelighter
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> Regardless, I don't see any strong analogy between hunger
> pangs and opiate withdrawl pains. One is the body's response
> to a threat to physical survival that must eventually be satisfied
> or you will die. The other is just your body making an adjustment.
Interestingly, dopamine is released by the brain after substanance and by many illicit substances (particuarily cocaine) meaning that as far as the brain is concerned you do need coke to live!
> Regardless, I don't see any strong analogy between hunger
> pangs and opiate withdrawl pains. One is the body's response
> to a threat to physical survival that must eventually be satisfied
> or you will die. The other is just your body making an adjustment.
Interestingly, dopamine is released by the brain after substanance and by many illicit substances (particuarily cocaine) meaning that as far as the brain is concerned you do need coke to live!
gloggawogga
Bluelighter
^^^
That just means the brain is mislead by the drug. But there's still alot more to hunger than dopamine levels.
That just means the brain is mislead by the drug. But there's still alot more to hunger than dopamine levels.
Chuff
Bluelighter
true, but the N/A brigade addiction is a disease ethos are arguing that chemical changes in the brain proove addiction is a physical thing, therefore changes in the brain due to starvation would be interesting to moniter I wonder why no one is lookingg at chemical brain changes in say horney adolescents or starving people? is it because the motive behind finding chemical changes in the brain in substance users can be used to justify exploratiojn of chemical solutions? (very prophitable ones) it is strange to think pharmacutical company owned scientists and drug free addicts agree on something with such different motives!
justsomeguy
Bluelight Crew
i appreciated the comparison to a clockwork orange. 
i'm not sure exactly why though. right now, i'm trying to give up alcohol (along with many other substances). i wasn't drinking enough or long enough to go through physical withdrawals (yet).
early on in my struggle for sobriety, someone asked me that if i could take a pill to end all alcohol cravings, and essentially make drinking absolutely out of the picture for me, would i? i said enthusiastically "yes!"
today, i'm not so sure. i think there is something to be said for kicking and addiction or a destructive behavior in a way that comes more from self-motivation, or from an internal desire that requires work and constant maintanence. something about growing, and learning, and developing, instead of a 'psycho-behaviorial-response' cure. (i'm not a psychology student, so i don't have the vocabulary to explain what this good british doctor is proposing).
basically, its like in clockwork orange, when alex is trodded out in front of the panel of scientists and reporters on stage, and is shown to wretch and get sick at the sight of a woman and violence, and the one doctor stands up and shouts, "FREE WILL!"
but of course, the situation here in this thread is different from clockwork orange on a few points. first, we are dealing only with addiction (although, one could argue that alex's "hyperviolence" and sex was a form of "addiction"), and second, there is not the same moral undertones to this british doctor's study as there were in the film.
i'm not sure exactly why though. right now, i'm trying to give up alcohol (along with many other substances). i wasn't drinking enough or long enough to go through physical withdrawals (yet).
early on in my struggle for sobriety, someone asked me that if i could take a pill to end all alcohol cravings, and essentially make drinking absolutely out of the picture for me, would i? i said enthusiastically "yes!"
today, i'm not so sure. i think there is something to be said for kicking and addiction or a destructive behavior in a way that comes more from self-motivation, or from an internal desire that requires work and constant maintanence. something about growing, and learning, and developing, instead of a 'psycho-behaviorial-response' cure. (i'm not a psychology student, so i don't have the vocabulary to explain what this good british doctor is proposing).
basically, its like in clockwork orange, when alex is trodded out in front of the panel of scientists and reporters on stage, and is shown to wretch and get sick at the sight of a woman and violence, and the one doctor stands up and shouts, "FREE WILL!"
but of course, the situation here in this thread is different from clockwork orange on a few points. first, we are dealing only with addiction (although, one could argue that alex's "hyperviolence" and sex was a form of "addiction"), and second, there is not the same moral undertones to this british doctor's study as there were in the film.
Chuff
Bluelighter
morals are well worth debating, the disease model relieves the individual of choice, responsibility and guilt yet it is still a crime! and is not justification for other criminal acts. Given the choice some would choose the quick fix but given societies failure consistantly to respect freedom of choice do you trust society with this kind of power...like fuck, untill there is equal education for all on the risks and advantages of substance use |I would not trust 'society' to administer a fucking flu vaccine (Current affairs dig)
there is no such thing as a Disease of substance use, though as a limited ethos this set of beliefs may prove constructive for some individuals unwilling to accept personal responsibility for thier substance use or to do the very valid work (great point) of growing out of dependance.
people who work through these issues can be the most unjudgmental, grounded, emphatic whole human beings on the planet precisely because of all the hard work and self analisis they had to put in to get there
there is no such thing as a Disease of substance use, though as a limited ethos this set of beliefs may prove constructive for some individuals unwilling to accept personal responsibility for thier substance use or to do the very valid work (great point) of growing out of dependance.
people who work through these issues can be the most unjudgmental, grounded, emphatic whole human beings on the planet precisely because of all the hard work and self analisis they had to put in to get there