Dyed Liquid Owsley LSD?

[SKL]

People need to stop listening to stupid hippie drug dealers, or not-so-stupid hippie drug dealers who take them for stupid.

If you believe that tripe, I have some of Frank Lucas's heroin to sell you. Blue magic, baby!!!

 

[ErikG]

colored liquid

LSD is sensitive to light, which causes it to degrade. That's why it is often stored in amber vials. Maybe the maker or packager of the stuff you have put something in the liquid to block the light, in an attempt to protect the LSD in solution.

 

[Ismene]

If the chemist producing the LSD is lazy and doesn't recrystallize sufficiently (which will result in reduction of percent yield as well), there will be a significant proportion of clavine alkaloids and unreacted ergotamine tartrate (depending on the route of synthesis).

But it's interesting tho that no matter how "pure" the Owsley LSD was, if people heard the rumour that "The blue acid gives bad trips" that's the experience they got when they took the blue owsley acid. It suggests that the expectation of the trip is far more important than how "pure" the LSD is.

 

[tBirdee]

1) Chemists do not have "recipes" FFS!

2) Owsley never made liquid, paper, blotter, microdot, or anything of the sort. All of Owsley's acid was distributed in small colored barrel-shaped pills.

3) Owsley's LSD was superior because he was willing to accept a sizable reduction in yield in return for a preposterously pure product. He recrystallized his batches many times past what other producer's would deem sufficient.

4) No LSD circulated since like 1967 has had anything to do with Owsley.

5) Owsley had access to pure ergotamine tartrate, so synthesis would have been quite easy. Plus his girlfriend Melissa was a fairly talented entry-level chemist, if I remember correctly, and she helped him with every step of the process.

R&M ftw

Duhh, lol

I wonder if the LSD being made in the USA legally today is as good as Owsley's LSD was back in the day.

I can honestly say that having lived and dosed in the bay area back then, that there has never been anything as wonderful as Owsley's LSD was except for this green window pain I got in Japan in the early 80's.

Namaste

Wow, it must have been amazing being able to live and experience both the LSD and the 'counterculture' back then!

Namaste brother

 

[Roger&Me]

But it's interesting tho that no matter how "pure" the Owsley LSD was, if people heard the rumour that "The blue acid gives bad trips" that's the experience they got when they took the blue owsley acid. It suggests that the expectation of the trip is far more important than how "pure" the LSD is.

No doubt, I definitely agree-- the LSD experience is extremely malleable to outside influences. I'm sure that one reason Owsley's acid was so highly revered is because it was consumed by people in somewhat idyllic circumstances-- middle class people on the west coast during the 1960s, in the middle of a vibrant social & musical environment.

Still, Owsley produced what probably amounts to the purest LSD ever synthesized and I think he deserves mad props for that-- especially considering that he had no formal chemistry training. It takes a special type of personality in a special set of circumstances to pull off such a feat.

 

[Shambles]

*ahem*

Owsley is responsible for the second purest acid

Purest ever (according to Sandoz) was made within spitting distance of where I live back in the late 70s by Richard Kemp. Sandoz tested what was confiscated during Operation Julie and said it was purer than their own and as far as they knew the purest ever made by anybody. There's a documentary about it linkied at the end of that wiki page.

Not wishing to dicksize acid purity cos who knows and who cares but gotta stand up for the local hero

 

[DoorsofPerception]

Doesn't David Nichols make the world's purest LSD?

 

[poopstation]

There's no such thing as "impure LSD". It's either LSD or it isn't. You can have something that isn't LSD but that's a different compound, it's not "impure LSD".

And this shit about LSD degrading and that people can actually notice the degrading is absolute bollocks. A trace microgram amount on the blotter of something that isn't LSD isn't going to be detectable by any human brain or body. It certainly isn't going to be powerful enough to make you feel anything.

The reason LSD feels "dirty" or "clean" has got absolutely fuck all to do with any "impurities" in the LSD. It's completely dependent on how you're feeling on that day - if you havn't wiped your arse correctly the morning you trip then you may feel "dirty" during the trip. If the sun's out that day then you'll probably have a "clean" trip. LSD has a vast range of effects depending on tiny changes in your mood that day or the weather or if you had a good nights sleep.

The reason Owsley once dyed some LSD was because he was tired of hearing people saying "This batch is super clean dude" while another batch was "like dirty dude". So he dyed the same batch of LSD with 3 different coloured food dyes. Sure enough he got back reports saying "The green acid is righteously mellow but the red is dirty and the blue is a bummer". Owsley was laughing at the fucking idiots.

ummm.... you have to deal with competing reactions. organic chemistry is not as clean as 2+2=4, it's not like inorganic chemistry. various ergot derivatives are going to be the impurities in LSD. if there was no difference between impure LSD and pure LSD then there would be no need for chromatography skills, which is the most important aspect of LSD chemistry (aside from acquisition of course).

i can't vouch for LSD, i just eat it as it comes to me. but as far as other compounds i've had at various purity levels, there is for example a BIG difference between mdma hcl that has had the freebase distilled and the salt recrystallized versus one that has just had a typical set of washes, a/b, gas or titration type of workup. both were white and odorless but the effects where astoundingly different. pure compounds can differ CONSIDERABLY from impure ones, just depends on what the impurities are and let's not forget how messy organic chemistry is

 

[Ismene]

This is an argument that was debated ad-infinitum in the non-LSD ergoloid thread. Perhaps the human brain is sensitive enough to detect trace amounts of different non-LSD ergoloids in the presence of the overwhelming onslaught of LSD. I personally don't think it is. I just don't think the human brain receptors are that finely tuned.

I've always thought that the idea of impurities in LSD is down to set and setting. And particularly whether or not someone has told you beforehand "No bad trips on this, this is pure Sandoz baby" or "I made this in my bathtub with a can of fosters and some orange peel".

I think I could give someone the "purest" LSD ever made and tell them enough bullshit beforehand to make them have the most "unclean, dirty" trip they've ever had in their life.

 

[tBirdee]

This is an argument that was debated ad-infinitum in the non-LSD ergoloid thread. Perhaps the human brain is sensitive enough to detect trace amounts of different non-LSD ergoloids in the presence of the overwhelming onslaught of LSD. I personally don't think it is. I just don't think the human brain receptors are that finely tuned.

I've always thought that the idea of impurities in LSD is down to set and setting. And particularly whether or not someone has told you beforehand "No bad trips on this, this is pure Sandoz baby" or "I made this in my bathtub with a can of fosters and some orange peel".

I think I could give someone the "purest" LSD ever made and tell them enough bullshit beforehand to make them have the most "unclean, dirty" trip they've ever had in their life.

I really have like no knowledge in regards to chemistry/neuropsychology/pharmacodynamics or whatever so don't shit on me if this is stupid.

But is it possible that since LSD is only a relatively weak partial agonist it 'leaves room' for other ergoloids to bind to the receptors?

Just speculat'n

 

[Ismene]

I've always thought LSD was the most ferocious grasper of brain receptors of all drugs. Once LSD gets hold of a receptor I don't think there's much chance of anything else taking it's place.

 

[sit]

*ahem*

Owsley is responsible for the second purest acid

Purest ever (according to Sandoz) was made within spitting distance of where I live back in the late 70s by Richard Kemp. Sandoz tested what was confiscated during Operation Julie and said it was purer than their own and as far as they knew the purest ever made by anybody. There's a documentary about it linkied at the end of that wiki page.

Not wishing to dicksize acid purity cos who knows and who cares but gotta stand up for the local hero

Big it up for Operation Julie! Let your Welsh heart swell with pride, Shambles

There's been two whole books published about Operation Julie in the past year (just search amazon), and Andy Roberts' recent book on LSD in Britain (which is titled 'Albion Dreaming' devotes a decent chapter to it - seems to be an episode that there's suddenly some interest in again.

Intriguingly, Roberts claims that Operation Julie acid which had been smuggled out of the UK in the 70s was still coming back in and circulating well into the 1990s.

He obviously doesn't offer any evidence or source for this claim; would be fascinating to know if anyone has even circumstantial / rumour evidence for the truth of it.

It was certainly still the standard that older guys who had been around the festival scene since the 70s would refer to in the early 90s, and on the rare occasions when superstrong microdots would turn up, they would be compared to 'operation Julie acid', but I don't remember anyone ever claiming that they WERE operation Julie acid (although in a way it would make sense if they had been, as these things seemed to appear suddenly in large amounts and then disappear very quickly again, and were quite against the trend of the very weak blotters which tended to typify the time).

My understanding is that the Operation Julie acid always had a reputation for being incredibly powerful, but not particularly for being 'mellow', 'clear', 'clean', 'no body load' or any of the other magical qualities which are generally attributed to 'clean, pure' acid by those who claim that only grateful dead family have ever been able to make it. It was just really f-ing strong. Maybe other people have heard different.

Interestingly, I think that Operation Julie was knocking out 200-250 ug doses as standard at just the time when the American chemists (including Owsley) had generally come to the conclusion that this was too strong a dose to be sending out onto the streets.

 

[tBirdee]

I've always thought LSD was the most ferocious grasper of brain receptors of all drugs. Once LSD gets hold of a receptor I don't think there's much chance of anything else taking it's place.

You very well might be right, have you watched this?

He explains how LSD has a fairly low affinity for the 5-HT2a receptors, I think, fuck I have a bad memory sometimes..

 

[MrFaust]

This is a good idea next vial I get I'm putting some food coloring in turn it bright red.

 

[DwayneHoover]

^ I always thought of LSD as more of a deep cobalt blue. Ever since that stunningly clean crisp deep feeling cobalt blue disolving gel windowpane I got sometime in the mid 80s I think. Beautiful stuff, if a little weak... needed about 3 of them... that and these very tiny bright orange microdots I got around the same timeframe, by far best cleanest acid I ever had, bar none... yes there WAS a difference, cant explain it but those 2 were clearly "better" somehow. God bless whoever made them. (And no, Ismene, I would not be affected in the slightest by your attempted "dirty trip" brainwashing. If you told me that in advance I would throw them right in your face... after I took them I would totally ignore you and let my own system be the judge.)

 

[Shambles]

Doesn't David Nichols make the world's purest LSD?

Quite possibly. He's more recent than the other candidates though. Standing on the shoulders of giants. Plus he gets to do it legally not in someone's shed.

Sit: I'm not actually a Boyo but I do live right in that area at the moment. Kemp & Co used to drink in my local

The "purest acid ever made" comment was Sandoz' not mine really. They analysed it and probably know a thing or two about acid purity. Was years ago so sure it's been topped now. Would be going some to be better than better than pharm-grade though

Issy: The purity argument is almost entirely moot, I'd say. Just a point of interested discussion that likely means shit all in the real world. I seriously doubt anyone could realistically tell 99.90% from 99.95% purity. Probably way less than that even.

 

[mistergyro]

^ I always thought of LSD as more of a deep cobalt blue. Ever since that stunningly clean crisp deep feeling cobalt blue disolving gel windowpane I got sometime in the mid 80s I think. Beautiful stuff, if a little weak... needed about 3 of them... that and these very tiny bright orange microdots I got around the same timeframe, by far best cleanest acid I ever had, bar none... yes there WAS a difference, cant explain it but those 2 were clearly "better" somehow. God bless whoever made them. (And no, Ismene, I would not be affected in the slightest by your attempted "dirty trip" brainwashing. If you told me that in advance I would throw them right in your face... after I took them I would totally ignore you and let my own system be the judge.)

i have heard the windowpanes were made by the "clear light" group in the bay.....can anyone tell me about "clear light" l?

i think this was known to be super clean some super clean stuff too. that's interesting about Dwaynes comment about having to take 3 but still loving the product...

i agree that good l doesn't always need to be highly mic'd stuff

Dwayne what did you like so much about this stuff? can you go into anymore detail about the trip? how were the visuals on 3?

 

[PROZ4C]

I wonder if the LSD being made in the USA legally today is as good as Owsley's LSD was back in the day.

I can honestly say that having lived and dosed in the bay area back then, that there has never been anything as wonderful as Owsley's LSD was except for this green window pain I got in Japan in the early 80's.

Namaste

Some of it is...

Sadly a lot of it isn't

But weak acid is still better than no acid I'm never ungrateful...

I'll say this though, it's quite an experience when you do get a very potent batch.

Quite literally a single dose of LSD from California that some how made it's way to me ended up being the hardest / best trip of my life... and I usually go with 4-5 hits of everything else I've had, still strong but missed an almost intangible punch that the Cali hit's had...

Well it was in this weird ball like pill thing, much larger than a microdot yet still very small for a "pill" but not exactly a gelly I've had many of those so who knows how many ug someone packed into it coulda been many hits but it was sold as "a dose" or rather given to me!

Edit: NVM I just noticed you said "legally" and now I am quite confused lol... didn't even know LSD was still manufactured "legally" in the USA

 

[Ismene]

(And no, Ismene, I would not be affected in the slightest by your attempted "dirty trip" brainwashing. If you told me that in advance I would throw them right in your face...)

I would offer you them for free tho Dwayne. That way you'd probably take them and accept my brainwashing :D

 

[poopstation]

This is an argument that was debated ad-infinitum in the non-LSD ergoloid thread. Perhaps the human brain is sensitive enough to detect trace amounts of different non-LSD ergoloids in the presence of the overwhelming onslaught of LSD. I personally don't think it is. I just don't think the human brain receptors are that finely tuned.

I've always thought that the idea of impurities in LSD is down to set and setting. And particularly whether or not someone has told you beforehand "No bad trips on this, this is pure Sandoz baby" or "I made this in my bathtub with a can of fosters and some orange peel".

I think I could give someone the "purest" LSD ever made and tell them enough bullshit beforehand to make them have the most "unclean, dirty" trip they've ever had in their life.

i don't doubt what you say in the least bit. set/setting is all-important and can convince someone of even the "purest" LSD that it's dirty garbage. i think there are multiple sides to this coin. i'm personally a believer of LSD differing depending upon content of impurities. there's an LSD analogue thread around here that goes into great detail about LSD analogues and many of them are active in the ug range same as LSD. i won't argue one way or another because neither of us have the tools to pursue an actual answer to this question. we need access to analytical equipment and a considerable amount of LSD. so until we can begin to analyze samples coupled with trip reports from those sample batches, it will remain a mystery. it makes for an interesting discussion but until gc/ms is involved it will just be "around and around we go" unfortunately