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Why does LSD get a bad rep?

atara said:
And what the hell is phosphoroyl chloride?
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The thing that just bumped this thread up to seventh place on Google if you search for it ;)

Also, I've mentioned it many times before but what the hell, I had an uncle who died after jumping out of a window on acid in the late 60s. Whether he thought he could fly or not I could not say. I suspect he had other reasons but as he's dead I would be guessing just the same as anybody else who just hears the simple fact that he took acid then jumped out of a window and died. Pretty much all myths of any kind have some factual basis. Which facts are actual facts and which are conjecture is up for debate though.
 
this kid i know once told me that LSD made blood drip over your brain and then settle in the back of your neck in blood bubbles. He was quite serious. it took me some scientific proof (erowid of course) to convince him that what he thinks is not true.

i think people are misinformed and stupid.
 
People are misinformed but not necessarily stoopid. The major demonisation seems to be essentially a US thing so I tend to suspect it more a social thing tied up with other US Puritanical throwback shit. You guys just need to stamp out Christianity and Capitalism a lil. The rest of us seem to have made some headway on both of 'em but you fellas are lagging way behind ;)
 
People are afraid of losing control. Ironically, the vast majority of them were never in control to begin with. They go through life having no idea why they do things. Psychedelics can bring some of that "behind the curtain" action into consciousness and make you actually think about it; this is very frightening to the ego.

The popularity of urban legends about LSD is a symptom, not a cause.
 
Shambles said:
^ I assumed he was getting his facts from somewhere that knows the facts. So obviously not the ridiculous bullshit the US government spouts then. Psyches are not dangerous by any stretch. Slightly risky for a tiny minority, yes. Dangerous, no.



Hehe. Still tickles me when folks think you're some kind of backward moron cos they don't seem to see why anybody past puberty would bother with it. Always put it down to the low price myself - only drug you could buy with your penny sweets money. Suspect that's changed somewhat now though. Mainly cos kids get way more pocket money :D

Don't think I've ever seen acid portrayed in the UK media as anything other than summat to joke about - "that thing wot hippies used to take and talk to fairies and stuff" seems to be about as bad a rep as it gets here. More something to snigger about than be terrified of.
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come on, to be fair that's only because the acid in the UK has been piss poor since the 70s. your average £2.50 trip is struggling to reach 100 mics when an average dose is at least 250. I grew up thinking mushrooms were way stronger than acid because of this.
 
You are kidding, yes? Check the figures for acid purity/dose per tab - they have barely moved at all one way or the other since the 60s. In fact, average doses have actually risen slightly since then. Get better contacts ;)
 
There's nothing more infuriating and frustrating than those who spout crap about LSD, whilst holding their fifth or sixth pint in their hand. It's not even worth pointing out their hypocrasy.
 
we could setup a pro lsd website - to work on an even better lsd reputation :)
with a section like "works i did under the influence of lsd" or "ideas i've come across while tripping"
 
acid gets a bad rep when some kid out in Tuscon AZ has his friends quote that he loved acid And lucid dreaming after He gets a 9 and shoots a fucking U.S. Representative in the head. Read that shit in Time. I have seen kids get scared lust from reading that they basically put LSD as a scapegoat
 
Solipsis said:
It must be the supposed unpredictability, as if the trip is something that befalls you - they imagine you are victimized by the drug and its ungodly intoxication, ironically enough the opposite seems to be true if you learn to realize your own potential, be mindful aware and awake.

Loss of control is something that gives people fear with a capitol F... and well surrendering to the experience, sober or on acid, that can be a hard thing to do but an ultimate victory in life.
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Yep fearing loss of control, I think you hit the nail on the head there. Major bugaboo, just the thought of the concept just gives people the willies like some creaky old horror movie. I think its f-ing hilarious... people are SOOOO afraid that they are only barely maintaining sanity and just under the surface is some ultimate lunatic serial-killer mind-state just waiting to take over at which point they fear they will turn into a drooling raving out of control maniac.

What morons.

Really you NEED a couple strong trips to understand that evolution has created in MOST people a strong tendency towards homeostasis... you START to get some "Oh no..." feelings, but after a while you realize it was a case of "The only thing to fear is fear itself" and that you normally come out the other end through even intense trips just FINE thank you very much, and in fact much MORE steady and stable than before, as though you are some metal that became annealed and strengthened via a Trial By Fire. Makes you stronger and better and more understanding... it does NOT just make you insane, which shows you how pathetically LITTLE most people really truly know about themselves.

Also, its just the term "ACID" .... oooooh! scary! corrosive! dangerous! its dissolving your brain tissue!!! People are so ridiculously suggestible it is incredibly pathetic.
 
Shambles said:
You are kidding, yes? Check the figures for acid purity/dose per tab - they have barely moved at all one way or the other since the 60s. In fact, average doses have actually risen slightly since then. Get better contacts ;)
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"the figures"??? THE figures?

Sorry friend, but I say: Bullshit.

Where are you getting these supposedly "official figures"?

Anyone who knows anything about how actual scientific studies are done, and compare that to the random user-submitted samples to this or that testing program, would know that its all totally shotgun random scatter-shot self-submitted samples that dont prove anything one way or the other.

Each result tells you ONE thing and ONE thing only... something about THAT ONE SAMPLE. Nothing more. Absolutely ZILCH "big conclusions" can legitimately be drawn from this kind of info, sorry.

Besides I have heard that average doses in the 60s were more like 100-200mcg per hit, but nowadays finding blotter with as little as 25mg is getting to be VERY common. I thought that was unheard of when LSD was first appearing on the drug market.
 
The figures from tabs GC/MS tested after being recovered in drug seizures. Average has been around 60ug from the 60s to the present. Obviously there have always been plenty of tabs dosed higher and lower but 60ug is the average and always has been.
 
But that "average" doesn't really mean anything. Its totally affected by the pattern of when, where and how they make busts, who they bust, etc etc. How often they test it. How many of the actual hits they test. What they decide to publish and what they do not publish. Do they use the same exact lab and the same exact handling and testing and analysis procedures every time? Etc. These aspects are ALL totally UNKNOWABLE and yet they totally affect the resulting "average" and hence, the number has ZERO scientific or statistical or sociological meaning. Furthermore one can only assume that the number of hits confiscated on busts is VERY VERY TINY compared to the actual number that are being distributed. AND - if the person was selling bunk and the test came up ZERO, then they will not be charged and how do you know if they include THAT into the "average"??? All totally unknowable random influences. This this result is just a random figure posted by law enforcement with absolutely zero importance or actual context or provable scientific signficance and I would even say without ANY provable scientific truth. You have absolutely no evidence about the validity of the number, they could be using the "testing funds" to buy donuts and pornography and just making up those numbers and publishing them every so often just to cover up their malfeasance. ZERO controls or auditing on this supposedly official number. Hence it is totally without meaning or value.

Where exactly are you getting this authoritative figure?
 
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because LSD was a big part of the hippie movement and thus there is more propoganda on it.
 
Dwayne: Figures are from Erowid.

If tabs tested at 0% active ingredient the dealer is still charged as if it were actually acid same as if you get busted selling coke and it tests as 100% baking powder you get charged as if it were coke. That's the law in the UK anyway dunno about elsewhere. The figures are used in the prosecution so both the defence and prosecution lawyers tend to get tests done independently to make sure there's no funny business going on - especially if it's a major bust.

Obviously the 60ug figure is just an average but it has remained constant since the 60s so either police are very good at only busting enough people each year to make the figures neat or it suggests that doses per tab have remained broadly the same the whole time. Or there's another one of those huge conspiracies to convince the world that the average tab is moderately dosed.
 
I dont care if the figures are from Erowid. Unless I see a completely detailed accounting of exactly how the figure is arrived at and and analysis by a professional statistician it is STILL just a bunch of uncontrolled anecdotal BUNK masquerading as science. Bullshit I say and anyone who draws any wide conclusions from figures released by hard-core anti-drug LE forces is being very gullible and silly. There are NO controls or proof of any of it, and certainly NO analysis from a professional scientific statistical perspective that gives it any meaning whatsoever.

Dont you find it a LITTLE suspicious that a constant value of 60mcg per hit has been released over and over year after year over a period of 40 fucking years? Why why its almost as if the LE entities are just pulling this figure out of their asses and posting the same number to the media year after year because oh say perhaps to do so benefits them somehow.

Not NEARLY enough scepticism is being applied here. When you are dealing with "official figures" released by Law Enforcement about a drug that they have proclaimed all out "WAR" against, scepticism and disbelief are the ONLY proper attitudes to take.

I still say they just use the testing money to buy donuts and publish some bullshit "60" number year after year because they think it proves they are doing some important job.

Erowid has little choice but to take the number they are handed and repeat it. There is no proof it is real or true and there is ZERO proven documentation about its veracity and ZERO statistical analysis about its applicability or meaning.
 
As you said above, you can find tabs dosed as low as 20-30ug and most I've come across tend to be 100-150ug or so. Averaged that would be around 60ug then. The unusually high and unusually low doses cancel each other out and you get a moderate and realistic average. It also seems like a fairly reasonable average going from experience and figures from LE (and don't forget that the defence and the prosecution have separate tests done - why would they conspire and how do they get the different labs to go along with it?) and also from non LE testing services as well as from people I have known in the past who were rather heavily involved in LSD production and distribution. It also makes perfect sense that the average dose would remain broadly similar and would likely be relatively low - you make more money if people need to buy two or three to get a decent trip.

60ug seems very reasonable as an average figure to me - it fits with information from a variety of sources who all have very different and conflicting interests. And quite frankly would be a bizarre thing to be lying about even if everybody is lying about it. But believe whatever you want to believe. Can't say it bothers me one way or the other whether you believe it or not, to be honest.
 
Most blotter Ive gotten over the last 20 years has while very clean and from highly touted sources has needed about 4 hits for a minimally effective trip which makes me think the average is closer to 25mcg.

And I was just encouraging a greater skepticism of data figures released by forces whose job depends on the maintainence of an impression of consistent "threat" from drugs. I see no reason to believe "THEM" about ANYTHING to be honest. A pack of lying scumbags whose goal is to destroy our lives, and make themselves "heroes". Any info they release should be presumed garbage unless proven by independent sources to be valid.
 
the thread could also be titled "...good rep?" look at all the positive and supportive responses.
im sure in the SoberLight forum, there's a thread titled as such.
 
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