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mulungu mechanism?

O

onmyway

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Sep 11, 2009
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I just read another thread (on bluelight) about this plant called mulungu. After a cursory search of the bluelight forums and and google scholar I have not found much helpful information. The active molecule is supposedly erythravine:

Erythravine.png


Does anyone know anything about how this molecule acts as and anxiolytic? Could anyone propose a mechanism? Supposedly it is a tetrahydroisoquinoline, if that mean something to you chemists out there.
 
thanks for that bit, it sent me in a new direction. the morphinan derivatives seem to have a wide range of effects, but i think i'm noticing a theme. do you think (or know) that this compound has the right geometry in order to have similar pharmacology as some of the morphinan derivatives?

from what i read before i posted this i was thinking some kind of GABAnergic activity, because of the anecdotal reports i read. but the morphinan thing is interesting though.
 
Interesting, I had never heard of this herb.

I'm not sure if it could technically be considered a morphinan, but erythravine looks strikingly similar to Drotebanol, a synthetic morphinan with opiate activity.

200px-Drotebanol.svg.png


Regardless, structure can't always accurately predict effects, hell look at the salvinorins...

Given the subjective nature of the effects, I would still be willing to bet opiate receptors are out of the equation. Maybe some kind of sigma activation? There seems to be a good deal of that with the morphinans...
 
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/Meekly steps into room with minds far superior/addled than my own.

Very interested in finding out if a home extraction method is possible.
 
It was thought that the CNS effects were extended from its effects as a non-depolarizing paralytic agent. It may be an antagonist of acetylcholine receptors or nicotinic receptors.

You'll probably want to check out its similarity to Atracurium.
 
There are several isoquinolines that have demonstrated anxiolytic GABAergic action, IIRC, similar to benzos.

Seeing that this is an isoquinoline that people say feels like benzos, I find it very likely that ethyravine is a gaba agonist or positive modulator.
 
thats what i was hoping for. positive modulator sounds hopeful.

anyone know anything about what it takes to overdose? side effects? crossover with benzos/alcohol?

it would be really great to find something benzo-ish but as safe as kratom.

imagine a really effective anxiolytic that doesn't cause amnesia at higher doses, is legal, and easy to get. we all need this.


i had actually wondered about the possibility of it acting like nondepolarizing paralytic just because i read the tetrahydroisoquinoline article on wiki. but i hope that is not the case for this plant. while that might be medically useful, i really don't have use for a neuromuscular blocker.
 
I have tried this plant in many forms, including a 90% concentrated extract. Ive had the raw plant in a tea, as well as several other extracts. The extracts are lacking with the exception of the 90% which was a home run.

Unfortunately, its mechanism of action seems all to clear to be Gabaergic...in a very benzo manner. I would be shocked to discover that this substance does much more then bind to benzo receptors. It really does qualitatively feel indentical, esp at higher doses.

For this reason, I really dont see its advantage over just popping a xanax. Provided my assumption is correct, then this is just a benzo agonist, and at the end of the day, your body doesnt care whether is synthetic xanax binding to your benzo receptors, or if its a natural plant. The end result of prolonged use would be the inevitable addiction to benzos.

I could of course be wrong...but it REALLY felt like a benzo. Hence...I just dont see the point in using it over a traditional benzo.-DG
 
^ I too have tried a 90% mulungu extract a few times. It was awhile ago that i last had some. I thought it was Okay but it didn't do enuff for me to come back and buy it again obviously. I think that sometimes maybe u need the fresh root/herb when dealing with some entheogens for them to work to their fullest extent.
 
There's at least one study that shows an ethanolic extract enhances GABA activity in vitro, and produces responses expected of GABAergic in vivo.

But it's definitely not been studied enough.
 
Have used it in 90% extract and another extract formulation as well as tea from bark, and found bark the most useful. Will also vouch for it feeling pretty benzo like, although weak.

Anyone got anything to say about saturation? Always used it in moderation, but is it possible to keep on going to get a stronger effect?
 
N0 W4RN1NG said:
Interesting, I had never heard of this herb.

I'm not sure if it could technically be considered a morphinan, but erythravine looks strikingly similar to Drotebanol, a synthetic morphinan with opiate activity.
Click to expand...

there has to be 2 carbons between the quaternary carbon and the tertiary amine. I think because of the peptide precursors.
 
One more thing to add-

I find mulungu to feel very similiar to magnolia officinalis bark. I have a great 20X extract of this bark that is one of the best things ive found to take before bed.
I believe the main active of magnolia bark is honokiol, and Im pretty sure it contains a few other active polyphenols. I do know that honokiol has been studied and shown to be an effective anxiolytic.

I made a short post in OD about magnolia and suggested its use for those that may be suffering through benzo withdrawal or for those who want to curb their benzo habit.

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=477298

Anyone else have experience with magnolia? Do you also find it similar to mulungu?-DG
 
seep said:
there has to be 2 carbons between the quaternary carbon and the tertiary amine. I think because of the peptide precursors.
Click to expand...

no, it's not a morphinan because it's not a morphinan, because it doesn't contain the morphinan backbone. Nothing at all to do with precursors.

Morphine isn't made from peptides, anyway. It goes tyrosine --> norlaudanosoline --> reticuline --> salutaridine --> salutaridinol-I --> thebaine --> codeine --> morphine, in papaver species anyway. I assume someting similar in what animal tissues also produce it.
 
Hammilton said:
...tyrosine --> norlaudanosoline --> reticuline --> salutaridine --> salutaridinol-I --> thebaine --> codeine --> morphine...
Click to expand...

Holy fuck, poppies make use of tyrosine in morphine biosynthesis? 8o

That's fucking AWESOME. All hail mother nature!!!

And DG, interesting you mentioned magnolia, I recently purchased a standardized extract called relora which I also found surprisingly relaxing and useful for sleep. There's another plant in there too, but magnolia is the main anxiolytic; the other one is a cortisol modulator or something IIRC.
 
Holy fuck, poppies make use of tyrosine in morphine biosynthesis?

That's fucking AWESOME. All hail mother nature!!!
Click to expand...

How is that even surprising? Amino acids are the building blocks of life. DNA codes proteins, aka long strands of amino acids. You'll have a hard time finding anything more abundant in life, excepting of course water and oxygen, etc.
 
^^
do you know anything about the rates of these reactions? which is the limiting step? feedback? where do they take place in the cell? which cells?

this is purely theoretical and i would never do it, but i wonder if one could put extra thebaine into a poppy and push the pathway.
 
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