☠ WARNING ☠ Warning: Mislabeled Batch of 2C-B-Fly That Has Caused Deaths

[Shakti]

I feel like people are being emotionally over-reactive to this situation. If one is an adult and capable of measuring BDFly in safe doses and they wish to explore this compound, that is their prerogative. There is no sense in demonizing a powder, that's grossly missing the point here. Bromo-dragonfly may be poisonous many times over the recreational/therapeutic dose, but so is every single drug in existence. Bromo-dragonfly is not poison. While I have not consumed this batch, I have tried it twice. One of the times proved to be most useful to me and was exceptionally insightful. To write off bdfly and the potential experiences it facilitates would be a tragedy imo.

In the interest of harm reduction, we ought post information regarding safe trials with it. We ought give reasoned and objective information as to its safety. If we demonize it, how are we any better than the litany of other organizations that manipulate and fabricate information on drugs? People are going to do it. You all know this. Why not help people do it safely?

 

[dread]

I have no doubt that if LSD were widely distributed as a pure powder and mislabeled as was the case with the bromo-dragonfly, a lot more people would suffer similar fates.

LSD overdose is hard to accomplish unless the substance is taken by parenteral routes.

Most reports I've read of oral ingestion of high dosages of LSD (over 1 gram) have stated that the subject had compulsively vomited the LSD out almost instantly. And proceeded to trip some serious balls...

 

[delsymfan]

Yes. The same batch.
About the isomer, not sure. What is sure is that BDF dosing is not a sure thing (see the erowid two different dosages chart). So this one seems potent and starting at 120 ugs it looks like a winner.

Also, the effects he describes at this dose aren't so long lasting. I'd give you his trip report but it's in Spanish.

Please do. I can read it. I'm living in Peru

And also for those of you criticizing people who want to try this, here is all I have to say and then I'm done defending myself and this group in general:

If it is in fact BDF, then 1mg could very well be 4x a normal dose or more. If you take a 400% dose of something, many things honestly, you DIE. This is the case with many substances.

Everything has a safe profile. What if somebody goes and takes 100ug and has a fucking great trip, and everybody's flushed it because they are over-reacting.

If i died because I took 80mg of 2C-E would you stop using 2C-E? No, because you know that taking that dose is stupid.

We know that taking 1mg is probably not a good idea. We know that taking multiple MG's is stupid. And we know what to normally take with BDF. This is only stupid if handled without care.

 

[moniorojo]

Please do. I can read it. I'm living in Peru

Go back one page. I already posted it in English.

 

[vidaverde]

I really don't get it either. Substances don't kill people. ...

This is really disappointing. I thought this was a first class drug forum. I'm sorry people died. I'm sorry people ended up in hospital. But BDF is not to blame. People with names and surnames are to blame. I won't bother anymore with this thread. Blame me all you want for speaking my mind. I thought this place was all about speaking our minds.

guns dont kill people people kill people...
same reasoning youre using dude.

this is a 1st class drug forum, thats trying to save people's lives.
the victims of this event are NOT to blame.

to stop speaking your mind and encouraging the usage of this substance would help those trying to prevent future tragedies get their job done a lot easier.

if you want to help harm people go to another fourm.

 

[moniorojo]

guns dont kill people people kill people...

True.

this is a 1st class drug forum, thats trying to save people's lives.

True. If people logged in daily to check things out this wouldn't have happened.

the victims of this event are NOT to blame.

False. Blame goes three ways: China, Denmark and the user. I'm sorry Joanmiro and vidaverde but are you trying to tell me that licking your finger after weighting 3 different substances is a good policy?! I AM SORRY FOR WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU. I CAN RELATE. IT COULD HAVE HAPPENED TO ME a couple of years earlier when I had less experience with RCs but for god's sake: ADMIT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

to stop speaking your mind and encouraging the usage of this substance

I am NOT encouraging anyone to take this substance. I AM NOT EVEN GOING TO TAKE IT MYSELF because I don't have a proper scale for this. BUT, if anyone, as my friend, has a proper scale to measure a dose and feels inclined to do so IS FREE TO DO IT.

would help those trying to prevent future tragedies get their job done a lot easier.
if you want to help harm people go to another fourm.

I AM trying to help. I have been following this threat and giving up to date info from day 1. I feel offended you say I want to harm people but "just say no" does not work and has never worked (not even if you are a republican). As Shakti has said:

I feel like people are being emotionally over-reactive to this situation. If one is an adult and capable of measuring BDFly in safe doses and they wish to explore this compound, that is their prerogative. There is no sense in demonizing a powder, that's grossly missing the point here. Bromo-dragonfly may be poisonous many times over the recreational/therapeutic dose, but so is every single drug in existence. Bromo-dragonfly is not poison. While I have not consumed this batch, I have tried it twice. One of the times proved to be most useful to me and was exceptionally insightful. To write off bdfly and the potential experiences it facilitates would be a tragedy imo.

In the interest of harm reduction, we ought post information regarding safe trials with it. We ought give reasoned and objective information as to its safety. If we demonize it, how are we any better than the litany of other organizations that manipulate and fabricate information on drugs? People are going to do it. You all know this. Why not help people do it safely?

 

[Iodjini_dk]

guns dont kill people people kill people...
same reasoning youre using dude.

Ultimately, we would all be safer if none of us used any drugs. The drugs we use have little or no befinificial effects (physically at least). Apart from mental benefits we always take a risk to a certain degree ingesting strange substances. Yet it is an unreal scenario that we'd all stop using drugs. It is possible using drugs responsibly. You want to stop this problem by keeping people away from drugs? Well, we can all see the result of that policy in society today. Its just not realistic.

 

[Burn it up]

"All things are poison and nothing is without poison, only the dose permits something not to be poisonous. The dose makes the poison."
Some intelligent words from Paracelsus some of you should take in account.

We know it's bromo dragonfly, and there's a safe dose for it. It just has to be handled very meticulously because of the precision required to measure the ultra-low doses.

 

[Voltech]

Just out of curiosity... why can't I find this same graph on the site of Energy Control?

because this is info from the Lab. and the avarage drugusers didn't need to know/see this graph. People must know there is a batch of misslabeled drug on road. But only few people understand this graphic. this is the reason why it isn't on posted on the website of EC.

I ask for the graph to EC because I know people here in bluelight like this stuff.

 

[Voltech]

Thank you for the explanation. I assume the mass spectra of the two other humps can be attained? I agree that the impurities most likely are insignificant at the dosages that have been reported, but it would still be good to know what they are.

If that measurement wasn't taken, I assume in your example acetyl-2C-B and only acetyl-2C-B is an expected measurable byproduct of 2C-B synthesis using a known synthesis route, and, if so, it might also be expected from a known synthesis route of bromodragonfly that there would be roughly equal amounts of 2 and only 2 other chemicals in the mix that would show up on this test (for example, rather than only x chemical or x, y, and z chemicals in different relative proportions expected using other known synthesis routes)? If a certain synthesis route is implied by such a profile perhaps that gets us one step closer to identifying what the two impurities that can be seen by the test likely are and whether it's probable that there could be highly toxic impurities in this batch that might not show up on the test. Or are there just too many possibilities for such a correspondence to be strongly indicative of anything?

This are the results of this adulterated batch of 2CB I buyed this summer:



I don't know If the Lab had done the tests of the impuritys of the BRDRFLY. I`m very bussy this days. If I receive it I will post it.

 

[Shakti]

Voltech, or anyone really, I was wondering if you had any idea if the impurities in the B1 batch could be responsible for the discrepancy of the marquis reactions between the B1 and the stock bromo-dragonfly on that erowid picture? If not, what do you think is causing them to be so significantly darker?

 

[Voltech]

I will ask it. And also will ask about the GC/MS of the impurites.

 

[joanmiro]

moñorojo, delsymfan, shakti and others...

I take full responsibility for ingesting the material, and all of the consequences that may result.

I never placed the blame on anyone else, nor have I attempted to. Even in my experience report I say..."in a moment of heightened ignorance".

However, this is a touchy subject. People have died. Parents lost children and friends lost loved ones. People, myself included, have been hospitalized. We still don't know what, if any, permanent effects me and the other survivors will suffer.

Those affected have every right to be pissed off if people are taking this stuff. VidaVerde included. She saw first hand the effects it caused me to suffer through and has been worrying greatly about what's happening to me and others right now. Fact of the matter is, the whole situation upsets me a great deal as well.

The reason for this is, there is no reason to be dabbling with this batch. Regardless of if you think bromo-dragonfly is a worthwhile substance or not.

The simple fact is, even with the GC/MS results, we still do not know for sure that this batch of bromo-dragonfly is fit for consumption, even by those who view the compound as having value for use.

As others, with greatly higher levels of chemistry and pharmacological knowledge than I, have pointed out- certain things that might be in the stuff may have passed the GC/MS screening.

Additionally, Energy Control, the harm reduction group that has done the analysis has explicitly said that nobody should experiment with this batch. And this is not a 'just say no' organization. If you go on their website they explain in detail how to use a variety of drugs. Still, it is not safe to be experimenting with this batch. Period.

If this was 'normal' bromo-dragonfly I don't think severe intoxications and hospitalizations would have occured at the 1 milligram level, would they?

 

[moniorojo]

If this was 'normal' bromo-dragonfly I don't think severe intoxications and hospitalizations would have occured at the 1 milligram level, would they?

Good point.
Barstool Hooligan reported on those. He promised reports on those experiences. They would be of great help.

Those affected have every right to be pissed off if people are taking this stuff.

They have every right to be pissed off but not the right to tell people who, based on their own good knogledge, want to test the substance not to do so.

 

[invert]

If this was 'normal' bromo-dragonfly I don't think severe intoxications and hospitalizations would have occured at the 1 milligram level, would they?

Is it known how (and how precisely) the '1 milligram' doses were measured? And hospitalization can occur even at physically benign doses of any psychedelic, if someone experiences panic.

 

[joanmiro]

Ultimately, we would all be safer if none of us used any drugs. The drugs we use have little or no befinificial effects (physically at least). Apart from mental benefits we always take a risk to a certain degree ingesting strange substances. Yet it is an unreal scenario that we'd all stop using drugs. It is possible using drugs responsibly. You want to stop this problem by keeping people away from drugs? Well, we can all see the result of that policy in society today. Its just not realistic.

Not keeping people away from drugs. Nor even this chemical in particular, though I don't believe it has any redeeming qualities. But rather, from this single particular batch that has killed people, and hospitalized others who dosed in the 'safe' (according to erowid) range for bromo-dragonfly.

Is that so hard? Just forget about this one little batch of powder? Wait til some different bromo-dragonfly comes around, if you're so inclined to ingest such substances?

I don't think VidaVerde is, or would be for, prohibiting drugs of any type but for goodness' sakes can't people use a little common sense?

 

[invert]

Is that so hard? Just forget about this one little batch of powder? Wait til some different bromo-dragonfly comes around, if you're so inclined to ingest such substances?

It's not hard, but is it necessary? There seems to me to be no good reason to believe this is anything other than a case of people overdosing on bdfly.

 

[joanmiro]

Good point.
Barstool Hooligan reported on those. He promised reports on those experiences. They would be of great help.



They have every right to be pissed off but not to tell people who, based on their own good knogledge, want to test the substance not to do so.

True, we have no control over what anyone does, but we can let people know the frustration and displeasure we feel with them placing their lives at risk. This forum is to reduce harm, and that's simply what we are doing. Based on all the factors involved, I see no reason for anyone to test this specific batch, and it upsets me to find out that people seem to feel they have good reason to do so.

But you're right, in the end, it is the user's decision. We are just trying to help them make the safer one.

 

[joanmiro]

It's not hard, but is it necessary? There seems to me to be no good reason to believe this is anything other than a case of people overdosing on bdfly.

It seems necessary to me.

Erowid lists common oral dosage as 800 mcg to 1.3 mg.

People have suffered extremely toxic reactions from 1 mg.

Doesn't exactly seem like an overdose to me.

Though you are right, we don't know how their doses were measured. We just have to take their word for it. But isn't it like that with everything of this nature?

 

[moniorojo]

As others, with greatly higher levels of chemistry and pharmacological knowledge than I, have pointed out- certain things that might be in the stuff may have passed the GC/MS screening.

I would greatly appreciate if they told us what incredibly evil/toxic substances send people to hospital with under (suposedly) 1 miligram. My bet is: BDF itself sent them to hospital. They expected 2c-b effects and got a huge dose of BDF.