Anyone seen methamphetamine in the UK/Europe?

[Shambles]

Vaped peevee is relatively short acting - at least the initial intensity is but it'll still keep you buzing for another coupla hours or so to a lesser extent. It's not exactly difficult to take a single small toke every hour or so though - how fuckin' lazy are you?!? :D

Besides, after the first puff you mysteriously develop the energy to keep at it

MDOV is great

 

[Crankinit]

It's an issue of conveniance more than laziness (who could be lazy on stims?)

With meth, you can puff on a bowl, get all nice and wired, then go do whatever you're doing for a few hours. Work, party, whatever. With PV, you woudn't be able to use at work without drawing attention to the fact that you're going out to your car every hour or two, and clubbing would just be an exercise in frustration, as soon as you get inside, have a bit of a chat, a bit of a dance and suddenly you're wanting another smoke and have to head out of the venue and back to your car.

Of course snorting is always a more viable option, but it's just not the same

Anyway whatever, I'm not trying to start a PV v. Meth showdown, I hear a lot of good things about PV and intend to try it the moment I find a reliable source that I trust to not get me into trouble with the partypoopers at customs

Honestly, I think the difference is probably cultural, and I don't know enough about the drug scene in europe to know why meth never overtook regular speed as the amphetamine of choice. I'd say it's because you guys already get speed fairly cheap and can actually get coke for a decent price, but america has access to coke too and there's still a load of meth there. It's an interesting question.

 

[Shambles]

It is an interesting question and I do think that cultural issues are a big part of it. Will ponder some more

Also, I take my PV everywhere with me when I'm out and about - it's not easy to dose anywhere you happen to be if you put your mind to it

 

[neilios]

Yes, I still wonder why it hasn't hit the UK -

I can remember the British media (a good few years ago) making a big thing of it and the dangers etc. and also claiming it will be the next 'big problem', which it is clearly not.

I often thought while in OZ all these people are smoking lots of meth because they can't get cocaine (or cocaine freebase) - a thing I sorely missed while out there. However as mentioned it is available, and to my understanding, cheap in the USA which doesn't add up.

Also with regards to speed preference (something I have had little experience) it doesn't seem to explain it either - people in OZ have access to really strong speed (on the whole better than in the UK). They still choose Meth over Speed (although some people I met preferred classic phet) which goes against the preference thing - also these people all had jobs etc. and not just all the time in the world to fuck up!

Anyways, will probably never know, perhaps will be seeing more Meth in the UK in the upcoming years?


Also wondered if that MDPV stuff is worth a go, is it still legal?


Am gonna now watch Loius T programme with girlfriend,

 

[captain codshit]

I dont think they do have access to good sulph in Oz though! I was speaking to Sustanon whos stayed in Hungar and now stays in Sydney. He sais the drugs there are pretty crap compared to Europe! And theres no sulph only meth im sure he said. Apparently the sulph in Hungary was far better.

 

[Bella Figura]

Also wondered if that MDPV stuff is worth a go, is it still legal?

Its worth a go if you like stims, not to everyone's tastes, and it is legal in the UK, check out the MDPV megathread for more info.

One to be careful with because the doses are very low (5mg) and can easily lead to you binging on it, I find it as compulsive as coke.

 

[stygian]

As someone from america whos done his fair share of the shards (in days past) I don't really find it to be 'stronger' per se than amphetamine, but different, do as much as pleases you as the dosages are surely different. I like them both. As far as coming down, amp/meth comedown never ever bothered me until I had sobered up for a couple years. Now I find it rather rough.

 

[Bella Figura]

I've only met one person who's done Meth in the UK (was a one off sweet connection they found), he tried it and said it was the most euphoric drug he'd tried and had absolutely no comedown whatsoever.

Thank god it was a one off though, because he canes the shit out of everything.

I did meet a youth street drugs counsellor person who said that the Methamp scene in READING was HUGE. I find that very fucking hard to believe :D

She also said that cocaine and chocolate come from the same plant and thats why they act on the same receptors in the brain...

 

[stygian]

did you facepalm?

 

[Bella Figura]

Internally, her macho prick boyfriend was there so I didn't want to call her a stupid asshole.

 

[Inso]

So that's why the other night when I ran out of chocolate I was frantically running around the street looking for a 24 hour shop, never found one

 

[Crankinit]

I dont think they do have access to good sulph in Oz though! I was speaking to Sustanon whos stayed in Hungar and now stays in Sydney. He sais the drugs there are pretty crap compared to Europe! And theres no sulph only meth im sure he said. Apparently the sulph in Hungary was far better.

Actual amphetamine sulphate is quite rare here. Most of what is sold as 'speed' here is still methamphetamine, just in a powder/paste form instead of crystal.

As for sustanon, well, he has his opinions but from what I've heard from europeans I know the drugs aren't any worse here (except for coke :/ ) just far, far more expensive.

I do wish our laws were as lax as yours though. Mail order GBL and completely legal RC's? I'd kill for that

 

[MDMAhead]

I've never encountered meth in the UK, although I do remember seeing a couple of documentaries about 5 years ago, warning that a meth epidemic was imminent. It never seemed to happen (yet) though.

I have only deliberately taken meth once - it was during my first week in Australia, in early-2006. Me and a few friends had been to a dance festival, and then went back to my hotel room to smoke some weed. Unbeknown to me, a friend of a friend brought with him not only weed, but also a crackpipe and some ice! None of us (except the guy who owned the crackpipe and the ice) had ever even seen a crackpipe before, but it got offered around, and we all had a few hits. I probably had 4 or 5 hits. All it did was keep me awake for the next 2 days straight, and make my jaw completely lock shut - like a far more extreme version of the jaw-clenching you get from pills. I came to the conclusion that it was a pretty horrible drug - its just not the high I'm looking for at all.

I actually got to be friends with the guy who's crackpipe/ice it was, and he offered me it on a few occasions since then, but I always declined. As things stand, the only drug I've ever had a problem with is cigarettes, and I wish to god I had never smoked for the first time. I would hate to look back in a few years time and think 'I wish I'd never taken meth for the 2nd/3rd/4th time etc'. I've done it once, and have no desire to do it again. I did, however, smoke speed on a few occasions after that, and from what I have read on Bluelight, there's every chance it was actually just watered-down meth But I certainly never had a meth high as strong as when I smoked it deliberately.

I have a theory about why meth has taken off in Australia (but not in the UK). I think it's because pills are so expensive in Australia, so it makes economic sense for clubbers to use meth, whereas in the UK, people are quite happy to munch through 10 pills in a night. I think this problem has been exacerbated by the poor quality of pills in Australia in recent years, whereas (correct me if I'm wrong) you can still get relatively good quality meth.

Another possible reason why meth has taken off in Australia (but not in the UK) is that there is no crack in Australia, whereas there's loads in the UK. At the end of the day, in poor neighbourhoods with high-unemployment, youre always gonna get problems with drugs, whatever those drugs may be.

I actually just watched the Louie Theroux documentary - I found it interesting, as I do all his documentaries. The only disappointing thing (and I find this about most of his documentaries) is that he never comes to any conclusion, nor does he suggest any possible solution to the problem. I'd say the same thing about Ross Kemp's documentaries - I'd love to hear his personal views about the issues he documents - e.g. how to solve gang crime. Surely you'd think that documentary makers like Louis Theroux and Ross Kemp would be in a better position than most to suggest solutions to the problems they spend months filming?

Anyway, for all you Europeans who have never tried meth - you're really not missing out. Unless, of course, you want to stay awake for days on end, and have severe jaw-clenching.

Peace out.

 

[neilios]

Hey MDMAhead,

Think I agree with your ideas - pills are expensive in OZ (and not as good as I would have imagined / had heard) so economically might be cheaper to smoke shards (which although expensive can get alot from).

Crankinit - I was in Victoria and Queensland (mostly Brisbane) and met alot of people who prefferred sulphate to meth, both of which were readily available, although I am not Australian could be wrong and yes it seemed that a few times the 'sulphate' was just milky crystal meth (can tell from that taste, I like it!).

Is sulphate much harder to make than meth? If not then surely the preference thing doesn't hold up as it seems that, perhaps, in OZ people are choosing Meth over Sulphate?

Watch that docu now, was OK, was impressed by the couple who were on it long time and seemed pretty together - amazing how your body can adapt! I don't wanna go there though...

 

[Crankinit]

Crankinit - I was in Victoria and Queensland (mostly Brisbane) and met alot of people who prefferred sulphate to meth, both of which were readily available, although I am not Australian could be wrong and yes it seemed that a few times the 'sulphate' was just milky crystal meth (can tell from that taste, I like it!).

What you're buying almost certainly isn't sulphate though. The latest study found that I think 93% of speed seizures were methamphetamine.

What happens is there's a huge market for people who want to take stimulants but are turned off meth by the nasty reputation it has. So people crush meth and cut it with glucose, or get the wet/pasty leftovers from the cooking process, and sell it as 'speed' for the 'I'd never do ice!' crowd. Chemically, it's identical, but it's of a lower purity (and subsequantly lower price) and different consistancy and appearance.

I don't doubt there's probably the occasional batch of amphetamine sulphate around, but for all intents and purposes if you buy any form of speed here, it's methamphetamine.

I have a theory about why meth has taken off in Australia (but not in the UK). I think it's because pills are so expensive in Australia, so it makes economic sense for clubbers to use meth, whereas in the UK, people are quite happy to munch through 10 pills in a night. I think this problem has been exacerbated by the poor quality of pills in Australia in recent years, whereas (correct me if I'm wrong) you can still get relatively good quality meth.

Another possible reason why meth has taken off in Australia (but not in the UK) is that there is no crack in Australia, whereas there's loads in the UK. At the end of the day, in poor neighbourhoods with high-unemployment, youre always gonna get problems with drugs, whatever those drugs may be.

Honestly, I don't think the price of pills is a factor. Our pill price is massively inflated, but so is the price of meth. A night on meth isn't any cheaper than a night of pills, and if that night extends into the next day or turns into a bender (as it so often seems to ) then it'll generally end up more expensive.

I think the scarcity and absurd expense of cocaine 'is' a huge factor though. Powdered cocaine is far too expensive for regular use, so people who would otherwise gravitate towards cocaine instead will use meth. Coke is generally just an occasional indulgance and a status symbol.

Contrary to the reputation meth has in the US as a 'poor mans' drug, it's actually quite common among the middle/upper class. In fact of all of the heavy users I've known, most of them vary from middle class to fairly affluent.

I think there's also a cultural difference that lends itself towards stimulant use, for some reason downers aren't that popular here. The benzo/painkiller scene is much more contained, as is the heroin scene, for some reason Aussies really seem to gravitate towards uppers and party drugs.

So probably a combination of the ridiculous price (and low quality/availability) of cocaine and a culture of stimulant use is what leads to meth being such a big thing in Aus.

I have only deliberately taken meth once - it was during my first week in Australia, in early-2006. Me and a few friends had been to a dance festival, and then went back to my hotel room to smoke some weed. Unbeknown to me, a friend of a friend brought with him not only weed, but also a crackpipe and some ice! None of us (except the guy who owned the crackpipe and the ice) had ever even seen a crackpipe before, but it got offered around, and we all had a few hits. I probably had 4 or 5 hits. All it did was keep me awake for the next 2 days straight, and make my jaw completely lock shut - like a far more extreme version of the jaw-clenching you get from pills. I came to the conclusion that it was a pretty horrible drug - its just not the high I'm looking for at all.

Meth is a weird one like that, it can be very hit and miss. I'm not sure why the high varies so much, even when you're using the same batch it can give you massive, overwhelming MDMA-like euphoria one week, then a harsh, speedy buzz the next, then feel like nothing more than being kept awake another time. My first time I took it I was hit with the most amazing energetic euphoria, but I've had mates try it for the first time and just find it makes them unable to sleep. It must be a neurochemical thing, though I have no idea what the determining factor is. It 'can' be quite subtle though. There are times when you can take meth and feel almost normal, but then you look back at your behaviour and realise how out of it you actually were by comparison.

 

[neilios]

Hey Crankinit,

That makes sense what you say - I know that I have bought 'speed' in OZ that really was Meth (think I can tell by the smell) - however I know some real speed heads there (who are mostly IV users) who know the difference and don't touch meth; I saw alot of what I am pretty sure is classic sulphate etc. (pink and white batches) from bikies etc.

- the smell is strong and speedy, nothing like meth, would that be right, i.e. smell a bag of meth then a bag of speed and you can tell?
When I snort can taste the difference between meth and speed am pretty sure (although not a big user).

Definitely saw Meth though that wasn't shards but milky crystals (but easier to crush finer and so snort).. Mmm miss that dirty taste at the back of my throat

The price over there is crazy though! The whole time I was in OZ was gagging for some coke but never got it, hence ending up doing more speed/meth (which would fall in line with the reasons you give for people in OZ doing more Meth).

I really not majorly big on any phets though so just my 2 cents from what I have seen and tasted

So looks like Meth won't be big any time soon in the UK...

Wouldn't mind a pipe mmm watching that documentary did definitely make me crave it a little - probably good have no Meth here!

 

[Urbain]

I wouldnt trust myself to even have a tiny go at this stuff. This goes on the shelf with the H.

 

[neilios]

I don't think it is as bad as made out but definitely has potential for mass destruction given how long it keeps you up and the way can make people go a little loopy,

nice to smoke though

 

[jspun]

My understanding (and experience) is that it is a different high (Meth vs. Sulphate)

There is a thread pertaining to the highs from different amphetamines on BL:

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=454861

I think it is a addictive drug but alot of the info about it is drug propaganda. For me crack was more cumpulsive by far because the high was shorter.

There have been meth busts reported in the UK so its around. Big in the gay scene in particular.

Was wondering about base. How is it sold, in liquid measure (eg fluid oz) or by weight? What is the most common ROAs, is it usually smoked?

Although amph big on continent meth big ib former czechoslovakia. There is a scene that goes back decades for the drug nicknamed pervetin which was the german name for pharm meth in WWII.

Anyone come accross meth in the UK yet, seems to be a huge problem in america, and even australia/new zealand and parts of asia, im suprised it hasnt popped up in the UK yet, can it be got here?

Big in South Africa too where its called Tik. Short( and excellent) Al Jezeera segment on it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySLoAvfthIU

I think meth might even be easier to make especially when using pseudo as precursor (amp I think needs P2P). But my theory is people stick with whats familiar so thats why mandrax and yaba are pressed into pills even though people mostly smoke them and yaba is still formulated with cafeine and mandrax with diphenhydramine ( although benadryl increases methaqualone levels in blood). Captagon is still sold as the original chemical instead of just straight dexedrine or meth.

Off subject but San Diego is where meth got its start in the US. Fresno has a big scene but here it is entrenched (in light of thoreux docu that people mention):

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=452771

In the US it is mostly a working class drug but in San Diego there is more of a cross section than other places. In Oz, I believe its a stutus drug. Expensive.


Great question. I'm glad someone started thread.

 

[hexxx]

Big in South Africa too where its called Tik. Short( and excellent) Al Jezeera segment on it:

Hehe, I thought it was called Tik here too but all the dealers I asked didn't know what the hell I was on about. But I'm in Johannesburg where it's not very widespread, Cape Town is the land of the tik smoker. The dealers up North here in JHB all call it crystal or crystal meth, it comes in shards and costs a lot of money. Apparently Tik is very impure and never crystalline (or at least in immediate appearances), normally a white or brownish (yuk!) powder. The stuff they putting in the pipe seems to be a powder and the melted liquid looks strange as well, but I've never really smoked much (or out of a pipe like that) so it could be normal.