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💊 Drug Discussion 💊 Most Expensive Drug of All Time

Perkins : Reborn said:
So again, very unlikely to be on sale in Europe.
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Well, idk about that, because all you need is morphine base and glacial acetic acid that isn’t a watched chemical, and I watched a Vice documentary about some junkies in Eastern Europe that were scoring wild poppies out in the fields and cooking the sap down into an injectable solution; however, after their samples were lab tested they resulted in only readings of mostly morphine with some codeine in it as a part of the crude mix. Although, the dudes in this documentary didn’t strike me as very knowledgeable chemists at all, and honestly anyone with access to opium poppies could make black tar easily so long as they understand how to process it which isn’t very difficult to do. Extracting freebase morphine from the opium sap is the first step followed by reacting with the glacial acetic acid rather than trying to source/use acetic anhydride.
 
Again, why would we need that when the brown heroin readily flows from Aghanistan into Europe? They'd be stupid to even attempt it.

We don't have any demand for black tar in Europe.
 
Perkins : Reborn said:
Again, why would we need that when the brown heroin readily flows from Aghanistan into Europe? They'd be stupid to even attempt it.

We don't have any demand for black tar in Europe.
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The only reason I could think of why someone would seek it out and/or manufacture it is for the higher 6-monoacetylmorphine content which apparently is more potent than diacetylmorphine while also being more potent with longer legs…
 
Syntherize said:
Well, idk about that, because all you need is morphine base and glacial acetic acid that isn’t a watched chemical.
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diamorphine is a PRODRUG, 6-MAM is the active.

But you need not use AA to diacetylate morphine, dihydromorphine and other compounds where the esterification of a secondary hydroxyl moety is the goal. There are HUNDREDS of seeminly uncontrolled compounds that work as well and possibly even better than AA.
 
4DQSAR said:

diamorphine is a PRODRUG, 6-MAM is the active.

But you need not use AA to diacetylate morphine, dihydromorphine and other compounds where the esterification of a secondary hydroxyl moety is the goal. There are HUNDREDS of seeminly uncontrolled compounds that work as well and possibly even better than AA.
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but doesnt diamorphine also have activity on its own? or did i make that up in my head
 
4DQSAR said:

diamorphine is a PRODRUG, 6-MAM is the active.

But you need not use AA to diacetylate morphine, dihydromorphine and other compounds where the esterification of a secondary hydroxyl moety is the goal. There are HUNDREDS of seeminly uncontrolled compounds that work as well and possibly even better than AA.
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Yes, diacetylmorphine is a prodrug just as Tramadol is a prodrug to desmethyltramadol; however, diacetylmorphine’s binding affinity to the mu opioid receptor is poor, unlike Tramadol which still has its own characteristic effects when ingested, but even that will vary depending on individual metabolism just as codeine is a prodrug to morphine with highly variable metabolism in different populations.

P.S. Heroin is metabolized into not only 6-MAM, but 3-MAM as well, and this is why pure 6-MAM is nearly twice as potent while being more euphoric.
 
if etorphine is anything like morphine or heroin (produces a superior high to fent.. but has the potency of fent); this drug would be game changing to unleash on society and a gram would be extremely valuable
 
Dr. John Thackery said:
yea and it’s a morphine analogue and likely has the euphoria that fent lacks

this drug would be a game changer
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Etorphine is a Bentley compound just as buprenorphine is, and all the Bentley compounds are based around the morphine rule as well as being very potent milligram for milligram when compared to standard opiates.
 
Syntherize said:
Etorphine is a Bentley compound just as buprenorphine is, and all the Bentley compounds are based around the morphine rule as well as being very potent milligram for milligram when compared to standard opiates.
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but unlike bupe it’s a full agonist. non selective too which i really wonder what this drug is like.

i would literally pay ten thousand dollars for some of this shit man
 
Etorphine is actually a 3,14-bridged morphinan, it's mostly considered as a different class because it bind differenly from unbridged examples. Thebaine is the most common precursor (Diels-Alder gives the bridge).

R-30490 was shown to be the most active in vitro, but BU-72 may actually be the more potent, being a superagonist with an extemely high affinity. It's a bit muddled because being so complex, the stereoisomer resposible was incorrecly identified. Also too hard to make for any in vivo studies (as far as I know).

BUT is poteny in direct conflict with subjective action? My hypothesis is that it's occupancy time that is impotant. The binding-unbinding cycle being what produces the euphoria. But so far science has yet to test such a hypothesis.

After all, 14-methoxymetopon is 'only' x500 M but I suspect the occupancy time is no different to oxymorphine - but equally, I could be totally wrong.
 
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N0ph0n0 said:
Not just the states anymore, even montreal is being hit with tranq (mostly medetomidine). And while spice is rare, i once had the mispleasure of being given a bowl of "weed" by my "opp" (gangster wannabe who allways to fight) which ended up being spice.
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Spice was a big problem in the UK, particularly in the homeless population just around the time it was banned, and for a year or so after each of the subsequent variants got banned, until eventually all of them did, in the one fell swoop of the NPS Act in 2016. The vendors were virtually giving these substances away in last minute fire sales as the ban dates loomed, and they clearly had huge bulk that they had not shifted.

These drugs were never very popular amongst most recreational users, as they tended to be unpleasantly fierce, and unpredictably strong. However, it seems logical to assume that a number of dealers or criminal gangs took advantage of the availability of the substances at ridiculously cheap prices for kilos of the stuff. They ended up finding a market for these drugs among the homeless populations who could get utterly annihilated for hours at a time, for very little cost.

These substances were also available throughout Europe, in the mid 2010s, but I don't know if the same things happened to the same extent that it did in the UK, in other European countries.

The spice variants were also available in the USA, but I really don't know how much they did or did not gain any traction, amongst different populations.

I do recall that there were lots of threads about spice, and all of it's subsequent variations on EADD and other sections of bluelight back in the day. Many posts were from USA users IIRC. Not sure how representative that might have been of the bigger picture of what was happening over there. Obviously the USA has a much larger population than the UK, so there were bound to be more posts from American users, although of course that doesn't necessarily mean that a greater proportion of the population was using these things,.

I think the spice variants would probably take the crown for the cheapest drug of all time. At prices something like £5 per kilo for the pure powders.. (I cant remember exactly, but it was certainly incredibly cheap.) And a little of that stuff would go a very long way. Just dissolved in acetone and sprayed onto plant matter, or weed, there'd have been thousands of little bags of that stuff produced for next to zero cost. The acetone would evaporate, leaving the plant matter coated in spice, often very unevenly, leading to 'hotspots' in the bags, that would take people's heads off. As we saw.
 
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4DQSAR said:
Etorphine is actually a 3,14-bridged morphinan, it's mostly considered as a different class because it bind differenly from unbridged examples. Thebaine is the most common precursor (Diels-Alder gives the bridge).

R-30490 was shown to be the most active in vitro, but BU-72 may actually be the more potent, being a superagonist with an extemely high affinity. It's a bit muddled because being so complex, the stereoisomer resposible was incorrecly identified. Also to hard to make for any in vivo studies (as far as I know).

BUT is poteny in direct conflict with subjective action? My hypothesis is that it's occupancy time that is impotant. The binding-unbinding cycle being what produces the euphoria. But so far science has yet to test such a hypothesis.

After all, 14-methoxymetopon is 'only' x500 M but I suspect the occupancy time is no different to oxymorphine - but equally, I could be totally wrong.
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what do you think the non selectivity of etorphine would impart to the subjective effects vs more mu selective opioids?

kappa agonism all i know about first hand is salvia, which is patently dysohiric but wild. i wonder if etorphine would be like a combo of heroin and slavia. has anyone every combined heroin with salvia to actually make the experience more comfortable?
 
Bleaney said:
Spice was a big problem in the UK, particularly in the homeless population.
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Massive problem. We kept noting crack users saying if spice was always available, they would choose spice. I guess £5 for hours of whateveritdoes is cheaper?
 
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