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Gun Pulled & Man Maced As Neo-Nazi Protestors Surround Family Drag Storytime Event

swilow said:
I'm Australian. There is more to the world than the US. Beyond that, your ranty post didn't really convince me of much.

Anyway, I'm talking about the centre philosophically, not in terms of any one particular candidate or political party.
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Exactly.
 
nepalnt21 said:
can you link it? can't find what you mean, prolly just not adept enough with the keywords.
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I posted it above. It’s standard operating procedure for the feds. It’s funny how the Middle East terrorism threat disappeared, and now it’s ‘white nationalists’. It’s all fake and gay, it’s all so very tiresome.
 
swilow said:
I'm Australian. There is more to the world than the US. Beyond that, your ranty post didn't really convince me of much.

Anyway, I'm talking about the centre philosophically, not in terms of any one particular candidate or political party.
GHBn op
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Ahhhhh, good ole Australia!!! The country founded by prisoners yet, who have been ruled by the conservative "Liberal Party" (not "liberal" as it sounds boys! They're the conservatives in that country,) for 50 of the last 73 Years! A country with its own borderline stormtrooper police forces, handing out 30-year sentences for drugs like they're handing out middle-of-nowhere barren infertile land to their horribly repressed indigenous populations! They love to censor and outright forbid films and other artistic creations.

I happen to not be in America either; America was referenced as the subject matter was American, and by pointing out the comparative differences in left/right on other world countries, I was in no way not seeing the whole world as American.

Nelson Mandela once said (preceeded by Dostoevsky) that:
It is said that no one truly knows a nation until one has been inside its jails. A nation should not be judged by how it treats its highest citizens, but its lowest ones.
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I suggest you take a look, and CARE about your own madhouse, violent prisons, where decades upon decades of prison-time are being sentenced for harmless drug transactions. The "center" is no place to be, as it takes no position on the things that matter in this world, most notably, human suffering.
 
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trevrett said:
who have been ruled by the conservative "Liberal Party" for 50 of the last 73 Years! A country with its own borderline stormtrooper police forces
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Our conservative party isn't particularly conservative by worldwide standards.

handing out 30-year sentences for drugs
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That's heavy trafficking sentences, like pushing many, many kilograms over the (international) border.

like they're handing out middle-of-nowhere barren infertile land to their horribly repressed indigenous populations!
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That useless Holy land comes with mineral rights worth shitloads of money.

They love to censor and outright forbid films and other artistic creations.
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We certainly have some crazy conservative attitudes towards certain things. I'm not denying that.

I do think people here have a really distorted perception of Australia, though, particularly post-pandemic.

human suffering
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Australia and America are hardly the worst examples of human suffering in the modern world.

decades upon decades of prison-time are being sentenced for harmless drug transactions
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Trafficking large quantities of drugs will lead to x amount of overdoses and deaths and also x amount of deaths as a result of botched transactions down the line. You can just shrug and say that's not your fault, but then you're no better than the big corporations. Big pharma isn't as bad as the cartels, because it's regulated. So, it's legalization's fault for not letting you sell heroin in a poor neighbourhood. People have the right to have easy access so they can become enslaved by this chemical... Give me a break.

If you move large quantities of dangerous drugs, you're making money at the expense of addicts.

It's like robbing a bank with loaded guns. Somebody might get shot. You're gambling with other people's lives.

If corporations need to be accountable, so does everyone.
 
trevrett said:
I suggest you take a look, and CARE about your own madhouse, violent prisons, where decades upon decades of prison-time are being sentenced for harmless drug transactions. The "center" is no place to be, as it takes no position on the things that matter in this world, most notably, human suffering.
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The centre does no such thing. For me, its not about simply being moderate but more taking what is good from both sides of politics without having to identify with either wholesale. For example, I'm socially progressive and believe people should be free to be who they want to be to the extent that noone is harmed, and I also think we should have the right to limit immigration.

Caring about human suffering is important but I don't see any side having a monopoly on that. The truth is that left and right both care about humanity, but they have competing moral structures and care about different elements of it.

It's actually really hard to see what we're disagreeing about here. I suppose I just find your polemic counter-productive.
 
swilow said:
For example, I'm socially progressive and believe people should be free to be who they want to be to the extent that noone is harmed
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Ok so should trans women be able to compete in womens sports ? Cause it seems pretty harmful to women….and should they be able to use the womens bathroom, cause seems pretty unfair and potentially harmful for little girls and even grown women….and if by “competing moral structures” you mean one side based their morals on reality and the other side bases them on what any nut job says is reality …
 
Las Veghost grower said:
Ok so should trans women be able to compete in womens sports ? Cause it seems pretty harmful to women….and should they be able to use the womens bathroom, cause seems pretty unfair and potentially harmful for little girls and even grown women….and if by “competing moral structures” you mean one side based their morals on reality and the other side bases them on what any nut job says is reality …
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No, transwomen certainly shouldn't compete against biological women and probably shouldn't use female bathrooms.
 
swilow said:
No, transwomen certainly shouldn't compete against biological women and probably shouldn't use female bathrooms.
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It’s a shame more “adults “ can’t see where to draw the line, they just say more more more progressive, anything less is racist racist sexiest nationalism etc. we are supposed to keep each side from going to far. That’s the whole point in the right in left. 15 years ago when I was in high school, you wouldn’t be hated for saying that you thought abortion was generally wrong, but there could be circumstances it could be appropriate. Now, if you don’t think women should have unlimited abortions, paid for by tax dollars, you’re a sexist scum who hates women and wants to own their bodies or some bs. Where did we go so wrong
 
GeorgeWashington said:
It’s a shame more “adults “ can’t see where to draw the line, they just say more more more progressive, anything less is racist racist sexiest nationalism etc. we are supposed to keep each side from going to far. That’s the whole point in the right in left. 15 years ago when I was in high school, you wouldn’t be hated for saying that you thought abortion was generally wrong, but there could be circumstances it could be appropriate. Now, if you don’t think women should have unlimited abortions, paid for by tax dollars, you’re a sexist scum who hates women and wants to own their bodies or some bs. Where did we go so wrong
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Extreme views get attention, and our algorithmic masters reward that.

I would say both sides are trying to impose their own degree of authoritarian mind control. The right call anyone who supports transpeople "groomer", the left calls anyone who doesn't fully support transpeople "bigot". At least from where I stand, both sides have been fatally corrupted. But I think the left is worse atm, and I'm largely sympathetic to progressivism. I never anticipated that it would get so dictatorial.

To reduce this polarisation, I think we need to recognise that those who disagree with us aren't immoral monsters. They are probably/usually highly moral, ethical people who simply weight specific values differently. We have to share society with each other and so we're either going to compromise or go to war. But as it stands, both sides are only making the other side worse by refusing to see the humanity of the other. The feedback loop we're stuck in needs to be interrupted or it's going to screech out of control and lead to something horrific.
 
GeorgeWashington said:
Now, if you don’t think women should have unlimited abortions, paid for by tax dollars
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this is NOT a serious or common position.

don't worry, not only are we precluded from using tax dollars for abortions by federal law, but 'full term elective' abortions are supported by only a small minority.
swilow said:
and probably shouldn't use female bathrooms.
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so you think trans women should be forced to use the mens' bathroom, where they are (at the very least) going to be harassed?

even 'team t.e.r.f.' david chappelle doesn't believe that.
 
nepalnt21 said:
so you think trans women should be forced to use the mens' bathroom, where they are (at the very least) going to be harassed?

even 'team t.e.r.f.' david chappelle doesn't believe that.
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Should a person with a penis be able to get naked in front of teenage girls in a changing room? What if that is upsetting or threatening to them? I mention that specifically because its happened. Guess who was offered a different change room?

I'm not sure what to think, hence my "probably", so while I dispute the certainty with which you say trans women are "going to be harrassed" in a male toilet, I certainly agree it's a possibility, and if we can avoid that, we should. But does the cost of our avoiding that have to be the right of girls and women to safety and privacy? If so, why? I mean, i concede that there isn't great evidence for transwomen actually harassing women in public toilets or change rooms (though it has happened), but there also isn't great evidence for men harassing transwomen in those same spaces- (although im sure it has happened.)

It's not clear to me what is correct here, although i tend to side with that which protects a majority of people. In this case, I'm feeling an uncertain but relatively convinced pull towards protecting biological women, as much as it actually pains me to turn away from people who clearly also need protection. I'm open to being swayed by arguments that would take me the other way though but I've yet to encounter very convincing ones.
 
nepalnt21 said:
wow, trans activists spoke out against ryan webb's transphobic theatrics? go figure...
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Why is Webb different than anyone else ?
Can those activists look into Webbs soul and see Webb's motives or are they just judging people?
Why is it different when a non activist says someone isn't what they claim. Seems awfully hypocritical if you ask me. I thought that everyone's lived reality is valid and should be accepted as authentic.
 
Cheshire_Kat said:
I thought that everyone's lived reality is valid and should be accepted as authentic.
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not when it's blatant bigotry/ political theatrics, where's the confusion?

incidentally, when did anyone (of consequence) seriously say you could change your skin color (without actually having changed your skin color)?
 
Seems to me that no-one actually knows what Webb's intentions are. Is it within the realms of reality that Webb just came to this decision and has plans to transition ?

Where's the acceptance ? Sounds like ideology driven points of view to me. They themselves are guilty of bigotry and hate.
 
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