☮ Social ☮ PD Social Tripping Thread: Tripping Past 2020

[Kaleida]

 

[Kaleida]

 

[ecstacylover]

I had my first high dose experiment with MXE yesterday and I have to agree, it is hands down the best dissociative out there. I did 50mg MXE (sublingually) and it was unbelievable, I can totally see why people would write a book about it. It's so incredibly euphoric, profound and introspective while still retaining clarity, and the body feeling is so comfortable. I did have a very high heart rate on the comeup (I went for a run before I took it, maybe that wasn't the best idea) and some bothersome nausea but overall this is one of the greatest drugs I've ever tried. Probably one of the most addictive drugs for me, too. I had a strong urge to do more when I woke up today but resisted because I don't have much more and I want to preserve my last dose or two. That's something quite unsual for me and I've tried various addictive drugs before that without any issues (Heroin, GHB, etc.). I really don't know if I could behave myself if I had an unlimited supply of this one.

Sounds like good MXE.

The problem with about 99% of the stuff being sold ever since the ban is that it's been cut to shit. Like 20% purity at best. I've seen reports of people who came to the scene late, and then trying MXE for the first time and saying it sucked, but I think it was just that the MXE they got was very weak. The ridiculous amount of iterations the MXE thread here had speaks for itself.

Oh yea, speaking of running before you took it, it's sad to say but the last time I ran a mile was on a solid dose of MXE. That couldn't have been healthy. My girlfriend back then was big into running and I was basically on MXE all day long so anything I did I did on MXE. I'd go to the bar with her and her friends and feel sober, but apparently to the outside world it didn't appear that way. One of her friends apparently thought I was mentally disabled for the longest time because I was always on it.

 

[Kaleida]

I've seen reports of people who came to the scene late, and then trying MXE for the first time and saying it sucked, but I think it was just that the MXE they got was very weak.

For what it's worth, I used the pre-ban stuff and was still unimpressed. I don't think it sucks but I never understood why people think it's so great, just why it's addictive.

Most of the people I've ever met who don't think methoxetamine is the greatest thing ever thought that 2'-Oxo-PCE was the best dissociative instead. I am in the same boat. It just beats methoxetamine in a lot of simple ways for me like lasting longer, having a clearer headspace, and being more visual, while otherwise seeming like a similar high.

 

[Pfafffed]

For what it's worth, I used the pre-ban stuff and was still unimpressed. I don't think it sucks but I never understood why people think it's so great, just why it's addictive.

Most of the people I've ever met who don't think methoxetamine is the greatest thing ever thought that 2'-Oxo-PCE was the best dissociative instead. I am in the same boat. It just beats methoxetamine in a lot of simple ways for me like lasting longer, having a clearer headspace, and being more visual, while otherwise seeming like a similar high.

Hmm, well now you've got me me curious about a new dissociative lol. I did enjoy low doses of MXE, but didn't love it when the dose went up. I kept meaning to revisit it at a high dose, but never did.

 

[Psychestim]

Most of the people I've ever met who don't think methoxetamine is the greatest thing ever thought that 2'-Oxo-PCE was the best dissociative instead. I am in the same boat. It just beats methoxetamine in a lot of simple ways for me like lasting longer, having a clearer headspace, and being more visual, while otherwise seeming like a similar high.

Hm, I've heard that comparison quite a few times before but to me O-PCE didn't really feel like methoxetamine at all. Granted, I've only taken it a handful of times and never did it sublingually. O-PCE is quite good actually but I just think it's way colder, less emotional and much more stimulating than MXE. I only tried insufflation and vaporization of O-PCE with the latter ROA being vastly superior imo, because it makes it much more euphoric and cuts off the residual stimulation a bit.

 

[Kaleida]

Hmm, well now you've got me me curious about a new dissociative lol. I did enjoy low doses of MXE, but didn't love it when the dose went up. I kept meaning to revisit it at a high dose, but never did.

2'-Oxo-PCE is awesome, it has my recommendation... at least, as much as any arylcyclohexylamine would, since I generally try not to recommend them, but when you're already interested, it's a good option. Quite a lot of people in general do like it too and consider it to be particularly powerful, for whatever that's worth.

I felt similarly about methoxetamine. I would rather take 10 mg as a utility than literally any other painkiller or anti-anxiety drug I've ever experienced. If it weren't for the organ damage potential I would want it as my alcohol replacement most of the time. Higher dosages are enjoyable and sort of psychedelic-like, but I just find it rather bland given that. It reminds me of psychedelics like 4-HO-MET and 2C-C which are of course also really popular and enjoyable enough to be worth repeating but just don't seem as deep as other things to me, and I don't care for dissociatives as much as psychedelics so it's less on my radar even than those things.

One day I'd like to try methoxetamine again, but I'm not in any rush. It'll show up again one day when the markets shift, 2C-B and DOM weren't always easy to get.

Hm, I've heard that comparison quite a few times before but to me O-PCE didn't really feel like methoxetamine at all. Granted, I've only taken it a handful of times and never did it sublingually. O-PCE is quite good actually but I just think it's way colder, less emotional and much more stimulating than MXE. I only tried insufflation and vaporization of O-PCE with the latter ROA being vastly superior imo, because it makes it much more euphoric and cuts off the residual stimulation a bit.

The way you describe the difference is the way most people describe the difference and it sounds negative, but I'm actually describing the same difference but just in a positive way. The "warmth" that people talk about on methoxetamine to me feels relatable to a high on oxycodone or MDMA and I consider it one of the biggest downsides to the trip, it makes me feel and act retarded (like how ecstasylover's girlfriend's friend thought of him, not the first time I've heard that kind of complaint about it). The "colder, less emotional" nature of 2'-Oxo-PCE makes it feel far more grounded and like a potentially actually useful trip and is in my opinion one of the best things about it.

I've actually only taken it orally and never felt the need to do anything else. I also only ever got to have a short-lived supply of that but wish I had a bit more to answer just a few more questions it, though I don't actually seek it out just because I don't seek out any arylcyclohexylamines anymore.

 

[Mjäll]

O-PCE is one of the best drug names, never tried it but it really suggests narcotic vapors and a mystery well / oracle connotation

 

[ecstacylover]

Most of the people I've ever met who don't think methoxetamine is the greatest thing ever thought that 2'-Oxo-PCE was the best dissociative instead. I am in the same boat. It just beats methoxetamine in a lot of simple ways for me like lasting longer, having a clearer headspace, and being more visual, while otherwise seeming like a similar high.

O-PCE always felt like higher doses of 3-MeO-PCP to me. I was never really ever able to get much of a reality shift from it, although looking back I probably wasn't taking large enough doses considering my tolerance back then. Definitely a clearer headspace than MXE, which I think I would appreciate more these days, but it always gave me migraines so I kind of gave up on it.

I never found O-PCE euphoric in the slightest though, whereas MXE was so much more euphoric than any other dissociative for me.

 

[Kaleida]

O-PCE always felt like higher doses of 3-MeO-PCP to me. I was never really ever able to get much of a reality shift from it, although looking back I probably wasn't taking large enough doses considering my tolerance back then. Definitely a clearer headspace than MXE, which I think I would appreciate more these days, but it always gave me migraines so I kind of gave up on it.

I never got to try 3-MeO-PCP sadly, I had it coming once but the package never arrived. It contained some methoxetamine too, which is the real bummer.

I don't have a very high dissociative tolerance and most of what I have comes from nitrous oxide, so arylcyclohexylamines usually hit me like new whenever I use them. I only went up to I believe either 25 or 30 mg of 2'-Oxo-PCE orally but it was near impossible for me to walk or see straight during the peak at that point. I had my most immersive and transporting realistic closed eye hallucinations of any dissociative so far on 2'-Oxo-PCE, although I've yet to be one who gets those kinds of effects easily or much on any dissociative. It felt really notable to me though, especially because unlike ketamine or DXM for me at the out-of-body point there was no psychological dissociation like watching a movie, but rather it just felt like still being me and doing something myself but somewhere else. It's been best for me walking around and treating it more like a psychedelic though, spending its longer duration staying up at night just getting really lost in thought and enjoying the stronger nature of its visual distortions in the dark. It also makes me like a lot of really chill music that I don't listen to much otherwise.

I never found O-PCE euphoric in the slightest though, whereas MXE was so much more euphoric than any other dissociative for me.

This kind of gets back to what I was saying about the warmth vs coldness for me, but I just don't find that to matter personally. The thing about certain dissociatives like methoxetamine and 2'-Oxo-PCE for me at least is that I find their intoxication to feel a lot like being really drunk but cleaner (similar to nitrous oxide in that way too but I think the comparison to alcohol is more obvious when taking them orally and having it last for an extended time) and even though methoxetamine does have this extra euphoria, 2'-Oxo-PCE still totally fucks me up in a way that's still alike and better than alcohol for me, and it doesn't feel lacking to me at all for not having that added feeling that methoxetamine has. To me it's one of the drugs that truly feels the most like alcohol and a psychedelic at the same time, which I think is cool. Another good one for that for me is memantine, but it lasts way too fucking long to be viable, and is still less recreational than 2'-Oxo-PCE, although at least it doesn't seem to have any known toxicity problems. (I really wish someone would manufacture and release a short-lived memantine analogue honestly, I'd totally want that.)

Methoxetamine is insanely euphoric no doubt. That's why it didn't last me more than a week.

 

[ecstacylover]

I don't have a very high dissociative tolerance and most of what I have comes from nitrous oxide, so arylcyclohexylamines usually hit me like new whenever I use them. I only went up to I believe either 25 or 30 mg of 2'-Oxo-PCE orally but it was near impossible for me to walk or see straight during the peak at that point. I had my most immersive and transporting realistic closed eye hallucinations of any dissociative so far on 2'-Oxo-PCE, although I've yet to be one who gets those kinds of effects easily or much on any dissociative. It felt really notable to me though, especially because unlike ketamine or DXM for me at the out-of-body point there was no psychological dissociation like watching a movie, but rather it just felt like still being me and doing something myself but somewhere else. It's been best for me walking around and treating it more like a psychedelic though, spending its longer duration staying up at night just getting really lost in thought and enjoying the stronger nature of its visual distortions in the dark. It also makes me like a lot of really chill music that I don't listen to much otherwise.

That sounds quite enjoyable and in line with a lot of the reports I've read about O-PCE. I actually had high hopes for it, but for whatever reason it just never clicked with me.

This kind of gets back to what I was saying about the warmth vs coldness for me, but I just don't find that to matter personally. The thing about certain dissociatives like methoxetamine and 2'-Oxo-PCE for me at least is that I find their intoxication to feel a lot like being really drunk but cleaner (similar to nitrous oxide in that way too but I think the comparison to alcohol is more obvious when taking them orally and having it last for an extended time) and even though methoxetamine does have this extra euphoria, 2'-Oxo-PCE still totally fucks me up in a way that's still alike and better than alcohol for me, and it doesn't feel lacking to me at all for not having that added feeling that methoxetamine has. To me it's one of the drugs that truly feels the most like alcohol and a psychedelic at the same time, which I think is cool. Another good one for that for me is memantine, but it lasts way too fucking long to be viable, and is still less recreational than 2'-Oxo-PCE, although at least it doesn't seem to have any known toxicity problems. (I really wish someone would manufacture and release a short-lived memantine analogue honestly, I'd totally want that.)

Interesting. There's definitely been times when I've had more than a couple drinks and I began recognizing elements that would typically be observed in a dissociative experience. Going in the other direction though, I'd never really stopped and considered the dissociative experience a replacement for alcohol. I guess looking back there's definitely been many times when I using dissociatives in a social setting essentially as an alcohol substitute. The problem with dissociatives is that they tend to dose-dependently impair your auditory processing, verbal communication, and non-verbal communication cues, with the end result being that they don't really facilitate interpersonal communication, which is sort of the primary purpose of alcohol, although I guess people use alcohol for many other purposes than just that.

Memantine is one I'd love to try just because it's pharmacology is so different than most dissociatives and I'd love to see how those differences affect the subjective experience, but yeah the long duration is a huge turn off.

 

[Kaleida]

That sounds quite enjoyable and in line with a lot of the reports I've read about O-PCE. I actually had high hopes for it, but for whatever reason it just never clicked with me.

Different strokes. I also haven't tried that many different arylcyclohexylamines given everything that's out today, so it's not very hard for me to really like the few that I have in ways that others might think of better options for.

Interesting. There's definitely been times when I've had more than a couple drinks and I began recognizing elements that would typically be observed in a dissociative experience. Going in the other direction though, I'd never really stopped and considered the dissociative experience a replacement for alcohol. I guess looking back there's definitely been many times when I using dissociatives in a social setting essentially as an alcohol substitute. The problem with dissociatives is that they tend to dose-dependently impair your auditory processing, verbal communication, and non-verbal communication cues, with the end result being that they don't really facilitate interpersonal communication, which is sort of the primary purpose of alcohol, although I guess people use alcohol for many other purposes than just that.

Memantine is one I'd love to try just because it's pharmacology is so different than most dissociatives and I'd love to see how those differences affect the subjective experience, but yeah the long duration is a huge turn off.

Oh yeah, alcohol has been very dissociative for me, although I haven't gotten that drunk in a long time now. I've even had a couple notable experiences where getting extremely drunk and smoking cannabis at the same time got a little bit hallucinogenic in an out-of-body way, but mostly it's just been obvious through its headspace and sensory distortions and detachments when really approaching the point where it's almost too much alcohol. Dissociatives helped me learn that the spins don't have to be bad if you can manage to bring them out while riding the edge just enough to not push yourself over into the physical sickness. A bottle of red wine and lots of pot usually gets me there pretty well without much hangover risk. The main time I remember it getting really trippy, I got home one night from a party and smoked up and leaned back in bed and suddenly was walking through a forest following a glowing golden scarab beetle down a beaten path... but then I snapped out of it. Was weird lol.

The dosages I use as alcohol replacements aren't very high, I could definitely get away with around 10 mg of either methoxetamine of 2'-Oxo-PCE for it. That much methoxetamine would be a good buzz replacement for me whereas 25 mg reminds me of the time I drank straight Jack Daniel's until looking out of my friend's apartment window felt like being in Las Vegas for some reason. 10 mg of 2'-Oxo-PCE is already strong for me but not that heavy, I've taken it with friends who were tripping and one of them also drinking at the same time and it was great, it got me into a state that I otherwise only recognize from getting really satisfyingly drunk at a party with old friends, and feeling even cleaner and more peaceful inside. I do think dosing too high would make it far more difficult to be social but it hasn't been tough for me at these levels, and I actually find them to feel quite disinhibiting in alcohol-like ways, although plus the slightly psychedelic energetic headspace as opposed to the more depressant space of alcohol.

I've also used 2M2B and was noticeably sensitive to the more dissociative component of that too, but it also clearly felt like an alcohol-like depressant. Like alcohol, it's been shown to block NMDA receptors as well as stimulating GABA receptors. Using a small dosage with cannabis is actually quite fun for me, it feels like being tipsy except with slightly more dissociative visuals of a very simply variety like I might see small arrangements of gray blocks making patterns like something from nitrous oxide, and the headspace can feel slightly trippy in a similar way too when meditating or getting lost in thought. I don't use it much though because it's been hard for me to avoid its hangover effects afterward so far, which I don't like as much as alcohol.

Memantine is actually really cool, just too long-lived. I've used it several times now, and it's not the easiest to push deep on in a way that you might want to reach based on experience with other dissociatives, but it's not otherwise shallow in its effects. In a way that arylcyclohexylamines tend to remind me of tryptamine psychedelics, memantine tends to remind me somewhat more of phenethylamine psychedelics. When I manage to get visuals from it, in the way that dissociatives produce psychedelic visuals, they're highly geometric, colorful, textured, synesthetic, and generally pleasing in a satisfying way to experience on their own, and the visions tend to be rather human in nature but still sort of cartoony and trippy and can involve auditory components like hearing imaginary music. It is notably the most sexual dissociative for me, the bodily detachment and numbing are not very strong and it seems to have somewhat of a sexual push on its own for me. Overall to me it feels a lot like being on a long-lived, somewhat more LSD-like phenethylamine and being pretty drunk at the same time, it doesn't immobilize me like an anesthetic but I still spend a lot of time buckled over like "What the fuck have I done to myself again?" like I have with many strong trippy things. If someone made an analogue with highly similar effects and safety profile that lasted like four to eight hours, it would be great.

 

[Mjäll]

That sounds quite enjoyable and in line with a lot of the reports I've read about O-PCE. I actually had high hopes for it, but for whatever reason it just never clicked with me.


Interesting. There's definitely been times when I've had more than a couple drinks and I began recognizing elements that would typically be observed in a dissociative experience. Going in the other direction though, I'd never really stopped and considered the dissociative experience a replacement for alcohol. I guess looking back there's definitely been many times when I using dissociatives in a social setting essentially as an alcohol substitute. The problem with dissociatives is that they tend to dose-dependently impair your auditory processing, verbal communication, and non-verbal communication cues, with the end result being that they don't really facilitate interpersonal communication, which is sort of the primary purpose of alcohol, although I guess people use alcohol for many other purposes than just that.

Memantine is one I'd love to try just because it's pharmacology is so different than most dissociatives and I'd love to see how those differences affect the subjective experience, but yeah the long duration is a huge turn off.

Alcohol actually has affinity for NMDA receptor according to my lazy broscience googlings

Pretty cool and maybe why alcohol is a worthwhile drug unlike benzo's... One can dream

I just realize that last phrase could be interpreted in two ways, or even three if you count the nonsense bet

 

[Mjäll]

Alcohol and NMDA receptor: current research and future direction - PMC

The brain is one of the major targets of alcohol actions. Most of the excitatory synaptic transmission in the central nervous system is mediated by N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptors. However, one of the most devastating effects of alcohol leads ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Here is one study that seems to explain that chronic alcohol use results in upregulation of NMDA receptors and their functioning... Presumably because those receptors are antagonized by alcohol.

So maybe disso permatolerance is like one part of alcoholism, pharmacologically. I haven't seen much discussion on glutamate excitotoxicity and disso tolerance. Maybe just haven't looked.

 

[Mjäll]

More fun NMDA receptor stuff: Apparently activating the 5HT1A receptor (a common binding site for classic psychedelics) decreases the expression of NMDA receptor.

Fascinating really

There are many fun facts

 

[ecstacylover]

Memantine is actually really cool, just too long-lived. I've used it several times now, and it's not the easiest to push deep on in a way that you might want to reach based on experience with other dissociatives, but it's not otherwise shallow in its effects.

How much do you usually take?

Alcohol actually has affinity for NMDA receptor according to my lazy broscience googlings

Pretty cool and maybe why alcohol is a worthwhile drug unlike benzo's... One can dream

I just realize that last phrase could be interpreted in two ways, or even three if you count the nonsense bet

Reminds me of this pretty interesting report from a few years back: Alcohol Triggers Re-emergence of Ketamine-Like Experience in A Ketamine Ex-user

 

[Kaleida]

How much do you usually take?

I can get effects with as little as 20 mg but that's again with little dissociative tolerance. I've gone up to I want to say 100 mg, although I may not have gone above 75 mg.... Whatever was the highest dosage was pretty intense. I remember reading online years ago that 50 mg was fine for a newbie and that'd be a good and strong dosage for me, but I've read that with a high dissociative tolerance it might take significantly more. I know there's at least one trip report of a heavier user taking something like 300 mg and going to a museum, it's been years but I think that's what it was.

Reminds me of this pretty interesting report from a few years back: Alcohol Triggers Re-emergence of Ketamine-Like Experience in A Ketamine Ex-user

I remember this too, it's a good one.

 

[ecstacylover]

I can get effects with as little as 20 mg but that's again with little dissociative tolerance. I've gone up to I want to say 100 mg, although I may not have gone above 75 mg.... Whatever was the highest dosage was pretty intense. I remember reading online years ago that 50 mg was fine for a newbie and that'd be a good and strong dosage for me, but I've read that with a high dissociative tolerance it might take significantly more. I know there's at least one trip report of a heavier user taking something like 300 mg and going to a museum, it's been years but I think that's what it was.

Okay cool. I definitely would like to try it at some point, it's just not a priority.

 

[Kaleida]

 

[Cream Gravy?]

Dude, I've got that album on vinyl, original press, mint condition. I don't want to think about how much it would sell for in today's world, since vinyl became 'hip'. I looked up an OST from a favorite film and I couldn't find any presses for under $100, and it's an obscure, unpopular Polanski flick.