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Covid-19 The New Covid Megathread v.Oh-my-cron!

birdup said:
I'll read whatever numbers you provide. I've been having the same discussion with many people over the past year or so, including lots of people IRL and even some people on Facebook. So far, nobody has been able to explain to me why the vast majority of hospitalizations and deaths are among the unvaccinated in Australia when the vast majority of people are vaccinated.

There is a pattern in discussions with anti-vaxxers. I ask them something specific and they reply about something else entirely... or, at best, they zoom out and say something generic that totally avoids the question at hand.

There is too much data to casually examine and make uneducated offhand conclusions about efficacy. If we can jump from Sweden to NSW to Florida at a second's notice, the discussion will never end.

It's best to focus on a particular area.

This is what I propose: you choose an area and I'll choose one.

We can discuss numbers in the context of those two areas.

Krinkle challenged me on a US state a while back and I analysed the data and it was consistent with my perspective. If I fail to see a flaw in your argument and I acknowledge a flaw in my own, I will admit defeat.
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First off @birdup do you actually hear what I am saying? Before you run off and pick up some numbers that don't even relate to it, which is what pro vax people constantly do.

Canada. Covid deaths

- Deaths from covid-19 in care homes.

- Death outside of care homes from Covid -19 over 80

What's left?

- people who were already dying from other causes.

The final result.

So where ever you source those numbers from I don't care because they really can't falsify everything although the stats Canada thing I hope was some kind of reformatting the database or something, (ancient SQL lookups hidden under a pretty front page).

Worldmeters has numbers, and show the huge adjust that was done in July of 2020 where about 4000 early covid reports were just disappeared. It looked like in months 1 and 2 there were extra reported cases that never had results so it made it look like the plague was nearly 4× reality. Eventually the numbers got going but it did appear there was some falsification in early Canadian reporting if you look at world meter.

World meter says 30K deaths over the 2 years. Media everywhere in Canada have spoken to the over 50% of all deaths in Canada occuring in seniors homes.

So the only number I honestly can't just show you is the accurate count of death by age in Canada attributed to Covid-19. So look at this number where you would like as it will probably be either the same or worse because Canada has a lot of care homes due to a heavier social practice.

For me personally this now a very charged argument. The virus is the diversion we can argue all day, money, power, control these are what are at play. The human population has always been a shield in a war this is no different. We don't really know who is after exactly what but the population will suffer as poor decisions are being made.
 
Yourbaker said:
First off @birdup do you actually hear what I am saying? Before you run off and pick up some numbers that don't even relate to it, which is what pro vax people constantly do.

Canada. Covid deaths

- Deaths from covid-19 in care homes.

- Death outside of care homes from Covid -19 over 80

What's left?

- people who were already dying from other causes.

The final result.

So where ever you source those numbers from I don't care because they really can't falsify everything although the stats Canada thing I hope was some kind of reformatting the database or something, (ancient SQL lookups hidden under a pretty front page).

Worldmeters has numbers, and show the huge adjust that was done in July of 2020 where about 4000 early covid reports were just disappeared. It looked like in months 1 and 2 there were extra reported cases that never had results so it made it look like the plague was nearly 4× reality. Eventually the numbers got going but it did appear there was some falsification in early Canadian reporting if you look at world meter.

World meter says 30K deaths over the 2 years. Media everywhere in Canada have spoken to the over 50% of all deaths in Canada occuring in seniors homes.

So the only number I honestly can't just show you is the accurate count of death by age in Canada attributed to Covid-19. So look at this number where you would like as it will probably be either the same or worse because Canada has a lot of care homes due to a heavier social practice.

For me personally this now a very charged argument. The virus is the diversion we can argue all day, money, power, control these are what are at play. The human population has always been a shield in a war this is no different. We don't really know who is after exactly what but the population will suffer as poor decisions are being made.
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We may not know The Who exactly, but the what is the same as it’s been for millennias, money power and control………
 
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birdup said:
I'm not sure specifically what you want me to analyze about the Canadian data?
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You told me my data was wrong and where did I get it from...

You challenged the validity of my numbers...

Now you seem to have forgotten so I will ask you again where are the real numbers?
 
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@Yourbaker

I guess I wasn't specific enough about what data I was challenging.

It appears that at least 55% of the deaths in Canada actually occured in senior care homes.
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I wasn't challenging this^
I was challenging this:

the Vaccines appear to be below 50% against Delta
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I'm honestly not even sure what this means. Which vaccine? What does below 50% mean? Are you talking about reducing hospitalization rates or death rates or just case numbers. If it's the latter, why ignore the more relevant data (hospitalization/death)?

EDIT: as for most deaths occurring in aged care homes (or, generally, with elderly people)... I'm not sure what the point is? I don't want my grandmother to die.
 
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birdup said:
@Yourbaker

I guess I wasn't specific enough about what data I was challenging.



I wasn't challenging this^
I was challenging this:



I'm honestly not even sure what this means. Which vaccine? What does below 50% mean? Are you talking about reducing hospitalization rates or death rates or just case numbers. If it's the latter, why ignore the more relevant data (hospitalization/death)?

EDIT: as for most deaths occurring in aged care homes (or, generally, with elderly people)... I'm not sure what the point is? I don't want my grandmother to die.
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The vaccine manufacturers have released their own usefulness stats for the various names, I am only quoting them.

Go and see what Pfizer says about delta, I think they were honestly saying 39% themselves so when I say below 50% It is generous.

Again my numbers are the numbers the pro vaxers are using and creating so you are arguing what again?

Edit: Just to stay on course, the issue is arm bands to identify the santified and separate out those who didn't drink the kool-aid though actual restrictions in society and economic sanctions. Despite natural immunity. Forced populations of millions injecting a rushed best guess that is neither needed or useful while shutting down thousands of small businesses and bankrupting huge portions of humaity
 
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I thought this was interesting, helping to explain why Covid may be particularly challenging to elderly people:

gHbDGHJ.png
 
This bit of pre-print work is also interesting, implying that even though Omicron appears to be much more infectious than the original virus and later variants, it may be quite a bit less harmful to cells deep within the lungs, which has been the cause of much of the virus' severity, to date.

1Jx2wLF.png
 
www.bloombergquint.com

J&J Shot Loses Antibody Protection Against Omicron in Study

Johnson & Johnson’s vaccine produces virtually no antibody protection against the omicron variant in a laboratory experiment.
www.bloombergquint.com www.bloombergquint.com

“Omicron does indeed exhibit substantial immune escape from antibodies,” she said. “The situation, I think, is even more alarming for the J&J vaccine -- there was no detectable neutralization in our assay.”


so you get 0% protection from J&J (true story)
 
@birdup

Because I'm doing nothing and going nowhere (we have roads to Costco so good enough), I've taken some time to try to understand what they are actually saying. I realized it was their number and it may mean something very obtuse to common thinking.

Because the vaccine is designed as a near miss to the virus our body creates antibodies in a range that some will work well against the vaccine and some will work well against the virus, if we don't encounter the actual virus or have this process replicated in a reasonable period of time these antibodies and their production may slow or stop as the bodies perceived threat has passed. It makes sense that if the virus mutates your immunity from the vaccine is less likely depending on how far from the near miss the virus mutated.

These vaccines create an artificial threat to your body, it makes a range of antibodies that flood your system and fight the threat, when the threat repeats (second shot) your body triggers a repeat performance and the idea is your body will now keep the best or most successful set of antibodies around as this invasion is common.

The percentage is apparently the average % of antibodies being produced in each vaccine recipient by the human immune system that are effective against each variation of the virus. Kind of not meaningful at all to the public.

However omicron is about 0%.

Found a series of web cast videos done by Neil deGrasse Tyson he interviews his high school valditorian who happens to be in the field very specifically and it actually does a reasonable job of explaining where we are. I like suggesting him because he speaks about complex scientific concepts in very simple language.

My opinion of any expert falls when they attempt to be spokes people for their area of expertise but still require you get a diploma to follow them, it is so easy to be understandable. When your job is to be understood by people outside your field you should be an expert in communication and passing out knowledge. When that is apparently not happening as in the case of Covid the vacume of correct information has been filled by rumour and conspiracy.

My big question has always been why are we doing the wrong things and why am I being forced to do something against my will that I specifically don't need and will not do me any good or any good for anyone else around me. Remember my elderly were killed of in the senior care home murders already and elderly should be getting regular vaccines probably 75+.
 
and when a vaccine is working at 0% and it can cause health problems, it sounds like that's when they decide to un-recommend it

but it's still better than no vaccine at all :)
 
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Cases in NSW have been low for months because of the high vaccination rate. Now, they have increased 600-700% overnight due to an outbreak of Omicron which appears to be pretty vax-resistant. I don't know. I haven't looked closely at the data. Hopefully the new cases are among the vaccinated. I can't go through all of this again.

Australia - at 90+% vax rate - now has the highest case numbers we have ever seen. Maybe this is because we're not locked down anymore and nobody wears masks, etc. I don't know. I'm fucking tired of this virus.
 
@-=SS=-

Absolutely!! It's all so inverted.
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Probably even more so than you think.

During the lockdown, I was doing community access with disabled people. They didn't have to wear masks and many of the other rules didn't apply to them either. Most residents in the houses I worked with were allowed to travel outside of their 5km radius without a mask.

These are the vulnerable people!

The vulnerable people should stay at home.

The vulnerable people should wear masks.

It's all fucking ass-backwards.
 
birdup said:
@Yourbaker

data?
source?

Let's examine the data.

I can prove to you that it is much more effective than 50%



News - COVID-19 vaccination highly effective during Delta outbreak in NSW

www.health.nsw.gov.au www.health.nsw.gov.au

95% of the state is vaccinated.
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Yeah again you are not looking at anything I was talking about.

Covid deaths Canada don't care how many monkey jabs they have or not.

The effective data is Pfizers own data on their own vaccine at 39% not my random number that I picked out of the air saying below 50% so it is well below.

I gave you all my sources and you wandered off to talk about double vaccinated death in melbourne.

Deaths over 80 in Canada and care home deaths amount to almost 90% of the deaths to Covid over 2 years. That leaves 3000 over 2 years from covid not in nursing homes not already dying and not over 80.

1500/year nationwide... we have probably lost 50 thousand small businesses and the economic inability to recover will result in worse death tolls among the healthy.

Edit:

Again lets stay focused, no need for armbands, no need to totalitarian crack downs. The jabs own effective data can be found of their own web sites so you can go there and shock your self.
 
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You can either back up this 50% delta thing or you can't.

I've already clearly demonstrated how it is wrong.

You have provided no links and no data.
 
So there's this hysterical push for everyone to get this disgusting injection thingy, and those who suffers adverse reactions are shunned as anti-vaxxer lunatics. Even when presenting at Hospitals with Pericarditis after vaccination, they're told it's 'nothing'...and "you're having a psychotic episode".

 
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