Quitting phenibut journal

negrogesic

negrogesic

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Messages
12,554
Location
Negronesia
I'm trying to figure out how to get off of this stuff.

4 grams every night, for the past 6 years. Actually I'm "down" to 4g/night (from higher doses).

I don't get any especially enjoyable effects for it nor have I ever really. Occasionally i'll get some nice music enhancing mania but its pretty rare. I only resorted to phenibut after taking 900mg/day of pregabalin for a few years, then tapering down, switching to gabapentin, then stopping. I was fine during the day but couldnt sleep for months (an hour or two, maximum, per night for around 90 days and I couldn't take it any longer). I've been taking phenibut ever since.

Granted given my past as a notorious drug addict, this is by comparison, quite sober by my standards. Still this phenibut feels like its sucking the ambition out of me. Pregabalin was even worse in that regard, it puts you in this nihilistic mindset.

I need to get more serious about getting off this shit, every time I try to taper I get hit with some heavy anxiety, thinking about switching to f- phenibut or baclofen. I'm sure getting off this shit would be life changing. I feel like I'm living in a perpetual phenibut hangover. Recently I had forgotten I had taken my nightly 4g of phenibut and took another 4g, for a total of 8g. The next day I felt so gross and sedated, also very nauseated and irritable. I was incapacitated. I realized, "shit, I'm feeling half this awful everyday". It's also extemely acidic and appears to messing with my GI tract, and possibly liver and kidneys, although recent bloodwork showed normal values, aside from slightly elevated albumin levels. Yet, I am constantly, unusually thirsty and have various suspicious abdominal pains. I need an ultrasound and MRI. My moderate but extremely consistent (nightly) alcohol use likely exacerbates the issue.

I need to give tapering this stuff a more serious try. I mean I tapered off 380mg/day methadone to 0mg so this shouldn't be a problem?

Tonight was:

Phenibut: 3,976mg
Alcohol: not over yet, but probably "7 drinks" (via a mixture of wine and beer)
 
BenzoBrain^^ said:
I recently read a thread of yours from 2005 where you were taking a very large amount of Diazepam. How did that turn out?

I like how you're still an active poster after struggling with GABA drugs for so many years. Shows a lot of strength and determination. I highly doubt you'll have too many problems with the taper. You know what to expect.
Click to expand...

It did not turn out too well. I tapered down with the help of a doctor but i when i finally jumped off, probably at too high of a dose, i experienced severe withdrawal and intense psychosis for around 18 months. Experiencing psychosis like that leaves a permanent impression on a person (psychologically and physiologically), those intense fear states are unforgettable. I was convinced that i was afflicted by some sort of parasite of indeterminate origin. It was horrifying. I remember wearing multiple layer of gloves on my hands and even feet; i took a shit and it appeared as if some sort of biting flies flew out and attacked me. Due to the non linear progression of benzo withdrawal (one week you feel like you're getting better then the next week its worse) it feels like it never really ends. Eventually i got better and was off them for years. But in 2010 I developed another benzo habit, not quite as bad, but still quite bad technically. The doses were high, but not as obscene. Quit that in 2012 and have been off benzos since, using them rarely. However it was then that i switched to pregabalin and later gabapentin.

Of course phenibut/gabapentinoids withdrawal isn't quite as bad benzos, being more of a physical anxiety than the mental hell that benzo withdrawal produces but the insomnia from gabapentinoid withdrawal is a bit worse than benzo withdrawal. During benzo withdrawal you can force some horrible low quality sleep, but with gabapentinoid withdrawal you are wide awake. As a natural insomniac this can be very challenging.

Need to get off this stuff though, life is too short to spend it in some phenibut daze. Its been 6 years already. I have sort of minimized it as not a big deal given the scale of my past but it is a big deal.
 
All I can say bro is to dose as much as it will take to stabilize at least two weeks.
At the current dose; can ya go without a "fix"... like skip a day, without too much issues?
Most of what I can offer is both parroting and from personal experience and obviously you would have the upper hand on the latter.
It is my opinion that xorkoth (if the time allows) would be the better to advise on this particular subject matter.

Def gonna watch as the info that comes outta this is gonna be priceless.
 
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Phenibut: 3,968mg (down 4mg).

Felt awful today, woke up with some bizarre hangover, neck pain following some awful sleep. Cant be related to the phenibut (then again everything is). Had an unquenchable thirst satisfied by no amount of water. Have had this happen before.
 
3,967mg (down 1mg, frankly would have gone down more but didn't remember my previous nights dose). I should check here first.

I realized one of my scales isn't working quite right. It said 3,967mg but i checked with another scale and it was 3,942mg
 
3,964mg (down 2mg)

This is gonna take forever at this rate 🤣 gonna have to kick it up a notch

*I meant down 3mg
 
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I for one am thankful that you did start this as there will come a time for me... it always does regardless of whatever it may be.
Love ya bruh
 
negrogesic said:
How much?
Click to expand...
1-1.5g every coupla days (I know that doesnt sound like much). Hope I can keep it there (been 3 years now? damn). For the longest I would dose 1.5g every third day. Used it to help get off a major alprazolam habit. It kinda helped but still had to endure the hell(s) of sudden cessation of high dose benzo abuse. If I would have know then.... Hindsight shit. Shoulda tapered down but didn't know shit about that til I came on BL.
 
3,962mg down 2mg.

My two scales seem to be disagreeing with each other. I wonder if i could make a solution of phenibut, but that would be hard to dose given the # or milligrams involved here.

Still i have yet to wake up with my skin burning in a panic attack. I once dropped my scale and didn't release it was off by 40%. It took me like 9 days to realize why i was so horribly anxious. I bought ashwagandha and all kinds of anxiety remedies not knowing why i was so anxious then boom i realized shit im in phenibut withdrawal, this scale is way wrong. Odd that i didn't notice the 40% reduction in volume.
 
damn dude talk about a quick taper. 40%.
sounds very cliche-ish (and is) but any movement forward is ro be congratulated. it feels better than not moving ahead.
so congrats.
fuck man i still got the 40 pcnt stuck in my head. damn
 
3,959mg (down 3mg)

Starting to have sleeping issues though who knows what its from exactly.

I wonder if there are absorption differences (based on food content the stomach at the time of taking it or say the presence of antacid, which i took yesterday) which impacts how much winds up in the blood stream. I try to eat one hour before taking it.

All the acid in 4g of phenibut hydrochloride can't be great for my stomach, which is pretty fucked up from NSAIDs and a generally stressed stomach. Ive tested the phenibut and water solution with pH paper and it instantly turns bright red. Ive tried the phenibut free amino acid but it doesn't work as well.

Perhaps i should switch to baclofen or even f-phenibut (which is very similar to baclofen, only difference being a fluorine in place of the chlorine).
 
negrogesic said:
I wonder if there are absorption differences (based on food content the stomach at the time of taking it
Click to expand...
I do believe there is a correlation but haven't pin pointed it yet.
I eat a few saltines in the am with water before dosing and that seems to help ease the acidity of the hcl, ime. I never noticed a difference between eating vs not eating in regards to time of onset. No-meal, half-meal, full-meal or just the crackers.
However... it used to hit me in 5 hours like clockwork (at the with/without food thing mentioned above) for a coupla years and then the last year or so it seems to take at least 10 hrs to peak. Is this not a weird ass drug? lol
My diet habits do not change that much to make this difference, imo. But like gabapentin... maybe stay away from the antacids and/or magnesium rich foods when dosing? I mean it is considered a gabapetinoid, no? I get a little confused on this drugs classification.
A quote from a random sarch fwiw:
"Avoid taking aluminum or magnesium containing products (such as antacids) for 2 hours before your gabapentin."
 
6am-64-14m said:
I do believe there is a correlation but haven't pin pointed it yet.
I eat a few saltines in the am with water before dosing and that seems to help ease the acidity of the hcl, ime. I never noticed a difference between eating vs not eating in regards to time of onset. No-meal, half-meal, full-meal or just the crackers.
However... it used to hit me in 5 hours like clockwork (at the with/without food thing mentioned above) for a coupla years and then the last year or so it seems to take at least 10 hrs to peak. Is this not a weird ass drug? lol
My diet habits do not change that much to make this difference, imo. But like gabapentin... maybe stay away from the antacids and/or magnesium rich foods when dosing? I mean it is considered a gabapetinoid, no? I get a little confused on this drugs classification.
A quote from a random sarch fwiw:
"Avoid taking aluminum or magnesium containing products (such as antacids) for 2 hours before your gabapentin."
Click to expand...

Interesting, i never heard about aluminum/magnesium and gabapentin interaction. Yeah phenibut is definitely a gabapentinoid.

Whats strange is that i don't really feel the 4g of phenibut after i take at any point, i take all 4g around 8pm and sometimes i get a little manic with music at 12am or 1am and start playing the piano but other than that not much. What i do notice however is when i take less, which results in extreme difficulty sleeping and anxiety. Get this weird skin burning thing too. The physical anxiety is worse than the mental anxiety, which is sort of the reverse of benzo withdrawal. The mental terror/anxiety of benzo withdrawal is many multiples worse than phenibut withdrawal, but phenibut has perhaps more severe physical anxiety.

What's weird is that while i dont notice much of an effect from the 4g, yet if i were to take say just 1g during the day I feel it pretty strongly within 1.5-2 hours. It feels stronger than the 4g's.

Maybe i should split my dose and take half in the morning and half at night.
 
I will add that if i take too much i just feel like passing out with none of the euphoria at all. At this time that qould be like 2+gs. Under that I get full effects given time - less than 2Gs and closer 1 1/2 - 1 3/4Gs..
I am liking the statement that benzo is a "worse" wd as i havent had to get off phenibut yet and at the current regimen prolly wouldnt be too rough. I did drop it about a year and a half ago for about a month (prolly money issues) but I know this aint about benzos. Just sayin that I do not believe anything is worse than reg benzo usage wd... and wd-ing used to be my forte. Ignorance was not bliss on this one.
Could there be other meds involved with this? Just curious as as pointed out one can take less in the daytime and "feel" the effect more pronounced (are ya in public? ) and at night more does less (not in public? ). Any meds taken in the day or eve dosages that may have a positive or negative "influence" on the efficacy?
Hate to bother ya on this but I love to figure shit out since a child and still that snotty nosed little ragamuffin at almost 55. 😁
 
3,952mg (down 4mg), its going ok 👌

Would like to get to a point where im doing some bigger numbers, like going down 10mg/day we'll see.

One problem is that I have a dextroamphetamine prescription, which has some sort of GABA-B antagonistic (or rather anti-baclofen) properties. With baclofen being simply chlorophenibut, the combination is going to make this a bit harder for me.
 
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