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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

Suboxone to Hydrocodone - W/D?

J

JagrPens

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 27, 2019
Messages
32
Hello all! I decided to get on suboxone (8/2) five weeks ago after a bit of a struggle to end the cravings for oxycodone/hydrocodone. It worked quite well for three-4 weeks and then I've been feeling terrible, stressed, etc. I know that I did not want to be on this for long at all. Long story short, I can't make my appointment today to the clinic and I haven't heard back from them about a telemed but they are only open one day of the week due to Covid. So, after this morning's dose, I will go home to being out of the subs. I have a handful of 7.5/325 hydrocodone. Will I go into withdrawal? When can I take a pill? I know nothing about suboxone and I did take my first sub like 7-8 hours after my last 30mg dose of hydrocodone and never got precipitated w/d or anything. Any thoughts? All I was told was that if I took an opiate while the sub was in my system that I would get sick and it wouldn't have any effect anyway.

Thanks so much.
 
I'm on buprenorphine patches and I'd need about three days before it was out of my system, but whenever that has happened I don't wait three days, I wait until I'm sick. When I really feel bad, that's when I'll take a full agonist.

I'm told if I take it before then, it'll be precipitated wd.
 
Hi @JagrPens :)

This is the best answer for the type of question you are asking:
papercuts said:
I wait until I'm sick. When I really feel bad, that's when I'll take a full agonist.
Click to expand...

This is not true:
papercuts said:
I'm told if I take it before then, it'll be precipitated wd.
Click to expand...

It works the other way around - buprenorphine is a partial agonist but has a very high affinity for opioid receptors. You can think it in the analogy that it is a very fast vibrating ball that is hitting from floor to ceiling so fast that other, slower balls cant get a chance to hit the same spot. Or like a fan that is spinning so fast that other stuff cant go through until the fan stops revolving. Hope I am coherent enough.

Anyways, taking a full agonist on top of buprenorphine will not make you go into precipitated withdrawal because a full agonist can only make opioid effects stronger. Wait till you are feeling some kind of withdrawal and then take one hydrocodone. And just to add that buprenorphine is a very potent opioid up until one point (partial agonist) and its full effects are most certainly stronger than 30mg of hydrocodone. That is the reason why you didn't feel any withdrawal when you took 8mg Suboxone 7-8 hours after 30mg of hydrocodone. But be careful with it in the future, if your tolerance goes up, because precipitated withdrawal is not fun stuff. It's like stripping off a band-aid and are thrown in full on acute opioid withdrawal - just the pain doesn't go away for 24 hours.

Enough with the metaphors, I hope you got the picture. Take care and stay around if you want to learn and have support. this is a pretty awesome community. :)
 
Psycho_Logic said:
Hi @JagrPens :)

This is the best answer for the type of question you are asking:


This is not true:


It works the other way around - buprenorphine is a partial agonist but has a very high affinity for opioid receptors. You can think it in the analogy that it is a very fast vibrating ball that is hitting from floor to ceiling so fast that other, slower balls cant get a chance to hit the same spot. Or like a fan that is spinning so fast that other stuff cant go through until the fan stops revolving. Hope I am coherent enough.

Anyways, taking a full agonist on top of buprenorphine will not make you go into precipitated withdrawal because a full agonist can only make opioid effects stronger. Wait till you are feeling some kind of withdrawal and then take one hydrocodone. And just to add that buprenorphine is a very potent opioid up until one point (partial agonist) and its full effects are most certainly stronger than 30mg of hydrocodone. That is the reason why you didn't feel any withdrawal when you took 8mg Suboxone 7-8 hours after 30mg of hydrocodone. But be careful with it in the future, if your tolerance goes up, because precipitated withdrawal is not fun stuff. It's like stripping off a band-aid and are thrown in full on acute opioid withdrawal - just the pain doesn't go away for 24 hours.

Enough with the metaphors, I hope you got the picture. Take care and stay around if you want to learn and have support. this is a pretty awesome community. :)
Click to expand...
Hi! @Psycho_Logic
Thanks for your explanation! I don’t understand how I’ve heard some people switch back and forth and use suboxone just to get through any dry period without withdrawals. Being now well over 24 hours since my sub what would i take to feel something? I took 2 Vicodin 7.5 this morning. Nothing. But obviously my tolerance from a month ago was at the 30mg oxycodone level. I’m just curious i suppose! Anyways thanks.
 
JagrPens said:
Being now well over 24 hours since my sub what would i take to feel something?
Click to expand...

If you were taking 8mg Suboxone every day don't count on anything until you start feeling withdrawals. You are wasting your pills. You will have to wait 3-4 days and expect that your tolerance is higher than it was before going on Suboxone (if you were taking 30-60 milligrams of oxycodone daily). You will have to wait this one out and see how do you respond to oxycodone/hydrocodone. Please proceed carefully as you don't know your tolerance at the moment.

JagrPens said:
I don’t understand how I’ve heard some people switch back and forth and use suboxone just to get through any dry period without withdrawals
Click to expand...
That can be done but it is not advisable. It goes like this: short-acting opioid -> withdrawal starts -> take buprenorphine -> take buprenorphine until you get short-acting opioid -> stop taking buprenorphine when you have short-acting opioid again -> start taking SAO when opioid withdrawal is felt.

I am not advising this "bridging" but that's the way people use buprenorphine for "dry periods". Important thing is that you are in withdrawal when taking buprenorphine and are not taking methadone or fentanyl as they linger in the body for a long time. Methadone has a long half-life and accumulates in the body, and I think that situation with fentanyl is tricky cause it is deposited in your body much longer than it is active. Something about fentanyl being lipophilic (dissolves in the fat very well). Or it is plain high tolerance with fentanyl in the mix. I am really not sure but I have heard people have a very problematic time when trying to transfer to buprenorphine if they had fentanyl habit.


I don't know your situation and I am giving a general opinion and something I know from experience. I never used fentanyl or heroin so I can speak about it only theoretically. All these explanations are how I understand the subject matter, but I am not a doctor and can't give you any medical advice. Just suggestions from a harm-reduction point of view.

Inform us about your progress or if you have any other questions. There are plenty of people here that are more knowledgeable about this kind of stuff than I am.
 
Thank you again! My usage was 90 mg daily oxycodone In 3 doses. I had quit when that was my high tolerance and didn’t feel much effect. I can’t say that I’ve ever had withdrawal physically only psychologically such as anxiety and cravings but i have a ton of anxiety in general. I’ve heard that suboxone really is harder to get off of in the long run. I also can’t fully get off of xanax as I’ve always needed it for true panic attacks which i started having the last week due to really crazy bad life stuff going on. Was hoping to try 3-4 hydros just to see for once that’s all.
 
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